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hmmmmmmmm

gazza127gazza127
edited October 2013 in The Poker Clinic
Oppo is LAG.  He does like a bluff and i have caught him a couple of times (on another night... not tonight)....

Seems to be playing slightly tighter tonight... or at least he hasn't been caught bluffing as of yet.

Im just confused by the whole hand...

Thoughts?
Villain
 Small blind   £0.25 £0.25 £96.31
gazza127 Big blind   £0.50 £0.75 £134.87
  Your hole cards
  • 7
  • K
     
indieben Fold        
Ludacris Fold        
liamboi11 Fold        
kcxyz Fold        
Villain  Raise   £1.25 £2.00 £95.06
gazza127 Call   £1.00 £3.00 £133.87
Flop
   
  • J
  • Q
  • 6
     
Villain Check        
gazza127 Bet   £1.50 £4.50 £132.37
Villain Raise   £4.00 £8.50 £91.06
gazza127 Call   £2.50 £11.00 £129.87
Turn
   
  • 10
     
Villain Bet   £6.00 £17.00 £85.06
gazza127 Raise   £19.00 £36.00 £110.87
Villain Raise   £26.00 £62.00 £59.06
gazza127 Call   £13.00 £75.00 £97.87
River
   
  • Q
     
Villain All-in   £59.06 £134.06 £0.00
gazza127 ??
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Comments

  • LARSON7LARSON7
    edited October 2013
    Guys going with his hand, why did you just call the turn? Looks like he has a set, I would of been getting it in here on the turn.
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    In Response to Re: hmmmmmmmm:
    Guys going with his hand, why did you just call the turn? Looks like he has a set, I would of been getting it in here on the turn.
    Posted by LARSON7
    I was snap calling the river before the board paired.  I just called the turn to keep in all of his bluffs - yes i still think bluffs are in his range.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited October 2013
    If you really think this guy check/raises the flop then 3bets the turn, intending to ship the river and do that all with a bluff.... can you tell me his alias ;)

    Seriously though, if you think he's doing it with loads of bluffs, then surely the river is irrelevant to a large extent because I assume you're expecting him to have more bluffs than FHs? If that's not the case and he has more sets (on the turn) than FHs, then you should shove.

    So if he has more sets/2pr etc than bluffs, shoev the turn

    If he has more bluffs than sets/FHs, call the river.
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    In Response to Re: hmmmmmmmm:
    If you really think this guy check/raises the flop then 3bets the turn, intending to ship the river and do that all with a bluff.... can you tell me his alias ;)Seriously though, if you think he's doing it with loads of bluffs, then surely the river is irrelevant to a large extent because I assume you're expecting him to have more bluffs than FHs? If that's not the case and he has more sets (on the turn) than FHs, then you should shove. So if he has more sets than bluffs, shoev the turn If he has more bluffs than sets/FHs, call the river.
    Posted by Lambert180
    Haha i can PM it you if i want?  ;)

    Perfect logic.
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    Although surely i keep in both bluffs and sets just by calling the turn and if the board doesnt pair then I dont have any headache in calling.  If I shove the turn or reraise again then I not only fold the bluffs but I give sooooomeee players (a few, not many) the chance to get away from a set too.
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    It was the re raise on the turn which confused the hell out of me... especially after check/raising flop.  I mean he cant have the flush and a set....
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  • F_IvanovicF_Ivanovic
    edited October 2013
    uhuh weird. Only hand he concievably reps here is 89dd. I guess he could have the nut flush but surely when the board pairs he has to think that we're not calling river with too many worse hands. (then again it's unlikely we have a FH given our line so he prob doesn't need to worry about being beat) Given that he reps so little it makes me want to call here - but then, I really can't see many players having a bluff here. 

    If you called and he showed up with a FH here I would be way more inclined to be 4betting the turn in future. 
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    In Response to Re: hmmmmmmmm:
    uhuh weird. Only hand he concievably reps here is 89dd. I guess he could have the nut flush but surely when the board pairs he has to think that we're not calling river with too many worse hands. (then again it's unlikely we have a FH given our line so he prob doesn't need to worry about being beat) Given that he reps so little it makes me want to call here - but then, I really can't see many players having a bluff here.  If you called and he showed up with a FH here I would be way more inclined to be 4betting the turn in future. 
    Posted by F_Ivanovic
    Yeah it was very wierd.

    I did end up calling but i'll share the result later as I want to see what other people do in this spot without being results orientated.
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  • SlipwaterSlipwater
    edited October 2013
    My initial instinct would be the flush. I don't know why, other than a lot of players overvalue suited aces. It certainly looks like he has A9 or A8 of diamonds, but I don't know why he would be re-raising the turn. If he does have the flush, surely he just calls to keep you there. Whatever he has, the hand plays out unconventionally and the villain has an unorthodox method. But perhaps that's the point - to confuse you. I can see him holding a pair of 6s almost as often, or perhaps JQ.

    I would probably have shoved the turn with the second nut flush here, instead of simply calling his re-raise. I mean, at that point you are only really afraid of one hand, and the only river card which should realistically scare you is another diamond. I get the feeling he was going all in whichever card hit the river, and had it been another diamond, then what? You go all that way and chuck in all that money only to fold because he possibly has the ace? That's why I'd have pushed on the turn - to take the decision away from me, and put the ball in his court.

    Fair enough, the river pairs the board, but I reckon the amount of times you have a higher flush than he does outweighs the few times he has the house here. It's a frightening line he has taken, but I don't think - long term - you can fold on the end.

    Just my two pence.
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  • seppeseppe
    edited October 2013
    surely hes telling you on the turn its for stacks by betting then raising yr raise? get it in man
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  • rancidrancid
    edited October 2013
    really don't think vill is bluffing turn enough of the time given line

    turn is what nut flush or bluff or like 89dd - never 9 high flush

    would vill raise turn with sets/9 high flushes v you for value ?

    river is the worse card.......what are you beating....


    bluff...9 high flush


    river is prob a fold, unless you think vill is bluffing o so much





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  • a00rocka00rock
    edited October 2013
    Looks like JJ or QQ to me and he don't want to lose his customer.
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  • gazza127gazza127
    edited October 2013
    Well i decided to call as the hand hadnt made any sense to me.  I couldnt work out why he'd check raise the flop with a flush.  And I couldnt work out why he'd reraise the turn with a set when the flush is out.  So I thought he was up to something and called.
    Villain
    		 Small blind   £0.25 £0.25 £96.31
    gazza127 Big blind   £0.50 £0.75 £134.87
      Your hole cards
    • 7
    • K
    		     
    indieben Fold        
    Ludacris Fold        
    liamboi11 Fold        
    kcxyz Fold        
    Villain Raise   £1.25 £2.00 £95.06
    gazza127 Call   £1.00 £3.00 £133.87
    Flop
       
    • J
    • Q
    • 6
    		     
    Villain Check        
    gazza127 Bet   £1.50 £4.50 £132.37
    Villain Raise   £4.00 £8.50 £91.06
    gazza127 Call   £2.50 £11.00 £129.87
    Turn
       
    • 10
    		     
    Villain Bet   £6.00 £17.00 £85.06
    gazza127 Raise   £19.00 £36.00 £110.87
    Villain Raise   £26.00 £62.00 £59.06
    gazza127 Call   £13.00 £75.00 £97.87
    River
       
    • Q
    		     
    Villain All-in   £59.06 £134.06 £0.00
    gazza127 Call   £59.06 £193.12 £38.81
    Villain Show
    • 8
    • 7
    		     
    gazza127 Show
    • 7
    • K
    		     
    gazza127 Win Flush to the King £191.32   £230.13
    Turns out he was up to something!  But I was just wondering whether I played the hand badly... mainly surrounding the turn call v a shove (for the times he actually has something).
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  • NColleyNColley
    edited October 2013
    opponent confirmed button clicker

    I would flat the turn 3bet and SNAP call/raise all in any river vs this guy with your reads even before I saw the result
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