Is this a leak?

Batkin88

My opinion is if he had it why would he not b-bet the flop? The flush.str8 and loads or 2 pr combo's come in but as soon as he doesn't c-bet into that wet of a board I put him on non club overs.

When the turn comes down I put him still on overs but likely a big club aswell.

When the river comes I couldn't find a reason to fold considering what I put him on, is this a leak defining a range from basically one move on the flop?

Also I was advised calling 89cc out of the SB here is terrible I have never had any feedback like this before, I could understand if we where 20 bigs deep but what are your thoughts?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
Batkin88	Small blind		£0.25	£0.25	£180.62
Rickyyyy	Big blind		£0.50	£0.75	£135.34
	Your hole cards	9 8
rupert1969	Fold
mrdavies	Raise		£2.00	£2.75	£38.04
castatray	Fold
raychurc23	Call		£2.00	£4.75	£118.13
Batkin88	Call		£1.75	£6.50	£178.87
Rickyyyy	Fold
Flop
		4 8 7
Batkin88	Check
mrdavies	Check
raychurc23	Check
Turn
		3
Batkin88	Check
mrdavies	Bet		£3.50	£10.00	£34.54
raychurc23	Fold
Batkin88	Call		£3.50	£13.50	£175.37
River
		6
Batkin88	Check
mrdavies	Bet		£10.00	£23.50	£24.54
Batkin88	Call

IDONKCALLU

i dnt mind your line but id donk lead the river like a blocker bet instaead of putting yaself in a trick decision id bet around £6 as a block bet 

gracie24

Looks like he raised with AA, KK, QQ or AK and with exception of AK he is ahead. The check on the flop would indicate that it is AKs in clubs and he has the nut flush and is frightened of scaring you off with a bigger raise. However, some would go 4bb with lesser hand but may still have 3 4s, 8s or 7s.

rancid

In Response to Re: Is this a leak?:

i dnt mind your line but id donk lead the river like a blocker bet instaead of putting yaself in a trick decision id bet around £6 as a block bet 
Posted by IDONKCALLU

what are you blocking against - a bluff ?

Batkin88

In Response to Re: Is this a leak?:

Looks like he raised with AA, KK, QQ or AK and with exception of AK he is ahead. The check on the flop would indicate that it is AKs in clubs and he has the nut flush and is frightened of scaring you off with a bigger raise. However, some would go 4bb with lesser hand but may still have 3 4s, 8s or 7s.
Posted by gracie24

That's pretty precise to put him on one of them 4 hands and then the check to put him on AKcc, what stops him have JT off here then check cz he missed?

grantorino

Not in love with pre oop, reads would be nice. Villains ranges important

I'm not sure on river, prob call

F_Ivanovic

Not everyone follows the same thought process; so whilst it does seem bad to be checking the flop with anything good, that doesn't mean he hasn't. He might have expected a bet off raychurc23, which didn't happen. OTT a call seems fine but once the river comes I'm folding here without a good read. His line doesn't make huge sense but at the same time not many players will take this line as a complete bluff.

As far as pre-flop goes; calling here is definitely not terrible, it's just going to be high variance and you need to be confident in playing OOP. If you're up against bad players it's more than fine. If BTN is bad calling becomes better because you are deep vs him and could get a nice payout. But for straight up implied odds against the opener, it's probably not good since they're not that deep and you'll end up in situations like this a bit where you flop a pair and end up paying him off because of his weird line.

IDONKCALLU

rancid id rather do a block bet for a small amount then  have a tricky decision of calling of bigger amount 

with a block bet if u get raised ya know u are beat unless the opponent is clued on and know ya bet is a blocker bet an raise with air 

rancid

In Response to Re: Is this a leak?:

rancid id rather do a block bet for a small amount then  have a tricky decision of calling of bigger amount  with a block bet if u get raised ya know u are beat unless the opponent is clued on and know ya bet is a blocker bet an raise with air 
Posted by IDONKCALLU

So you think villian might have a better hand so your betting because you only want to call a certain amount
So we gonna block bluffs and worse unless you think worse is gonna call
With a showdown hand a blocker bet seems like very backward logic where most of the time your called by better or raised by worse.
You give no room for villian to bet missed draws/air/worse.

Blocker bets are the sole reason why we raise donk bets

Blocker bets are better used for draws

IDONKCALLU

each to there own not saying my way is the right way its just summit i would do  and why cant villain call with worse ?

rancid

In Response to Re: Is this a leak?:

each to there own not saying my way is the right way its just summit i would do  and why cant villain call with worse ?
Posted by IDONKCALLU

Not much worse bruv.

Lambert180

Yeah I don't love the call pre OOP without reads tbh.

Readless C/C the river seems the best option (and much better than leading as a blocker bet given the range you've assigned him).

liamboi11

this what I posted on your other thread

yeah don`t know if i`m wrong but think I c/c river.

I think most people bet their draws on flop so and I think it`s less chance he has flush and his bet on turn looks kinda weak to me maybe have 2 overs with one club but I could be wrong and he just got there with 55/a5.

with regards to pre flop play like others have said calling oop is bad if you do it a lot imo. I do call with these hands if feel I can outplay my opponent postflop on certain boards and also like 3betting these hands occasionly to mix it up,also you take control of the hand and rep bigger better hands by doing this.