first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?

GELDY

blinds 100 200 stacks 30k

early raise and a call. sb 3 bets. early raiser now makes it 5200 and called by the sb.

flop JT2 sb c/c the 5200 bet from the early raiser

turn 2 cc

river 2 so the board is JT222 and the SB shoves his remaining 20k Which is a pot sized bet

early raiser has AA. Can he fold. No reads. 

kerrypower

In Response to first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

blinds 100 200 stacks 30k early raise and a call. sb 3 bets. early raiser now makes it 5200 and called by the sb. flop JT2 sb c/c the 5200 bet from the early raiser turn 2 cc river 2 so the board is JT222 and the SB shoves his remaining 20k Which is a pot sized bet early raiser has AA. Can he fold. No reads. 
Posted by GELDY

Hi Geldy
  In reply I couldn't ,I put the sb on a pair and would be watching through my fingers hoping it was not j or t lol
  By the way I enjoy watching your play on the tv your one mean tourny player
     kerry (kerrypower)

Nuggy962

If I have the roll to reload I call, but going on pre flop JJ is def in range, more so than AJ. Don't see why QQ or KK make that play, 

20k is still loads ! Is a tough one. As they say, can not win an MTT in level one but can loose it

GELDY

In Response to Re: first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

In Response to first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold? : Hi Geldy   In reply I couldn't ,I put the sb on a pair and would be watching through my fingers hoping it was not j or t lol   By the way I enjoy watching your play on the tv your one mean tourny player      kerry (kerrypower)
Posted by kerrypower

you're so kind, and your first forum post as well

GELDY

so the AA tanks for ages

and sigh calls with a comment I'm not very strong but. .....

the sb mucks before being shown the AA

DrRunGood

In Response to Re: first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

so the AA tanks for ages and sigh calls with a comment I'm not very strong but. ..... the sb mucks before being shown the AA
Posted by GELDY

who was the player viktor blom by any chance sounds like one of his plays haha
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5ASZKL01ss

MattBates

So our opponent has jammed and forced us to nearly fold aa. If they are happy to fire another bullet and especially if they have a jack blocker its a great play. I think it boils down to a mixture of the following
our views on our opponent
our perceived views on us
whether we are happy to fire another bullet
what we perceive our table to be like compared to other tables. (Eg could edge pass as table seems soft)

natry20111

In Response to first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

blinds 100 200 stacks 30k early raise and a call. sb 3 bets. early raiser now makes it 5200 and called by the sb. flop JT2 sb c/c the 5200 bet from the early raiser turn 2 cc river 2 so the board is JT222 and the SB shoves his remaining 20k Which is a pot sized bet early raiser has AA. Can he fold. No reads. 
Posted by GELDY

considering how low the blinds are it should be a fold

GELDY

Thanks all

i think another factor that increased the chance of a call was that it was still during the re entry period. The AA guy seemed good enough to work out he was probably behind but was willing to take the chance for an early double up knowing he could re enter if necessary. 

i forgot to mention this was level 3 and re entries to the end of level 4

mrleemr1

Jacks and tens flat pre, so we lose to A2 only. Always a call

mrleemr1

Omg how is he ever behind here, why would someone in position 4-bet in position TT or JJ here, if he 4-bets this spot with TT JJ he is likely bluffing, which it's too strong to bluff.

What are you lot on about hes likely behind but because the re entry period, re-entry periods in tournaments don't mean people make losing play calls just cause they WAnna see the opponents cards

hhyftrftdr

In Response to Re: first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

Omg how is he ever behind here, why would someone in position 4-bet in position TT or JJ here, if he 4-bets this spot with TT JJ he is likely bluffing, which it's too strong to bluff. What are you lot on about hes likely behind but because the re entry period, re-entry periods in tournaments don't mean people make losing play calls just cause they WAnna see the opponents cards
Posted by mrleemr1

Eh?

shakinaces

In Response to Re: first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

Omg how is he ever behind here, why would someone in position 4-bet in position TT or JJ here, if he 4-bets this spot with TT JJ he is likely bluffing, which it's too strong to bluff. What are you lot on about hes likely behind but because the re entry period, re-entry periods in tournaments don't mean people make losing play calls just cause they WAnna see the opponents cards
Posted by mrleemr1

Would it not be believable that UTG was raising for a degree of protection with the 4-bet, given that the SB could be squeezing light and (by calling the 3b) the late position caller is more likely to come along for the ride and leave us playing JJ/TT (if that is what we are putting UTG on) multi-way, without position and without initiative.

For similar reasons I'd like to think I'd call with AA on the river not because I'm just a fish (which I am), but because I'd perceive UTG to have potentially be 4-betting light due to perceiving me to be 3-bet squeezing and therefore have a wide enough range to bet river without a 2, JJ or TT.

If that makes sense...

F_Ivanovic

mrleemr1 is right.... 4-betting JJ or TT from UTG to a SB 3-bet is really bad. SB's widest value 3-bet range has you crushed (AK, QQ+) so by 4-betting JJ or TT we are basically doing so for information because I can't imagine we're happy GII JJ pre here if SB 5-bets. Thus we're effectively turning our JJs into a bluff, and there are much better hands to do so with.

SB is not going to be squeezing light here at all unless he knows UTG to be really loose from that position. His range should be AA/KK and like a couple of bluffs.  (if he wants to balance)

hhyftrftdr

I'm confused.

Unless I've read it wrong, the early raiser has 4bet AA and not 10s or Js.

Matt237

In Response to Re: first levels of a live deepstack mtt day 1. can you fold?:

Omg how is he ever behind here, why would someone in position 4-bet in position TT or JJ here, if he 4-bets this spot with TT JJ he is likely bluffing, which it's too strong to bluff. What are you lot on about hes likely behind but because the re entry period, re-entry periods in tournaments don't mean people make losing play calls just cause they WAnna see the opponents cards
Posted by mrleemr1

Maybe re-read it as the villain in question 3bets and flats the 4bet.

hhyftrftdr

It's a gross spot cos you just know if you call then they often roll over one of the 2 hands that beat us. Yet I'd probably level myself into calling as I'd convince myself they can also have QQ/KK and maybe the odd time a complete airball.

Think the re-entry factor is key, and the in game feel vs the villain. If said villain is the same age or older than Jac35 then its an insta fold