Overkill?

LARSON7

This hand here, on the turn i only have a pot sized bet behind and a redraw to the nuts.

So. was quite happy getting it in here, as is, AQ will be the best hand here a lot of the time.

I think i played the hand ok, but just wondering about my bet sizing, to much?

toddy23	Small blind		£0.02	£0.02	£4.26
suggs69	Big blind		£0.04	£0.06	£3.16
	Your hole cards	A Q
waller02	Fold
TONTOB	Fold
LARSON7	Raise		£0.16	£0.22	£2.85
x	Call		£0.16	£0.38	£2.94
toddy23	Call		£0.14	£0.52	£4.12
suggs69	Fold
Flop
		Q 9 6
toddy23	Bet		£0.08	£0.60	£4.04
LARSON7	Raise		£0.76	£1.36	£2.09
x	Call		£0.76	£2.12	£2.18
toddy23	Fold
Turn
		K
LARSON7	All-in		£2.09	£4.21	£0.00
x	All-in		£2.18	£6.39	£0.00
x	Unmatched bet		£0.09	£6.30	£0.09
LARSON7	Show	A Q
x	Show	6 6
River
		4
x	Win	Three 6s	£5.82

Lambert180

Flop is probably a tad too big.

Turn is too big, and you make it very hard to get called by worse. You say you'll be ahead a lot but you won't be when you get called. Obv any Kx is ahead, what AQ is splitting (I know we're freerolling the FD tho), KQ is ahead of us, so we have to be confidence he's gonna be happy stacking off after a big flop c/r and a pot sized shove on the turn with just QJ/QT and even then, his range is alot more than just Qx hands.

You might make him fold 2 random diamonds, when I'd rather make him call a bet with 2 diamonds.

hhyftrftdr

When he flats that huge flop raise, he has to be very strong; 66, 99 or possibly J10 diamonds. Then the one feasible hand we are beating on the flop (KQ) has gone ahead on the turn.

Smaller raise on flop, something like 25/30p. Don't mind checking to him on turn, let him set the price and decide from there. Might even give you a free card if he is playing very cute.

percival09

Played it so perfectly

CraigSG1

Pre: Fine

Post: Why raise so much? Your keeping in all hands that beat you and folding out 99% hands you beat. By all means raise and charge the flush and straight draws but just be aware on later streets. You have a very vulnerable hand so why put so much in when your equity in the pot could be very small or even behind.

Turn: Open jamming is bad for same reason as flop. The board just got worse, your Q is no longer top pair, you've moved behind to a straight and the only other Q you was realistically beating. Yes you've picked up the nut FD but that should be used to try and get there. He cant put you on a running flush the way hand has played so if it comes it wont really effect the river in you getting paid. Your not going away so check calling a shove is ok as he can then have a wider range, as said before what can you beat that will call the shove? 

Playing a one pair hand on this board for your whole stack? Im guessing you felt you was behind but got stubborn, especially when the turn hit. IMO the turn was your perfect chance to pot control and would have been easier to do so if your flop raise had been less. 

GELDY

on the flop you want to be charging the draws - not scaring them off

40p would have been more appropriate

and make it cheaper to maitain an aggro line on the turn

but as played - having closed down the villains range so much with the flop bet

not so confident the shove is +ev

unknown_username

Love it.

Betsizing needs to be big at NL4. You get called by worse hands loads.

Nothing wrong with this at all and that's from a player who has built a BR of £1000 at low levels. This is how you get paid. Unlucky.

LARSON7

In Response to Re: Overkill?:

on the flop you want to be charging the draws - not scaring them off 40p would have been more appropriate and make it cheaper to maitain an aggro line on the turn but as played - having closed down the villains range so much with the flop bet not so confident the shove is +ev
Posted by GELDY

Thanks for all the replies.

At 4nl people will call that price on a draw every day of the week.

The range here is a lot wider than some people believe. On the flop, it could be Q x hands, a lot of people at this level will go with top pair whatever kicker hands. You would be amazed. It could also be a flush draw (easily). I agree that the betting is 2 big.

On the turn the King does not change much at all, except it gives me more outs. The only possible hand the King would change is KQ. If it wasn't a flush card on the turn i was always shoving in this spot, i only had a pot sized bet behind. Tho, you are right the betting was overly agressive.

I hadn't any reads on the opponent, but a good amount of the time this hand will still be good.

BorinLoner

I think there's a fair amount of results oriented thinking in this thread.

If you were on the draw yourself, would you raise this flop small? If you had top-set, would you raise this wet flop small?

People seem to be suggesting that the only hands that call this raise on the flop are nutted hands. Why? If one of these players has seen the flop with KQ, QJ, QT, JT, 78, two diamonds, possibly some 9x or weaker Qx hands, do you think they're ever just folding?

I'd be raising to around 50p-60p if I think that either of these players might want to semi-bluff with a draw. Otherwise I'm assuming that I'm being called by far more hands that I'm beating than the few hands that beat me (99, 66, 96, Q9), so I'd bet enough to be able to move it all-in on the turn (because of the short stacks)... Just as Larson did here.

Whether you still want to shove when the turn's a King is another question. Your plan has to be adapted when the turn card changes the texture of the board but I do agree there shouldn't be many Kx hands in your opponent's calling range on the flop... The problem is that he might not stack off with worse now that the King has arrived.

Larson, pull-up for the maximum. You want to have the biggest stack at the table covered unless you think they have some sort of edge on you.

waller02

I have been playing a fair bit of 4nl recently and I have no problem with the flop raise, I go for around 60p but makes no real difference. People WILL def be calling with worse from my experience.

Turn......this could be wrong, but I prob c/c

GELDY

In Response to Re: Overkill?:

In Response to Re: Overkill? : Thanks for all the replies. At 4nl people will call that price on a draw every day of the week. 
Posted by LARSON7

Thanks - not being a 4nl player I was only talking generalities - guess I should stick to stuff I know