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Whoopsie!

phil12ukphil12uk
edited January 2011 in The Poker Clinic
It's pretty thin value to bet both streets but seems fine. Don't mind checking the flop for pot control on occasion. As played this is a relatively easy fold with no extensive history.
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Comments

  • phil12ukphil12uk
    edited January 2011
    Looking back at this hand, I'm not too happy with my flop and turn bets with them possibly being a bit larger. I was trying to keep villain interested if drawing to 4th spade as the pre flop play suggests my hand was good whilst also keeping a bit of pot control.  Villain is a decent semi reg who I have played with a fair bit (not much recently tho). The turn shove therefore surprised me and makes the fold correct - doesn't it??? (HH:333555617)
    WhiteTrash Small blind   £1.00 £1.00 £197.00
    XERXES24 Big blind   £2.00 £3.00 £616.27
      Your hole cards
    • Q
    • Q
    		     
    hurst05 Fold        
    villain Raise   £8.00 £11.00 £291.20
    phil12uk Raise   £26.00 £37.00 £190.20
    RUNITSRANN Fold        
    WhiteTrash Fold        
    XERXES24 Fold        
    villain Call   £18.00 £55.00 £273.20
    Flop
       
    • 4
    • 3
    • J
    		     
    villain Check        
    phil12uk Bet   £32.00 £87.00 £158.20
    villain Call   £32.00 £119.00 £241.20
    Turn
       
    • 9
    		     
    villain Check        
    phil12uk Bet   £60.00 £179.00 £98.20
    villain All-in   £241.20 £420.20 £0.00
    phil12uk Fold      
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited January 2011
    hows it thin value? 3 bet smaller pre
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited January 2011
    Defo bet more on flop £40+ minimum. I can't see how the 9 helped him at all, seems to me only a set beats you which is pretty sick. Also why do you bet 60 into 120 on the turn doesn't really make sense, and surely you can't bet 60 then fold for another 98, wouldn't it be easier to just shove the turn and let him decide what to do?
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  • phil12ukphil12uk
    edited January 2011
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie!:
    Defo bet more on flop £40+ minimum. I can't see how the 9 helped him at all, seems to me only a set beats you which is pretty sick. Also why do you bet 60 into 120 on the turn doesn't really make sense, and surely you can't bet 60 then fold for another 98, wouldn't it be easier to just shove the turn and let him decide what to do?
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    ...........and if he has the set?

    Also, if I check behind on the turn and he is drawing to flush, I'm giving him a free card.
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited January 2011
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie!:
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie! : ...........and if he has the set? Also, if I check behind on the turn and he is drawing to flush, I'm giving him a free card.
    Posted by phil12uk
    Yes but how often does he have it and what does bet folding £60 achieve, i admit I hate cash poker but shoving seems the best option, of course I'm probably wrong someone please correct me.
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  • mattyd86mattyd86
    edited January 2011
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie!:
    hows it thin value? 3 bet smaller pre
    Posted by N1CK
    Depends what you view villain's range to be.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited January 2011
    im always torn between checking and betting this flop, you want to bet not to give AK with spade a free card but what do you do if you get chk raised? and he can flop the nuts here
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  • shaun09shaun09
    edited January 2011
    You have put half your stack in middle. I would be snap calling and getting stacked probablt. But thats why you play high stakes because you can make these folds.

    In my terms If id bet the same as you at 5p/10p and my stack was 10 quid and id put 5 quid already in middle by turn, Im probably calling his shove on turn for another 5 quid. I know its small amounts compared to 200nl

    mayb his got ace 9 (ace spade) and is shoving for you to fold or even if you call he has outs. :/
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  • pod1pod1
    edited January 2011
    i am a big girl so im folding the river!!!
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  • mattyd86mattyd86
    edited January 2011
    I don't mind checking the flop because this allows you to get 2 clean streets of value if no scare cards come. Now that I read (these HH's tilt me) he had 98 behind I'd just shove the turn as played.
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  • LOL_RAISELOL_RAISE
    edited January 2011

    id be snapping it off expecting to be good the majority of the time
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  • TommyDTommyD
    edited January 2011
    I'm probably betting the flop and checking back the turn with the intention to call a non spade/non ace river.  I might even keep it very level 1 and V-bet to a check on the river on some cards.  As played you've put in too much to fold now, you have to call imo and you will be good more times than you think.
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited January 2011
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie!:
    id be snapping it off expecting to be good the majority of the time
    Posted by LOL_RAISE

    This, i have feeling they could have AJ with Ace of spades
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  • offshootoffshoot
    edited January 2011
    whatr benefit does shoving turn have if he has AJ with a spade? im not saying he cant have it but if he does have AJ with a spade i would imagine getting it in on the flop would be more likely, either that or he just calls down. When he shoves turn he doesnt expect you to fold, and i doubt he expects you to have worse than QQ often.

    The fact that he delayed making his move til the turn and til you'd put more money in suggests to me that he has a strong hand.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited January 2011
    In Response to Re: Whoopsie!:
    whatr benefit does shoving turn have if he has AJ with a spade? im not saying he cant have it but if he does have AJ with a spade i would imagine getting it in on the flop would be more likely, either that or he just calls down. When he shoves turn he doesnt expect you to fold, and i doubt he expects you to have worse than QQ often. The fact that he delayed making his move til the turn and til you'd put more money in suggests to me that he has a strong hand.
    Posted by offshoot
    i agree with this, he can only expect you to fold air when he shoves here, Hey its a monotone flop he must be drawing to a spade because no-one every flops the nuts!!!
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  • hurst05hurst05
    edited January 2011
    if this is who i think it is then he probs has AJ with A of spades lol
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited January 2011
    This be another good one on the poker clinic.....
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  • phil12ukphil12uk
    edited January 2011
    I pretty much figured what Offshoot wrote - he reckons I can't fold and wants the extra £100. Also think that I should have checked back on the turn but didn't want potential flusher getting a free card. One of them yucky spots!!
    WhiteTrash Small blind   £1.00 £1.00 £197.00
    XERXES24 Big blind   £2.00 £3.00 £616.27
      Your hole cards
    • Q
    • Q
    		     
    hurst05 Fold        
    villain Raise   £8.00 £11.00 £291.20
    phil12uk Raise   £26.00 £37.00 £190.20
    RUNITSRANN Fold        
    WhiteTrash Fold        
    XERXES24 Fold        
    villain Call   £18.00 £55.00 £273.20
    Flop
       
    • 4
    • 3
    • J
    		     
    villain Check        
    phil12uk Bet   £32.00 £87.00 £158.20
    villain Call   £32.00 £119.00 £241.20
    Turn
       
    • 9
    		     
    villain Check        
    phil12uk Bet   £60.00 £179.00 £98.20
    villain All-in   £241.20 £420.20 £0.00
    phil12uk Fold        
    villain Show
    • J
    • J
    		     
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited January 2011
    Good fold Phil, strange one that with flush out they didnt get in on flop?

    Dont think anyone put him on JJ here lol
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