I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?

The_Don90

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
The_Don90	Small blind		10.00	10.00	1760.00
Rigoletto	Big blind		20.00	30.00	2020.00
Chez	Sit out
	Your hole cards	K A
x	Call		20.00	50.00	1860.00
a	Raise		40.00	90.00	6310.00
The_Don90	Raise		70.00	160.00	1690.00
Rigoletto	Fold
x	Call		60.00	220.00	1800.00
a	Raise		80.00	300.00	6230.00
The_Don90	Call		40.00	340.00	1650.00
x	Call		40.00	380.00	1760.00
Flop
		3 A 5
The_Don90	Bet		285.00	665.00	1365.00
x	All-in		1760.00	2425.00	0.00
a	Fold
The_Don90	All-in		1365.00	3790.00	0.00
x	Unmatched bet		110.00	3680.00	110.00
The_Don90	Show	K A
x	Show	A 5
Turn
		2
River
		Q
x	Win	Two Pairs, Aces and 5s	3680.00		3790.00

Now pre flop i know i played this poorly, i should have raised this stronger. However the reasoning for this was player "a" was re-raising alot and thats how hed taken to people out earlier in this bounty hunter and didnt want to commit too much early on in a Bounty hunter with AK incase of missing.

Now i play the flop with a 3/4 pot size bet. Player x re-raises all in. I certainly dont expect to see 2,4 in the whole so im able to rule out the straight. Player "x"folds, leaving the desison to me. Would A5 or A3 call pre flop. Well they did have the pot odds so i really should have been able to fold.

So yes i know i played this hand rather poorly, but is it such a bad call ?

harvey23

In Response to I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

know i played this poorly, i should have raised this stronger. However the reasoning for this was player "a" was re-raising alot and thats how hed taken to people out earlier in this bounty hunter and didnt want to commit too much early on in a Bounty hunter with AK incase of missing. Now i play the flop with a 3/4 pot size bet. Player x re-raises all in. I certainly dont expect to see 2,4 in the whole so im able to rule out the straight. Player "x"folds, leaving the desison to me. Would A5 or A3 call pre flop. Well they did have the pot odds so i really should have been able to fold. So yes i know i played this hand rather poorly, but is it such a bad call ?
Posted by The_Don90

you need to raise this to around 120~ pre, and the stack off on the flop is totally standard.

didnt want to commit too much early on in a Bounty hunter with AK incase of missing.

If you think you have the best hand pre, you want to get as much money as you can in pre,you can win pots without hitting the flop as well.

Cowgomoo

I'm definitely re-raising especially as you say "a" has been re raising a lot. But you know that you made a mistake there, so lets move on.

Why did you lead straight out? Did you have a reason for this?

When you get shoved on I think you have to call because you have under represented your hand by just flat calling preflop so people wont put you on that stronger hand and could be shoving with hands like A 10 / A9, also adding to the fact that this was a bounty hunter and people tend to go mad to try and get heads this is probably a call. 

Dudeskin8

Raising to 70 preflop serves no purpose other than pot building, it has to be 120-30 + to have any effect. Once that flop comes down you can not fold, especially in a bounty hunter format where people will go all in with almost any 2.

YOUNG_GUN

so raise of 3.5 blinds pre flop? thats main problem here

if you had raised 120-150 pre then i think it would be easier to fold in this spot, although then again if he is aggressive whats the betting he would do this if he missed?

still i would just pick a better spot because of the raise pre your opponent could have all sorts of hand so again maybe fold but would still be questioning whether it was correct or not but still would have plenty of chips and still plenty of play left

harvey23

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

so raise of 3.5 blinds pre flop? thats main problem here if you had raised 120-150 pre then i think it would be easier to fold in this spot, although then again if he is aggressive whats the betting he would do this if he missed? still i would just pick a better spot because of the raise pre your opponent could have all sorts of hand so again maybe fold but would still be questioning whether it was correct or not but still would have plenty of chips and still plenty of play left
Posted by YOUNG_GUN

oh dear god.

if he had raised to 120-150 and got called, its even more of a stack post flop on such a dry board.

Wait for a better spot???? he has AK, only hands preflop that are ahead are AA/KK the rest are flipping with AK. We know villian is very agroo and plays alot of hands, so what "spot" are we exactly waiting for, 4bet pre flop to 120-150, and get it in on that flop.

The_Don90

Just to point out to the above two comments, i may have misread,

However player "a" is the calling station of this hand and was the one who flopped the two pair. The other opponent who folded on the flop was the aggro opponent.

Cowgomoo

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

Just to point out to the above two comments, i may have misread, However player "a" is the calling station of this hand and was the one who flopped the two pair. The other opponent who folded on the flop was the aggro opponent.
Posted by The_Don90

You said "a" was the agressive one - not a calling station, and "x" won the hand with two pair.

YOUNG_GUN

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop? : oh dear god. if he had raised to 120-150 and got called, its even more of a stack post flop on such a dry board. Wait for a better spot???? he has AK, only hands preflop that are ahead are AA/KK the rest are flipping with AK. We know villian is very agroo and plays alot of hands, so what "spot" are we exactly waiting for, 4bet pre flop to 120-150, and get it in on that flop.
Posted by harvey23

no need to keep talking down to me man, i can understand if you talk normal you know!

it is possible to get away from a dry flop like this for example why risk all you your chips, just because you got AK many people overplay this hand more then most. it is possible that someone could have a set the way they have played this would still make a coninuation bet on the flop and re-evaluate. yes chances are your AK is good here but still no need to risk it all in one go.

see after flop if someone has called your 360 pot sized bet then chances they could have an ace or sets as no flush draws out or straights so adjust accordingly. if someone came all in over the top not really worth the risk unless you know your villain as many people will overplay there hand so you will get paid of with your AK but against a good opponent they wouldn't stick it in with a worse hand

harvey23

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop? : no need to keep talking down to me man, i can understand if you talk normal you know! it is possible to get away from a dry flop like this for example why risk all you your chips, just because you got AK many people overplay this hand more then most. it is possible that someone could have a set the way they have played this would still make a coninuation bet on the flop and re-evaluate. yes chances are your AK is good here but still no need to risk it all in one go. see after flop if someone has called your 360 pot sized bet then chances they could have an ace or sets as no flush draws out or straights so adjust accordingly. if someone came all in over the top not really worth the risk unless you know your villain as many people will overplay there hand so you will get paid of with your AK but against a good opponent they wouldn't stick it in with a worse hand
Posted by YOUNG_GUN

we can assume they dont have AA as one is on the flop and we hold one in our hand, so there is only 1 combo of AA left in the deck. 33/55 are poss but that is such a small part of there. I bet if the flop was A42 you would be saying yeah its good call etc etc.

You also said chances are we are good here, which assumes we are ahead in this spot at least 50% /> of the time, which makes this play ev+ to get it all in on the flop. Hope we have cleared this up and stop giving bad advice.

At the end of the day this is the perfect flop for us in a 3bet pot, if you are thinking about folding TPTK vs that type of villian who from the way they played the hand is clearly not a strong player, you should quit poker now.
Saying he COULD have 33/55 so fold, is stupid, because are we only meant to shove all in when we have the stone cold nuts? rhetorica dont answer it please or post in this section.

YOUNG_GUN

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop? : we can assume they dont have AA as one is on the flop and we hold one in our hand, so there is only 1 combo of AA left in the deck. 33/55 are poss but that is such a small part of there. I bet if the flop was A42 you would be saying yeah its good call etc etc. You also said chances are we are good here, which assumes we are ahead in this spot at least 50% /> of the time, which makes this play ev+ to get it all in on the flop. Hope we have cleared this up and stop giving bad advice. At the end of the day this is the perfect flop for us in a 3bet pot, if you are thinking about folding TPTK vs that type of villian who from the way they played the hand is clearly not a strong player, you should quit poker now. Saying he COULD have 33/55 so fold, is stupid, because are we only meant to shove all in when we have the stone cold nuts? rhetorica dont answer it please or post in this section.
Posted by harvey23

i must write badly what im saying as that is very far of it. im not suggesting at any point i was saying they could have another ace(which is ideal) but saying they could also have a set 33/55 would be played like this

I have mentioned i would c bet this flop i even put the amount and then re-assess

The_Don90

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop? : You said "a" was the agressive one - not a calling station, and "x" won the hand with two pair.
Posted by Cowgomoo

Sorry that was me getting muddled up.

YOUNG_GUN

Just for the record i probably am never folding here or with that flop, just Harvey your very arrogant so wanted to see something but doesn't look like you accept any other opinions and if you had put it nicely i wouldn't have bothered replying but you seem to think your better then everyone else for whatever reason so in future will just ignore your posts. although not because its bad information just because your up your own ***

harvey23

+ in furture op please remove the results of the hand

The_Don90

In Response to Re: I know i played this bad but should i have folded on the flop?:

+ in furture op please remove the results of the hand
Posted by harvey23

Sorry Harvey i don't usually but since all the money went in at the talking point i thought this was a different situation to most hands i would post.