20NL - Standard Snap Off Spot?

Lambert180

On the downswingaments as you know so probably just looking for re-assurance here...

Thoughts on going to £3 total with my 4bet after the tiny 3bet? More, less or perfect?

Standard snap 'em off spot? I bet small deliberately to allow someone to ship a FD or a weaker OP that they might not feel so comfortable with if I go like £7-8... although wasn't expecting 2 ships.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
hornetjim	Small blind		£0.10	£0.10	£19.50
jensen1986	Big blind		£0.20	£0.30	£11.06
	Your hole cards	K K
Lambert180	Raise		£0.60	£0.90	£18.16
Amy	Raise		£1.00	£1.90	£19.34
Sheldon	Call		£1.00	£2.90	£18.83
routeledge	Fold
hornetjim	Fold
jensen1986	Call		£0.80	£3.70	£10.26
Lambert180	Raise		£2.40	£6.10	£15.76
Amy	Call		£2.00	£8.10	£17.34
Sheldon	Call		£2.00	£10.10	£16.83
jensen1986	Call		£2.00	£12.10	£8.26
Flop
		10 9 2
jensen1986	Check
Lambert180	Bet		£3.00	£15.10	£12.76
Amy	All-in		£17.34	£32.44	£0.00
Sheldon	All-in		£16.83	£49.27	£0.00
jensen1986	Fold
Lambert180	All-in		£12.76	£62.03	£0.00

F_Ivanovic

Go bigger pre-flop. Table seems fishy and we want to try and isolate with KK or get it 3 way at most. There's already £3.70 in the spot and I so I'd probably make it 3.70ish total more.

I'm not a fan of the small flop bet in this particular spot because the board is somewhat wet and we're 4 way. If it was T92r or T52 with one FD then you can definitely bet smaller (although even then I'd go at least £5) - only time I would bet your size is if it was T52r.

Also I really can't see these players folding overpairs here. You might get more calls with 9x or some hands like 55-88 to call but you're also inviting flush draws/straight draws as well as allowing Tx and 9x to hit 2 pairs. And when they do call you haven't defined their range at all and there are going to be a lot of turn cards where you now might not be sure if you are ahead or not.

This particular flop I think around £7 is a nice bet size. As played you have to call it off really w/o any specific reads. One of them might have flopped a set but you probably induced somewhat lighter shoves from your small bet size (one good reason to bet this small could be that if at least a couple of villains are aggressive) - but if only 1 is aggressive and most are passive definitely a bigger sizing is the way to go.

BorinLoner

In Response to Re: 20NL - Standard Snap Off Spot?:

Go bigger pre-flop. Table seems fishy and we want to try and isolate with KK or get it 3 way at most. There's already £3.70 in the spot and I so I'd probably make it 3.70ish total more. I'm not a fan of the small flop bet in this particular spot because the board is somewhat wet and we're 4 way. If it was T92r or T52 with one FD then you can definitely bet smaller (although even then I'd go at least £5) - only time I would bet your size is if it was T52r. Also I really can't see these players folding overpairs here. You might get more calls with 9x or some hands like 55-88 to call but you're also inviting flush draws/straight draws as well as allowing Tx and 9x to hit 2 pairs. And when they do call you haven't defined their range at all and there are going to be a lot of turn cards where you now might not be sure if you are ahead or not. This particular flop I think around £7 is a nice bet size. As played you have to call it off really w/o any specific reads. One of them might have flopped a set but you probably induced somewhat lighter shoves from your small bet size (one good reason to bet this small could be that if at least a couple of villains are aggressive) - but if only 1 is aggressive and most are passive definitely a bigger sizing is the way to go.
Posted by F_Ivanovic

+1 to most of this.

Think the flop call is more of a PokerStove question, though. Are either of these guys flatting 4-bets with AT? We want them stacking off on the flop with weaker pairs in 4-bet pots, so it would be nice to think they're a bit spewy. We can't just hope they're both playing draws, after all.

Obviously we can't fold if they can have JJ, QQ or AT type hands with 4:1 on our money.

rancid

Not loving it versus two but still calling with that price and against the releastic range of not always facing a set

Lambert180

Cheers guys. Again just wanting re-assurance.

I was up against QQ and AQdd and obv didn't hold.