Do you bet for value on the river?

DOHHHHHHH

And if so, how much?

Also, how do you react to...

a) a check min raise from villain?
b) a check/shove from the villain?

My only note on this guy is that he's abit of a station, and to overprice on draws. He also limp, raised me with pre flop, which is useless info in this spot.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
xxx	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£42.60
BobaFett11	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£27.19
	Your hole cards	A K
argo	Fold
paulscar	Fold
Ratboy71	Fold
DOHHHHHHH	Raise		£1.20	£1.65	£95.78
xxx	Call		£1.05	£2.70	£41.55
BobaFett11	Fold
Flop
		Q 7 A
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£2.03	£4.73	£93.75
xxx	Call		£2.03	£6.76	£39.52
Turn
		J
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£3.90	£10.66	£89.85
xxx	Call		£3.90	£14.56	£35.62
River
		Q
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH

scrumdown

i bet same amount as u did the turn if he comes over the top i fold  u only got ace  if chasing his flush he fold

Dudeskin8

If he's a station, is he a big enough station to call down with 2nd pair or is good draws his limit. If I bet here what does he call with, A10/9/8, I would bet about £7 then fold to shove or reraise.

Plus you have Ace spades so he can't have had TP + FD, maybe K9 spades. It's either worse Ace or a busted draw that won't pay u anyway.

YOUNG_GUN

bet £5, if he has a draw will fold if he has a hand will call. looks like a draw to me cant see him calling unless he has a worse ace at least. if he re-raises that be a tough decision for you but usually ur instinct is correct so go with the gut

beaneh

just do the perfect move everytime!

BlackFish3

Depends if you have him beat or not

The_Don90

I probably check inbehind mate. If ive got him beat the pot is worth taking down. If hes hit a Q or maybe evan AQ early we're only losing more.

DOHHHHHHH

Yeh I made a mistake here by value betting, he check raised me, and he had jack queen in the end, I had to fold.

Obviously you should try and do the perfect thing every time.

I just wondered what others would do in this situation.

beaneh

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

Yeh I made a mistake here by value betting, he check raised me, and he had jack queen in the end, I had to fold. Obviously you should try and do the perfect thing every time. I just wondered what others would do in this situation.
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

lol this is a clear value bet fold, you need to bet small because of the hands you're targetting. 

the perfect line wasn't to bet call.

ah well gonna have to settle for a buyin less than 18k this year. nightmare.

N1CK

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : lol this is a clear value bet fold, you need to bet small because of the hands you're targetting.  the perfect line wasn't to bet call. ah well gonna have to settle for a buyin less than 18k this year. nightmare.
Posted by beaneh

this is perfect play

bet size is key here

DOHHHHHHH

Yeh I thought as much, I obviously mis-read the guys hand, play with him loads too, and make notes on all the big pots I watch, and Ive never seen him check raise the river before. wp.

He had JQ it was shown on TV last night.

Bet sizing? - do u agree with the size of the bet?

+ 6 buy in session yest, + 9xbi on tuesday, and + 7 on thursday

22 buy ins up in 3 days, + £50 bonus/RB = £710 week

Happy days.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
rtc	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£42.60
BobaFett11	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£27.19
	Your hole cards	A K
argo	Fold
paulscar	Fold
Ratboy71	Fold
DOHHHHHHH	Raise		£1.20	£1.65	£95.78
rtc	Call		£1.05	£2.70	£41.55
BobaFett11	Fold
Flop
		Q 7 A
rtc	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£2.03	£4.73	£93.75
rtc	Call		£2.03	£6.76	£39.52
Turn
		J
rtc	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£3.90	£10.66	£89.85
rtc	Call		£3.90	£14.56	£35.62
River
		Q
rtc	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£7.28	£21.84	£82.57
rtc	All-in		£35.62	£57.46	£0.00
DOHHHHHHH	Fold
rtc	Muck
rtc	Win		£27.67		£27.67

N1CK

lazy half pot button clicker, bets ok

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : this is perfect play bet size is key here
Posted by N1CK

beaneh

River is a bet of <=to the turn imo

offshoot

if were being results orientated then i would advise just check folding turn in future.

beaneh

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

if were being results orientated then i would advise just check folding turn in future.
Posted by offshoot

that's the perfect play 100/100 times imo

DOHHHHHHH

I aint good enough to do that yet couldn't put him on JQ.

Room for improvement for sureeeeeeeee

YOUNG_GUN

played fine JJ, at least shows u do have a fold button and right to use it here :P

Others are really annoying of late. stop going on about it he was just saying previously wasnt telling porkies or bragging just making a point

beaneh

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

played fine JJ, at least shows u do have a fold button and right to use it here :P Others are really annoying of late. stop going on about it he was just saying previously wasnt telling porkies or bragging just making a point
Posted by YOUNG_GUN

Saying I always win and win lots cos i'm amazing and always make the perfect play is essentially bragging.

Also we are helping him by trying to explain to him just how much of a heater he is on. 

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : Saying I always win and win lots cos i'm amazing and always make the perfect play is essentially bragging. Also we are helping him by trying to explain to him just how much of a heater he is on. 
Posted by beaneh

Pshhhhhh I wish !!!

I said perfection is possible, and thats what I strive for in each individual situation.

No-where did I ever say I was perfect. The hand in this thread is an example.

The whole idea of poker is to make the right decisions, get as close to 100% decisions right as u can, sureeeeely?

beaneh

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : Pshhhhhh I wish !!! I said perfection is possible, and thats what I strive for in each individual situation. No-where did I ever say I was perfect. The hand in this thread is an example. The whole idea of poker is to make the right decisions, get as close to 100% decisions right as u can, sureeeeely?
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

You make it seem like your the first person trying to make the right move?

have we all been inadvertently trying to make the wrong move, is that where were going wrong?

DOHHHHHHH

Not at all, It's nothing new, and it's blatantly obvious. Im surprised how so many people disagree and decide to ridicule me. Its common sense?

beaneh

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

Not at all, It's nothing new, and it's blatantly obvious. Im surprised how so many people disagree and decide to ridicule me. Its common sense?
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

no one has disagreed about making the 'best decision'

You just look at results and let that cloud your thinking and decision making when looking back on a hand. Being results orientated is a very common mistake i'm sure you can overcome it.

YOUNG_GUN

just saw the hand on replay, see tikay who is a nit would check but doesn't dis-agree with the value bet here

so in answer value bet fine just unlucky with the outdraw

lynx3ffect

so, by your definition you played this hand badly dohhhh?

if only he had a weaker ace you would have played it perfectly....

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

so, by your definition you played this hand badly dohhhh? if only he had a weaker ace you would have played it perfectly....
Posted by lynx3ffect

U guys use these 2 words alot,

Ofc if he had a weaker ace (which I thought he did have, hence the bet), I would have played it perfectly!!

But he didn't....

......and I didn't.

YOUNG_GUN

i think u played it perfectly mate just unlucky with the river, 9/10 times you would have got the call on the river when they miss there queen as i said when they re-raise you its down to your instincts which are generally spot on from my experiance as it was here

Keep doing what  your doing JJ and you'll keep winning!

teachai

I definitely don't bet here.  Board is too wet m villain has stayed with us all the way and I have showdown value.

A decent villain would be raising the river for value.

I don't think your hand is strong enough to value bet the river.

N1CK

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : U guys use these 2 words alot, Ofc if he had a weaker ace (which I thought he did have, hence the bet), I would have played it perfectly!! But he didn't.... ......and I didn't.
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

see this is were you go wrong you shouldnt be thinking i thought he had hand x
you should be thinking hand x is in his range lol

The_Don90

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : see this is were you go wrong you shouldnt be thinking i thought he had hand x you should be thinking hand x is in his range lol
Posted by N1CK

now im no Neagranu or anything like that, but i like to name a players hand. Preferably as soon as possible in the hand, i dont want to have a range of hands. Id i have a range i can put myself ahead or behind far too easy. If i can name his whole cards and i get it correct, i know exactly where i am at all times.

N1CK

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river?:

In Response to Re: Do you bet for value on the river? : now im no Neagranu or anything like that, but i like to name a players hand. Preferably as soon as possible in the hand, i dont want to have a range of hands. Id i have a range i can put myself ahead or behind far too easy. If i can name his whole cards and i get it correct, i know exactly where i am at all times.
Posted by The_Don90

i totally agree with you Don