what d you do here?

rats107

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
F_Ivanovic	Small blind		20.00	20.00	2776.50
smartca627	Big blind		40.00	60.00	2763.00
	Your hole cards	10 K
whalen	Fold
limp call	Call		40.00	100.00	3650.00
visgrand28	Fold
rats107	Raise		120.00	220.00	1767.50
F_Ivanovic	Fold
smartca627	Fold
limpcall	Call		80.00	300.00	3570.00
Flop
		Q 4 9
limp call	Check
rats107	Bet		150.00	450.00	1617.50
limp call	Raise		480.00	930.00	3090.00
rats107

rats107

mtt, 1st hour, limp call hasn't played many hands and dont think hes limped yet.   i've not played many hands cause i'm super tight and man u liverpool highlights were on...

Batkin88

i would go for broke and shove, ur there to win!
Cross ur fingers and hope he fold or ur heart comes down!!!

LOL_RAISE

yeah i definately shove here

YOUNG_GUN

You'd have to shove in that spot imo, due to your stack size no other play is good here. cant be folding with flush draw and gutshot, Cant call as your be calling too much of your stack. by shoving here you have 2 chances either they fold and you pick up over a 3rd of what you started the hand with, or they call and you up to 15 outs

tell me you shoved here and hit straight flush that be top

theneons

for some reason, despite the logic behind the shove, i very rarely get lucky in this spot with shipping it despite the outs and would consider nit folding. its early doors here.

limp call = mid PP. my guess is that your oppo has hit a set and i would spew if i called and went broke in the second level. theres just something very unsatisfactory about shipping it with draws early in a MTT. Cash? different box of frogs. you can always reload.

by letting it go in this spot, your still left with 40BB and a chance to find a better spot to ship it and accumulate.

im not saying i would always fold here, but shoving isnt the only option. 

im eagely awaiting getting torn apart on this thread now.

LOL_RAISE

calling is definately better than folding if you dont want to jam

dylan12

Ship it!!

In your spot there I do a little dance and press All in baby!!
You obviously brick but never mind - I ship it all the time here!!

YOUNG_GUN

Lol raise thats wrong Call is never better folding here imo, basically if your calling your pretty commited and not worth folding with draws etc even if blank turn, also you dont beat bluffs this way as they could easily bluff you of if your that tight. imo Shove> Fold> Call

DeucesLive

only options when you have that strong a draw is shove or fold, no question. If you call, you're going to hate whatever comes on the turn unless it's your miracle card, and the presence of a potential completed draw might even scare your opponent off if they're good, and you miss out on the extra chips. The best value of a draw comes in having the double odds of winning- taking it down there and then by opponent folding, but if they do call- you have a monster draw with plenty of cards to hit.

Looking at the hand, he probably has a Q with average kicker is my guess, Q10/QJ, or maybe Q9 for 2 pair if you're unlucky. The amount involved means he's probably, but not definitely calling a shove, and if he does there's every chance your king's also live for another 3 outs. He could have a weaker flush draw, or an open ended straight draw. No question whatsoever I'm shoving that.

YOUNG_GUN

In Response to Re: what d you do here?:

only options when you have that strong a draw is shove or fold, no question. If you call, you're going to hate whatever comes on the turn unless it's your miracle card, and the presence of a potential completed draw might even scare your opponent off if they're good, and you miss out on the extra chips. The best value of a draw comes in having the double odds of winning- taking it down there and then by opponent folding, but if they do call- you have a monster draw with plenty of cards to hit. Looking at the hand, he probably has a Q with average kicker is my guess, Q10/QJ, or maybe Q9 for 2 pair if you're unlucky. The amount involved means he's probably, but not definitely calling a shove, and if he does there's every chance your king's also live for another 3 outs. He could have a weaker flush draw, or an open ended straight draw. No question whatsoever I'm shoving that.
Posted by DeucesLive

+1 thats put very well i must say, this is what i mean but you word it 10000000000% better lol

LOL_RAISE

folding has an EV of 0.

there is 930 in the pot and we have to call 330. we improve to straight/flush 25% of the time on the turn vs a range of QQ,44,99,AA,KK,Q9s. we need to get 3:1 for this call to have an EV of 0. at the moment we dont.

the pot size on the turn will be 1200.

we need to win 240chips everytime we improve on the turn for this call to be breakeven and have the same EV as folding.

shove />call>fold imo

DeucesLive

If you call, you are only giving yourself a 25% chance of winning the pot- the river card now is essentially dead, because you're pretty sure he'll bet the turn heavily enough to force you to fold if you don't hit. That means that by calling, you're saying I HAVE to make my hand on this street, or I'm dead. If his hand is weak enough that he'd check the turn, then shoving the flop would make him fold. As it is, calling gives him another option to bluff you off on the turn by shoving- you just won't have the odds to make the call.

Fold and avoid causing any further damage, or shove and give yourself every chance to win. But don't (IMO) donk off a further 300 chips on a draw.

Fwiw, I think folding in this spot is a bad move too, I just think it's ever so slightly preferable to calling. Shoving is the only move here with this hand for me. With a bigger stack (5/6k+), then *maybe* the call becomes more of an option over folding, but I would be even more inclined to shove then unless I'm up against an equally large stack, in which case you don't want to risk it.

beaneh

The law states that when you raise up a soooted king ten and flop a gusthot straight flush draw that you are not allowed to do a fold. That leaves us with only shove or call, we might miss so cawling smells LETS GO ARRRR EEEEEEEEEEEN