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shove or not to shove?

ClaytovClaytov
edited August 2015 in Poker Chat
A player has 800 chips all in on the small blind with blinds 3k and 6k antes 500, 9 handed. 19 left and 9 get paid. There are two limpers in middle position and I'm in the big blind with AQ and a stack of 80k. Do I...

a) just check so there is more chance of losing a player and we get closer to the money?
b) raise small to create a side pot?
c) go all in and isolate?


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Comments

  • MattBatesMattBates
    edited August 2015
    In Response to shove or not to shove?:
    A player has 800 chips all in on the small blind with blinds 3k and 6k antes 500, 9 handed. 19 left and 9 get paid. There are two limpers in middle position and I'm in the big blind with AQ and a stack of 80k. Do I... a) just check so there is more chance of losing a player and we get closer to the money? b) raise small to create a side pot? c) go all in and isolate?
    Posted by Claytov
    What are their stacks?

    The 800 stack is irrelevant to me, we aren't all that close to the money. There is a lot of dead money in the pot and we are massively ahead of any 2 cards of the sb.

    Default option is to jam but does depend on their stacks.
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  • ClaytovClaytov
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    In Response to shove or not to shove? : What are their stacks? The 800 stack is irrelevant to me, we aren't all that close to the money. There is a lot of dead money in the pot and we are massively ahead of any 2 cards of the sb. Default option is to jam but does depend on their stacks.
    Posted by MattBates
    Why does it matter what their stacks are? I only have 13 bigs. The first limper had me well covered, second probably had about the same as me.
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  • GELDYGELDY
    edited August 2015
    They could be limping to induce. 
    If they are passive limpers then jam looks good
    tricky limpers then checking to see the free card is a valid option. 
    raising just leaves you playing AQ oop in an inflated pot if you're lucky
    and facing an aipf l/s if you're not

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  • BenchmarkBenchmark
    edited August 2015
    I was watching one of the WPT games on TV last night. I think they were down to around 5 or 6 players. The short stack went all-in with about $35k. There were two other players still in. Not sure of their stacks, but at least $1M each. The firts guy went all-in, forcing the second one out. He was not happy. His thoughts were similar to yours. Check around and have two hands for the short stack to beat. Fortunately, the bigger stack won. Only just. I think the pot was around $250k, as the two bigger stacks had already put some chips in before the all-in shove.

    Maybe he wanted to save $100k of chips. Personally, I'd have checked around,
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  • GaryQQQGaryQQQ
    edited August 2015
    All-in squeeze/shove every time for me.

    An added bonus; the all-in player means your hand will be exposed and seen to be strong. This opens the door to squeeze lighter next time.
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  • ClaytovClaytov
    edited August 2015
    For me it was a no brainer shove, the limpers were passive and I was confident they would be folding. I was interested in other peoples opinions though because it seemed like everyone on the table thought I was a complete moron. One guy left the table cos he was so angry and another one threaten to punch my face off after a heated discussion about it. I was just shocked that so many of them thought it was a bad shove and they thought "its all about getting players knocked out at this stage." Needless to say the short stack ended up outlasting me :-(
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  • Sky_DanSky_Dan
    edited August 2015
    Pretty sure I'm shoving here all day long. Though from recent memory in my local casino I have done exactly this from your position with the same hand and the middle position limper has insta-called with Jacks or Queens. Meh, what you gonna do. 
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    For me it was a no brainer shove, the limpers were passive and I was confident they would be folding. I was interested in other peoples opinions though because it seemed like everyone on the table thought I was a complete moron. One guy left the table cos he was so angry and another one threaten to punch my face off after a heated discussion about it. I was just shocked that so many of them thought it was a bad shove and they thought "its all about getting players knocked out at this stage." Needless to say the short stack ended up outlasting me :-(
    Posted by Claytov
    lol.

    As others say, pretty easy shove methinks with all those chips in the middle. Don't think we are anywhere near enough to the money to consider the benefits of KO'ing the SB in a passive pot.
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  • MattBatesMattBates
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove? : Why does it matter what their stacks are? I only have 13 bigs. The first limper had me well covered, second probably had about the same as me.
    Posted by Claytov
    You mentioned raising to create a side pot so I wanted to know what their stacks were.
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  • ClaytovClaytov
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove? : You mentioned raising to create a side pot so I wanted to know what their stacks were.
    Posted by MattBates
    Ah, got ya. That was never a viable option for me, just through it in cos the guy that wanted to punch my face off said thats what I should have done.
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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited August 2015
    100 per cent jam all day every day altho u have no f/e ya gonna be ahead all limping range 
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    10 per cent jam all day every day altho u have no f/e ya gonna be ahead all limping range 
    Posted by IDONKCALLU
    Wouldn't say he has no F/E.

    Would need to know how many BB the larger stack has, but has excellent fold equity vs the similar sized stack. Assuming the larger stack doesn't have mountains, I'd say hero still has reasonable F/E.
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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited August 2015
    when u get 2 limpers of 6 k and u shove for 19k dnt think they are ever folding for a extra 13k tbh but when the 1st guy calls usually the next person calls as already put 6 k in but im never folding aq here in this spot 
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  • MattBatesMattBates
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    when u get 2 limpers of 6 k and u shove for 19k dnt think they are ever folding for a extra 13k tbh but when the 1st guy calls usually the next person calls as already put 6 k in but im never folding aq here in this spot 
    Posted by IDONKCALLU
    Maybe read the OP
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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited August 2015
    o yeah am i bad 80 k stack lol i thought he said he had 19 lol     still a great spot for a jam here after 2 limps im always jamming here 
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  • ClaytovClaytov
    edited August 2015
    That confirms it then, shove was fine. I'll tell everyone at the casino they're a bunch of idiots.
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  • Sky_DanSky_Dan
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    That confirms it then, shove was fine. I'll tell everyone at the casino they're a bunch of idiots.
    Posted by Claytov
    I laughed.
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  • Tikay10Tikay10
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    For me it was a no brainer shove, the limpers were passive and I was confident they would be folding. I was interested in other peoples opinions though because it seemed like everyone on the table thought I was a complete moron. One guy left the table cos he was so angry and another one threaten to punch my face off after a heated discussion about it. I was just shocked that so many of them thought it was a bad shove and they thought "its all about getting players knocked out at this stage." Needless to say the short stack ended up outlasting me :-(
    Posted by Claytov
    Presumably, he left the table to get a life.

     
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  • GELDYGELDY
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove? : Presumably, he left the table to get a life.  
    Posted by Tikay10
    Hope he's still out when they're told that they're a bunch of idiots else it could get ugly. Particularly if it's mentioned the info comes from a community of Internet players! 
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  • Tikay10Tikay10
    edited August 2015
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove?:
    In Response to Re: shove or not to shove? : Hope he's still out when they're told that they're a bunch of idiots else it could get ugly. Particularly if it's mentioned the info comes from a community of Internet players! 
    Posted by GELDY
    Ha.

    Honestly, when a guy thinks he has the right to get angry with how someone else played a single hand of poker (& correctly, at that), he needs to get some perspective.

    And if anyone wants to bemoan how I play - if you pay my buy-ins, flame away. If you don't, MYOB.
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