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Should I be folding here?

JoshlarrJoshlarr
edited March 2013 in The Poker Clinic
Just played this hand on the 2p/4p tables

I think I played it well until the turn

Following the 6 bigs bet pre-flop and the check on the flop, should I have noticed the straight?

I know personally I wouldn't be calling 6 bigs with such a hand pre-flop
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
Player 1Small blind £0.02£0.02£0.96
Player 2Big blind £0.04£0.06£1.64
 Your hole cards
  • K
  • K
   
Player 3Call £0.04£0.10£2.15
Player 4Call £0.04£0.14£2.48
JoshlarrRaise £0.24£0.38£3.98
Player 5Fold    
Player 1Fold    
Player 2Call £0.20£0.58£1.44
Player 3Fold    
Player 4Call £0.20£0.78£2.28
Flop
  
  • 4
  • 2
  • 5
   
Player 3Check    
Player 4Check    
JoshlarrBet £0.25£1.03£3.73
Player 2Call £0.25£1.28£1.19
Player 4Call £0.25£1.53£2.03
Turn
  
  • 7
   
Player 2Bet £0.04£1.57£1.15
Player 4Raise £1.65£3.22£0.38
JoshlarrAll-in £3.73£6.95£0.00
Player 2Fold    
Player 4All-in £0.38£7.33£0.00
JoshlarrUnmatched bet £1.70£5.63£1.70
Player 4Show
  • 6
  • 8
   
JoshlarrShow
  • K
  • K
   
River
  
  • 8
   
Player 4WinStraight to the 8£5.20 £5.20
There's probably going to be loads of other things pointed out but that's good, I need to improve my game!
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Comments

  • SHANXTASHANXTA
    edited February 2013

    why are you only betting 25p on the flop?
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  • JoshlarrJoshlarr
    edited February 2013
    In Response to Re: Should I be folding here?:
    why are you only betting 25p on the flop?
    Posted by SHANXTA
    Yeah, looking back that bet should have been a little stronger.

    I guess I just saw myself as really strong and thought I should bet for value. After the pre-flop bet I never really thought about people having the cards for a straight
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  • BorinLonerBorinLoner
    edited February 2013
    In Response to Re: Should I be folding here?:
    In Response to Re: Should I be folding here? : Yeah, looking back that bet should have been a little stronger. I guess I just saw myself as really strong and thought I should bet for value. After the pre-flop bet I never really thought about people having the cards for a straight
    Posted by Joshlarr
    Why do we think a value bet has to be small? I think your flop bet is far too small. It should be around the same amount you'd bet with a bluff, usually between 2/3 and 3/4 pot. If they have something they'll call that almost as often as they'll call a small bet and it gains us a tremendous amount more value.

    Also, the problem with betting less than 1/3 of the pot is that it gives our opponents better than 4:1 on the call, which means they will be calling profitably with any draw. In fact, when we offer them these sort of odds, we effectively pay them to outdraw us, rather than charge them to do so.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited March 2013
    Yeah the flop bet should be more like 50p imo. You'll still get called by all overpairs to the board, most people that have paired with the board and @ this level almost definitely by people with Ax for the gutshot.

    I actually think the turn is fine as played.
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  • rancidrancid
    edited March 2013
    basic nl4 of cal,call,call, GO MENTAL - means your beat )

    oppo would go mental on flop if held overpair, why is oppo going mental on turn - 67/A7

    hardest thing to do in poker is fold

    ......
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  • FlashFlushFlashFlush
    edited March 2013
    Like others have said, a bet around 50p on the flop would have been better.

    Considering the oppo limped then called 6x pre with 6,8 I wouldn't expect them to fold their gutshot for 50p but at least if he missed you would of got more value out of them than only betting 25p.

    Don't think you can really fold here at 4nl with no reads. 
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  • JoshlarrJoshlarr
    edited March 2013
    Okay, thanks a lot for the help guys!

    It's good to hear that others would have found it hard to fold on the turn but rancid has made a good point about the call, call, call, go mental. I guess at this level most of the time it's going to be someone that's made a decent hand and not someone trying to take down the pot.

    I've definitely learn a lesson from the bet sizing on the flop, 25p is really poor and following a similar bet pre - most are going to be calling, as they did. I think my bet sizing is improving overall though, there's just some flaws every now and again!

    Cheers!
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  • percival09percival09
    edited March 2013
    lol when people say bet 50p, do u know the reasons for it or are we just thinking "we should bet biggaaaa", we need to think of villains range and how much value we can get from that range, so with this in mind we can bet more than 50, we can almost make it a psb (pot sized bet), we wanna extract max value and leave no money on the table. no pair or draw is folding on this flop whether we make a psb or not

    we should always be evaluating our 1 pair hands on later streets when there's action before us. fish love to call, and when they raise they generally have it. Hard to fold here but I think it's correct
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