i have to warn you...it's that omaha hi-lo hand...

TRIP5

i got told off for this call...on the flop i was playing for the low and by the shove there was too much in the pot to fold imo....

i would appreciate comments about the play....

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
J-Hartigan	Small blind		10.00	10.00	1995.00
TRIP5	Big blind		20.00	30.00	1980.00
	Your hole cards	2 6 5 3
SoLack	Call		20.00	50.00	1980.00
scotty77	Raise		80.00	130.00	1920.00
TommyD	Call		80.00	210.00	1925.00
BANDICOOT	Fold
J-Hartigan	Fold
TRIP5	Call		60.00	270.00	1920.00
SoLack	Call		60.00	330.00	1920.00
Flop
		5 Q 8
TRIP5	Bet		165.00	495.00	1755.00
SoLack	Fold
scotty77	Call		165.00	660.00	1755.00
TommyD	Raise		990.00	1650.00	935.00
TRIP5	Call		825.00	2475.00	930.00
scotty77	All-in		1755.00	4230.00	0.00
TommyD	All-in		935.00	5165.00	0.00
TRIP5	All-in		930.00	6095.00	0.00
TommyD	Unmatched bet		5.00	6090.00	5.00
TRIP5	Show	2 6 5 3
scotty77	Show	9 7 4 6
TommyD	Show	10 A K 2
Turn
		J
River
		5
TRIP5	Win high	Three 5s	6090.00		6090.00
	No qualifying low hand

go easy on me, i'm learning...

xx

scotty77

yeah id like comments about mine too

at the time i was like ok im gonna play this tournie like omaha...i have outs and i might dodge get it in on the first hand plzzzzzzzzzzz

5toneFace

The aim of the game is to be trying to win the hi and low. Your only going for the low, firstly you dont have the nut low draw, A 2, so you need an Ace to come for you to have the nut low. Then you will only really win half the pot. And secondly, A low might not even come. Its all about the scoop in this game. Like Tommys hand, he has nut high draw and nut low draw. Dunno how he loses to a scoop lol. 

Id check fold your hand probably on that flop. Maybe see one cheap card

beaneh

In Response to Re: i have to warn you...it's that omaha hi-lo hand...:

yeah id like comments about mine too at the time i was like ok im gonna play this tournie like omaha...i have outs and i might dodge get it in on the first hand plzzzzzzzzzzz
Posted by scotty77

omg even I know your open is so tez

hahahahaha

Play A2 and fold all else. make hi nuts by riv with your other cards when low isn't in play. profits.

TommyD

LOL

Oh great, this hand grrr.

I'm going to be frank, I have no idea how my flop raise didn't take it down there and then.

Trip's - You're starting hand isn't that great, just because you have 4 cards under eight it doesn't make it an automatic play in Hi/Lo.  You have a one gapped run down with one suit.  In your spot I'd call pre as well as you're in the blinds.  You're looking for a board ideally with an Ace and at least one other low card (A4X Rainbow is your dream flop without flopping a made straight and low).  You've missed this flop to be honest.  There are a lot of hands people play in high low which are drawing to a much better low (A-baby).  For the nut low you are drawing to an ace, the equivalent to drawing for a gutshot.  Also there is a very slim chance you are drawing to the high.  In the long run against 2 players I think this is a losing call Trip.

Scotty - In PLO high, you've got a very nice draw indeed, a nice wrap draw.  However in Hi/Lo you should have folded pre.  Middle cards are very problematic in Hi/Lo, as most of your straight outs give half the pot to a decent low draw.  As played on the flop I'm still folding at this stage in the MTT.  I know you can argue you're playing for the high to essentially take half a stack from one player as you have two opponents, but you have to think any club kills you and you only have the Hi Draw.  Pre flop you're hand really is a bag of spanners in Hi/Lo.

Ok, my own play.  I didn't need to gamble this early.  I've only got the one low draw, albeit the nut low and I should only have the one high draw (the club flush).  I probably should have controlled the pot and seen a turn cheaply.  However if this was a cash game I'm doing this mover every day of the week.

By the way, I'm not the one who told off Trip's.  My comment at the end was 'How can I miss half the deck ... VNH.'  On reflection I was wrong, after the turn it's more like three quarters

LOL_RAISE

lol wat Tommy id be jamming this all day long with 2 nut draws. halfpot lead on this board is generally pretty weak and obv scotty has nothing because he just flats it.


ya scotty in hi/lo middling run downs are the worst starting hands, lose a big pot or chop a medium pot.

jakally

I would err towards folding this pre flop.

You need an A to hit, to make any kind of decent low, which instantly gives someone else a better hi (unless you get A4x). So you are playing for half the pot a chunk of the time.

Probs fold the flop as well (I am a nit...obv).

Too often get 2nd best hand both ways.

TRIP5

scotty always raises my blinds so not really a raise pre to be respected and due to the flat pre from tommy i didn't put him on any sort of set on the flop.

scotty flatted my oop 1/2 pot flop raise and tommy button raised..not out of scottys range to be floating the flop or tommys range to be raising the button with air hoping to take the pot then...

scotty's all in again i read as trying to steal the pot...with a mid drawing hand just in case he was as called...tommy: i thought might be calling with high st draw or aa xx...considering what was in the pot already everyone else was still drawing or had pockets and i still had extensions 

prob not a winning play over time but i would never usually make this call...i was playing the players and not the players cards, it's just this time i was wrong...badly...but very lucky too

plus, you should know by now that if there is a sniff of a trip5 anywhere then my chips are going in...

saying that...how did tommy miss his trizillion outs...

xx

BrownnDog

How did Tommy loseeeee

TommyD

In Response to Re: i have to warn you...it's that omaha hi-lo hand...:

lol wat Tommy id be jamming this all day long with 2 nut draws. halfpot lead on this board is generally pretty weak and obv scotty has nothing because he just flats it. ya scotty in hi/lo middling run downs are the worst starting hands, lose a big pot or chop a medium pot.
Posted by LOL_RAISE

I've got no real issue with how I played the hand, just thinking maybe it isn't great MTT play to risk it all on a draw on the third hand of a MTT.  But I'll probably do it again

beaneh

In Response to Re: i have to warn you...it's that omaha hi-lo hand...:

In Response to Re: i have to warn you...it's that omaha hi-lo hand... : I've got no real issue with how I played the hand, just thinking maybe it isn't great MTT play to risk it all on a draw on the third hand of a MTT.  But I'll probably do it again
Posted by TommyD

I think it's perfect especially if your oppo is bad enough to open 4678 lol.

TRIP5

ooops...tommy & scotty this hand is going to be on the primo tommorow night where i fully expect to get tarred and feathered for this play....

xx

Talon

 Only just noticed this thread.

  Firstly i quite like your call preflop it is the sort of hand that is good to take a flop and see where you are.After the flop however pretty much everything you did was wrong.There is one mistake that you see time and time again in PLO8 and this is what you did in this hand. The biggest mistake you can make is to call big bets hoping to get lucky in order to win half the pot.

  If you look at your hand after the flop you had bottom pair bad kicker and no real draws to win the high pot, also you have the third nut Lo draw. Basically you have nothing but a bad draw hoping for a split. This hand is instafold on that board everytime even to a weak bet let alone the betting that happened.Although you got lucky and won you couldnt have played it much worse. I hope you continue to play this great game and have good success

TRIP5

ahhhhh thanks talon

my only defence is it stunk of a steal....

i like playing for the low pot though, everyone is playing for the high pot so if i get both then bonus but by playing for the low pot i get half of everyone elses stack too and keeps my stack raising nicely..though usually i have the a2 obv.

now i get to show everyone what a total mess i made of this hand live on 856..brilliant.

still, it should mean i get more action on the cash tables....

xx

Talon

  There are advantages to playing to just one of the pots whether it be Hi or Lo. In that circumstance you want to keep the betting relatively small so as to keep the pot multiway and therefore getting half of a 3 or 4 way pot. But the disadvantage is with Lo hands there is always the chance of splitting that pot and therfore only quartering the pot and not even getting your bets back.

TommyD

Can't wait to see it on the Clinic Trips

TRIP5

i soooo rocked the pineapple

xx

TommyD

Very good interview Irene, nicely done.