DYM - What should I do now?

JingleMa

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
JingleMa	Small blind		15.00	15.00	1735.00
chico383	Big blind		30.00	45.00	2305.00
	Your hole cards	J 10
BANKSEY	Raise		90.00	135.00	1660.00
TheBouncer	Fold
_4JACKS	Fold
RaginRhino	Fold
JingleMa	Call		75.00	210.00	1660.00
chico383	Call		60.00	270.00	2245.00
Flop
		9 Q Q
JingleMa	Check
chico383	Bet		135.00	405.00	2110.00
BANKSEY	Call		135.00	540.00	1525.00
JingleMa	Call		135.00	675.00	1525.00
Turn
		K
Jinglema ?

So how have I played this so far and what should I do next? Should I lead out on the turn and if so how much? What hands should I be putting my oppo's on?

iBLUFF

imo u played this hand well i call pre aswell but it is me.. on the flop u HAVE to for 135 into 675 as for what to put ur opponant on i would say QJ or KQ is a big posibility here.

Dudeskin8

DYM I snap fold preflop, 1735 before you call is a stable stack, whilst when you call your OOP post flop and have to hit fairly hard to continue. Maybe if you had the button I'd be more inclined but I would personally still snap fold the hand.

You call the weak bet on flop then hit your hand, I would be tempted to check again hoping for a bet so I can jam overtop but you could also bet out doesn't really matter though as you never folding the hand.

ROBBIEROTT

call pre flop sometimes depends purely how i feel so while the chips are still low i could call easily call or fold easily this  marginal hand, but in the way u called the flop must mean you r hoping to hit the k or the 8, so i would be playing this aggresive from here on, chances of flush draws and maybe u could even split the pot take it down here and move to the next hand

DOHHHHHHH

I would question the call pre flop? 

I tend to fold hands like this in spots like this .................

I normally get to thr 50/100 level with between 1.7 and 2.5k chips........Does this mean Im playing too tight in these?

ROBBIEROTT

i just think suited hands with a 3x raise in  early levels are fine, if the levels were higher i could easily fold.these hand can be easily disguised aswelll

ROBBIEROTT

and to answer your question am i playing to tight, legend like you, as long as ur making profit!!!

iBLUFF

In Response to Re: DYM - What should I do now?:

I would question the call pre flop?  I tend to fold hands like this in spots like this ................. I normally get to thr 50/100 level with between 1.7 and 2.5k chips........Does this mean Im playing too tight in these?
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

my reason for calling pre would be that its me jj...

GREGHOGG

Now you have to stack off on the turn.

Lead for 400 odd with the intention of getting it in against trip Q's

I never ever ever ever EVERRRRR call a raise with this hand pre at that early stage fwiw! no need to get involved with 10js.

The_Don90

In Response to Re: DYM - What should I do now?:

Now you have to stack off on the turn. Lead for 400 odd with the intention of getting it in against trip Q's I never ever ever ever EVERRRRR call a raise with this hand pre at that early stage fwiw! no need to get involved with 10js.
Posted by GREGHOGG

hoggers im getting scared sir this is the second dym pot in a row youve made that im saying +1 to,

+1

GREGHOGG

In Response to Re: DYM - What should I do now?:

In Response to Re: DYM - What should I do now? : hoggers im getting scared sir this is the second dym pot in a row youve made that im saying +1 to, +1
Posted by The_Don90

and to think that was at 3.30 am and i was totally wasted!!

I obv make the most sense when im pizzled lol

MP33

In Response to Re: DYM - What should I do now?:

I would question the call pre flop?  I tend to fold hands like this in spots like this ................. I normally get to thr 50/100 level with between 1.7 and 2.5k chips........Does this mean Im playing too tight in these?
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

I was waiting for an answer to this as I,m pretty much the same as youself and as much as I like the starting hand i,m foldin to, especially being out of position and against 2 players. Its to early to start gambling

I do play tight in these early on like yourself, but do cash in more than i don,t ( at around the £3 to £15 stakes)

There are exceptions to this depending on who I am playing. i often come up against the same players and do adjust my play accordingly.

Unknown

Call pre is bad, 1) oop and 2) no guarantee BB will call making your call profitable 3) its a dym chip preservation oop early on is paramount.

Flop call is fine.

Lead, c/r and c/c are all fine, with preference to lead /> c/r >>> c/c >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> c/f

JohnConnor

Personally I would snap fold pre as I don't want to play a speculative hand oop, level 2, for that price against only one or two opponents.

I would also fold the flop. I know that the pot odds are huge but I don't personally think pot odds are as important in DYMs as they are in other forms of poker (something to do with there being no 'future' - ie you don't play for the win and it doesn't matter if reach 3rd with 1 chip or 10,000). I believe that risk aversion is more important and this is a good spot to show it I think. For one thing, you could be dead already. Some will say this is far too tight thinking but it's level 2 of a DYM. If you fold here you cannot lose the DYM because of this hand. If you play on, you can. You can only lose a small percentage of DYMs in level 2 and still be profitable as you need to reach the bubble the vast majority of the time. You would need to do a guesstimate of how often you will lose if you play this. I sense it is too high for my personal taste.

Anyway, I'm happy to accept that for most people it's far too tight to even consider we're dead on the flop, after all there is no fd to scare us it's just the house. However, looking at your draw it seems that half of it (specifically the K) is dead as well as KQ is well within the openers range (slow playing the flop) and also the BB who weak(ish) donked the flop could have any queen so your 8 could even be dead.

To put it a slightly different (hopefully clearer) way. If you continue on this flop you are hoping for an eventual board of 9-Q-Q-K-x or 9-Q-Q-8-x. These are both boards I want to play a small pot with (particularly due to the DYM considerations) when I have 10-J. This can never happen now. The pot is already big, you're stack is too small for it and your oop and therefore not in charge of the pot size.

For the reasons above I am very rarely going to be in this spot but it seems clear that you need to stack off now. So I go with Gregs suggestion and definately lead weak and expect to get it in against AQ, Q10, or any rag Q plenty of times but against a FH just often enough to make the overall play unprofitable.

JC

salazar

if you're going to call on a paired board to hit a straight, then get the money in when you hit it. It's no good worrying about the full house now or you might as well not have called in the first place.

whether you should have called pre-flop or on the flop is up for debate, i personally hate calling trying to hit a straight on a paired board, but that's probably because i run so bad that i'm always up against a house when i hit.

You've done it now so start getting it in and worry about the house when the cards are turned over.

pot it atleast, i might even shove, Q isn't folding, and you might even get a call from a combo hand like A 10 spades.

CLIOKID

JT suited is a massive drawing hand.

You are out of position.

Do you really want to be playing a drawing hand out of position in a DYM? If you flop a flush draw, how are you going to play it? Are you going to play it weak and check call? Or play aggro and get it in? Same question applies for straight draws?

I don't really think there is anything to be gained by playing this hand. You are either going to bleed off chips by check calling or going to the races/hoping to get a fold by playing your draw aggressively.

If you had the button I think a call pre is fine. In the SB it's a fold.

In this situation you've hit your hand although can't be certain your ahead, but you've got what you wished for so you have to get it in. And I think a lead is the best way to achieve this.

Dudeskin8

Can you post the results already?

JingleMa

Thank you all for the detailed replies and advice - interesting to note that the general consensus is fold pre - I think I understand why - DYM = Survival of the fittest, not "speculate to accumulate".

I'll try to not keep Dudeskin in suspenders for too much longer...

JingleMa

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
JingleMa	Small blind		15.00	15.00	1735.00
chico383	Big blind		30.00	45.00	2305.00
	Your hole cards	J 10
BANKSEY	Raise		90.00	135.00	1660.00
TheBouncer	Fold
_4JACKS	Fold
RaginRhino	Fold
JingleMa	Call		75.00	210.00	1660.00
chico383	Call		60.00	270.00	2245.00
Flop
		9 Q Q
JingleMa	Check
chico383	Bet		135.00	405.00	2110.00
BANKSEY	Call		135.00	540.00	1525.00
JingleMa	Call		135.00	675.00	1525.00
Turn
		K
JingleMa	All-in		1525.00	2200.00	0.00
chico383	Fold
BANKSEY	All-in		1525.00	3725.00	0.00
JingleMa	Show	J 10
BANKSEY	Show	Q K
River
		7
BANKSEY	Win	Full House, Queens and Kings	3725.00		3725.00

JingleMa

As you can see I did shove on the turn thinking pot was plenty big already and make opps pay the max for anything they were chasing, but I was dead - fold pre!