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Live poker " Protecting your cards "
A situation arose at the weekend which in my years playing have never witnessed and say to anyone please please protect your hand, it's so so important...
Venue DTD friday night Deep stack £60 freezeout. We were already 4-5 hours into this tournament and the field of 102 was now down to 17. Action was folded round to me on the button, std raise with the monster of Q8, SB annouces " I'm all in " ( 22k ) , BB announces " I'm all in " ( 12k ), at this point as the decision was back on me, some confusion rose between dealer and BB. At which point it concluded the dealer had by mistake MUCKED the BB's hand. I eventually folded which ended up with the SB winning the pot uncontested and the BB was out without seeing a showdown. Had the players cards been protected then his hand would never have ended up in the muck. How this happened I will never know just a lapse of concentration from the dealer.
The guy was understandably very upset, as he had played for 4-5 hrs and to be out in such a way obviously sucks.
I wonder what is the ruling if the cards were protected and the dealer still manages to muck his cards??? Anyone know??
GB
Venue DTD friday night Deep stack £60 freezeout. We were already 4-5 hours into this tournament and the field of 102 was now down to 17. Action was folded round to me on the button, std raise with the monster of Q8, SB annouces " I'm all in " ( 22k ) , BB announces " I'm all in " ( 12k ), at this point as the decision was back on me, some confusion rose between dealer and BB. At which point it concluded the dealer had by mistake MUCKED the BB's hand. I eventually folded which ended up with the SB winning the pot uncontested and the BB was out without seeing a showdown. Had the players cards been protected then his hand would never have ended up in the muck. How this happened I will never know just a lapse of concentration from the dealer.
The guy was understandably very upset, as he had played for 4-5 hrs and to be out in such a way obviously sucks.
I wonder what is the ruling if the cards were protected and the dealer still manages to muck his cards??? Anyone know??
GB
Comments
Also, totally unrelated, but i always wait until the button has acted before i even look at my cards when i'm in the blinds.
its just habit.
I just need to clear up a little confusion in this Thread.
The unfortunate situation is repeatedly described as a "dealer error". It is absolutely & 100% NOT a Dealer Error - it is a "player error", with due respect.
If this is not pointed out, it will happen again & again.
In Live Poker, the following is universally true....
"It is the players responsibility to protect his hand at all times".
If he or she fails so to do, it's no good blaming the Dealer - it is the PLAYERS fault. We need to be accountable to ourselves, & not blame others for our own shortcomings.
It is particularly important to protect one's hand when in Seat 1, or 9/10.
One other Poster asked what happens if one's hand IS protected & the Dealer still accidentally mucks it. If no action has taken place, in this particular circumstance, a good TD will usually allow the accidentally mucked hand to be retrieved from the muck, provided it can be exactly identified (rank AND suit).
and i owe tk £2.50 and half a poker chip...lol
x
It always has been, is, & always will be, the players responsibility to protect their cards.
She leaves her cards some way fom the Rail, & completely unprotected.
The Ruling was correct, & if she has anything at all betwen her ears, she won't make the same mistake again.
We just can't be blaming others for our own mistakes, we are deluding ourselves if we do.
She can protect her hand in any number of ways, & she failed in all of them.
She does not need a chip to protect her cards, she can.....
1) Use a card-protector.
2) Hold her hands on top of her cards, exactly as you or most other sensible players would.
3) It's not usually obligatory to move your chips over the line when All-In - simply stating "I am all-in", verbally acknowledged by the Dealer, suffices more often than not. Serial shovers with mountains of chips would slow the game unacceptably if moving a huge stack back & forth every few hands. So she can place her hand UNDER her stack, whether it is across the bet line or not.
4) Custom & practice allows, when moving all-in, leaving a single (lowest-denom) chip behind, on top of one's hand, to protect it.
She failed to do all or any of those.
Many of the Sky Poker players are or will be newbies to Live Poker, & to my mind, it's very important that they understand the convention in this matter.
It's one of the few Rules of Poker upon which ALL authorities ageree, particularly the TDA, & Robert's Rules of Poker, which states clearly & simply.....
"You must protect your own hand at all times. Your cards may be protected with your hands, a chip, or other object placed on top of them. If you fail to protect your hand, you will have no redress if it becomes fouled or the dealer accidentally kills it."
I'm not sure, considering all that, how the Dealer becomes a "moron", & we are supposed to sympathise with the player!
I have only ever played online poker and so live poker is a completely new arena to me.
Everything you have said makes sense and the video link in Aaron`s post highlights the importance of making sure your cards are protected. It can mean the difference between `life or death` in a poker tournament and can be a very costly mistake to a player who doesn`t protect their cards.
Thank you xx
She's all in and sat with her cards out from, hands completely off the table. That's crazy.
I swear as the dealer reaches across to muck her cards she looks at his hands as it happens, pauses... and then says something!