Should I have just folded pre?

waller02

Vegas semi FR (3.5k)

6 left, 5 seats shorty has 1.5bb, I'm the next shorty.

I shoved here as I'm unlucky to run into AA and there aren't many hands that are going to call. I didnt want to fold only for shorty to double up and then regret it later. Literally just played this hand and think perhaps I should have folded? I dunno!

Been trying hard to bag a vegas package and this is a pretty harsh bubble!

tonyband03	Small blind		6000.00	6000.00	69272.50
TopCat1970	Big blind		12000.00	18000.00	72706.25
	Your hole cards	K K
waller02	All-in		53360.00	71360.00	0.00
Si22015	Call		53360.00	124720.00	113862.50
IrishRose	Fold
icklepixie	Fold
tonyband03	Fold
TopCat1970	Fold
waller02	Show	K K
Si22015	Show	8 A
Flop
		8 A 2
Turn
		3
River
		7
Si22015	Win	Two Pairs, Aces and 8s	124720.00		238582.50

bert21

Think it was Dan Harrington who said he would never fold kings pre otherwise might as well pack up playing, in saying that listened to Paul action Jackson at a seminar where he gave an example where he would fold aces pre flop so you pay your money and take your choice

MattBates

I had a very similar case in roller semi on Sunday. I shoved KK from button and sb had aa and I bubbled too. I think it was the right move as I wasnt a lock at that point. 

When is shortie in the blinds? Are we 5/6 atm? I would also look at whether shortie was forced all in by going through the blinds and when the blinds go up. 

hhyftrftdr

I know we talked in CB about it but I don't think you can fault a shove. A single double up for the shortstack puts you almost level, and you won't get a better hand than KK again (probably).

You pass KK, ss doubles, and this forces you to jam A3 into AK for gg......that's the scenario you don't want

waller02

I think icklepixie was the shorty and yes I was 5/6. It was only 3min blinds so she may well have been forced all in by the time it got round her.

As I discussed with harry, I didnt want to fold only for shorty to double or even treble up, leaving me regretting the fold and being the new shorty. But on the flip side I could perhaps have folded with the possibility of the shorty being forced allin in a potential multiway pot.

At the time I really did not expect a call. I'm not shoving without a very strong hand given the fact there is somebody sat with 1.5bb. I thought, shove, pay the rent for another orbit, hope shorty busts.

waller02

Also, if KK should be shove what other hands should we be shoving? JJ+/AK?

These are very common spots encountered in sats and I often end up either shoving too light or folding too tight!

CraigSG1

I dont think there is really an argument to be had. You was 100% correct to shove. As you have stated you are not locked on for a seat. And to add it wa a diabolical call by the other player. Anyway, the real quesoin is if you are 3/6 then you have a dilema! 

craigcu12

being 5/6 and knowing the short stack could go ahead with a double up it was certainly a right choice, you could be left having to go in ith a raggy ace and shift from hoping to avoid the card into a spot where it's you who needs to get the hit.

The hand choice during the bubble of a sat will come down to stack size of the shortest stack and yourself, along side number of players left to act.

If the stack is like oe you've got then AA, KK and QQ are what i'd deem shoves from anywhere because these should be sitting ahead of a caller and only QQv AK will see 50/50.

JJ AK or AQ could be shoved if your on button, SB but in earlier positions a fold could be best because you'll have higher chance of being 50/50 at best and the earlier you are to act the greater the risk of running into a flip.

If you had a stack better than 2 other players and were at the bubble either limp AA KK with intent to call the shove made by a 1/32BB shortest stack or make the fold right away.