using the clock

tiercel

want to raise something Ed said last night. A mail asked if letting the clock run down on the bubble was fair and Mr. G said yes. I wonder . I was asked on the final table bubble if we should let the blinds circle and not play and let the other table fight it out. To me this smacked  of collusion , not to mention the other table could do the same until everyone was blinded out. I think that running the clock down is a similar situation and can lead to frustration and frayed tempers and , if everyone does it ( esp. now it has the Ed seal of approval ) what that do to the game. Some sites lock the bubble tables into sync. to prevent this happening. The mailer said the other players were OK with it. Should they be ? I think not . Discuss .

tiercel

Don't know if it was clear but I mean running down the clock to get in the hope that someone else bubbles out.

YOUNG_GUN

I think should be hand for hand leading up to bubble

What you have described is colluding although done something similar in sateilte to my benefit so cant really complain about it.

Satelites and bubble time can understand why people do it but it doesnt always work out for them and its not a bad tactic imo although personally i dont do it on the bubble

Mohican

To openly discuss letting the blinds circle is collusion. If everyone lets the timer run down(time banking I think it's called) without a discussion,then that's fine.It's a legitimate tactic,especially if you're short stacked or it's a satellite tournament.

GaryQQQ

There was a thread about this the other day.

Most people were of the opinion that it's a valid tactic. It's always going to happen unless hand-for-hand comes in.

Poker is a dog-eat-dog game, if running the clock down increases your chance of winning you should do it.

J-Hartigan

Yes, letting the clock run down is fair.

Yes, it's collusion (and against the rules) if players openly discuss folding their way to the final table.

Yes, it should be (and, hopefully one day will be) hand-for-hand leading up to the FT bubble.

tiercel

Fair enough . If everyone accepts it as a tactic then its fair enough. It makes me uncomfortable as does slow rolling and I won't go along with it so roll on sychro. tables. But James please don't shout . lol .

Oh and when you introduce synchro tables how about not dealing cards to absent players. It affects the pack for the rest and would avoid the stuation I saw recently where a player lost a hand to an absentee and even the possibility that two absentees could be battling for the bubble. 

EdGiddins

In Response to Re: using the clock:

To openly discuss letting the blinds circle is collusion. If everyone lets the timer run down(time banking I think it's called) without a discussion,then that's fine.It's a legitimate tactic,especially if you're short stacked or it's a satellite tournament.
Posted by Mohican

what he said

acebarry10

I feel it is a fair, and legitmate tactic, long may it continue

J-Hartigan

In Response to Re: using the clock:

Fair enough . If everyone accepts it as a tactic then its fair enough. It makes me uncomfortable as does slow rolling and I won't go along with it so roll on sychro. tables. But James please don't shout . lol . Oh and when you introduce synchro tables how about not dealing cards to absent players. It affects the pack for the rest and would avoid the stuation I saw recently where a player lost a hand to an absentee and even the possibility that two absentees could be battling for the bubble. 
Posted by tiercel

Good point.  In fact, to mirror live play, cards should be dealt to absent players, but their hands should be auto-folded - even if they're all-in in the sb/bb.  They should NOT be allowed to contest pots and potentially double up!

MADMOO

Fair enough letting the timer run down its your time use it how you want.
The thing I think is wrong (I have seen 1 player do it many times in sats) is disconnecting every hand to get the extra time. He would always be back for the next hand, then do it again...

tiercel

To this and JH's response I agree. There are also those who sit "away" until they hit a good hand and then leap in to cach a stealer. Rhings within the rules but annoying. 
 n Response to Re: using the clock:

Fair enough letting the timer run down its your time use it how you want. The thing I think is wrong (I have seen 1 player do it many times in sats) is disconnecting every hand to get the extra time. He would always be back for the next hand, then do it again...
Posted by MADMOO

tiercel

Footnote to this . I have just played heads up against an AWAY player . Had a sorre finger clicking the raise button repeaedly but the silly part came when his chip stack got down to the minimum  and he was allin vry hand. His cards kept winning. It was only a matter of time before I got him but what a waste of time - and his money.


 Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to Re: using the clock : Good point.  In fact, to mirror live play, cards should be dealt to absent players, but their hands should be auto-folded - even if they're all-in in the sb/bb.  They should NOT be allowed to contest pots and potentially double up!
Posted by J-Hartigan

shelski

In Response to using the clock:
I don't see an ethical query here. People that ONLY gamble with others because thay consider that they have a skill edge have no right to question the rules. The rules were independant of moral issues before the tourney started. Yeah collude, scheme do what you like. If you operate within the rules it's as cool as a penguins pee-hole. Also if people do it to you don't cry. C'est la vie et bon chance my lord.
P.S - It's also your own life you're wasting so go figure.

SHANXTA

In Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to using the clock : I don't see an ethical query here. People that ONLY gamble with others because thay consider that they have a skill edge have no right to question the rules. The rules were independant of moral issues before the tourney started. Yeah collude, scheme do what you like. If you operate within the rules it's as cool as a penguins pee-hole. Also if people do it to you don't cry. C'est la vie et bon chance my lord. P.S - It's also your own life you're wasting so go figure.
Posted by shelski

ok, but when colluding is against the rules......

shelski

In Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to Re: using the clock : ok, but when colluding is against the rules......
Posted by SHANXTA

When you are on the phone or use msn ?

ACESOVER8s

In Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to Re: using the clock : When you are on the phone or use msn ?
Posted by shelski

Yes..... being on the phone or using MSN to collude is against the rules??? Are you trying to say you think this is acceptable???

Don't get me wrong i know it goes on all the time but it is still cheating to conspire with another player to take money off a third party. In fact your scenario is the very defenition of collusion lol

shelski

In Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to Re: using the clock : Yes..... being on the phone or using MSN to collude is against the rules??? Are you trying to say you think this is acceptable??? Don't get me wrong i know it goes on all the time but it is still cheating to conspire with another player to take money off a third party. In fact your scenario is the very defenition of collusion lol
Posted by ACESOVER8s

i know it goes on all the time.
Omg this really is a can of worms. I merely suggested that this was cheating as opposed to using your time which is not. I never liked tourneys anyway. Now i will never play them again. Thx for your advice.

ACESOVER8s

In Response to Re: using the clock:

In Response to Re: using the clock : i know it goes on all the time. Omg this really is a can of worms. I merely suggested that this was cheating as opposed to using your time which is not. I never liked tourneys anyway. Now i will never play them again. Thx for your advice.
Posted by shelski

Sorry i read your post to mean you thought that anything goes lol