You need to be logged in to your Sky Poker account above to post discussions and comments.

You might need to refresh your page afterwards.

Sky Poker forums will be temporarily unavailable from 11pm Wednesday July 25th.
Sky Poker Forums is upgrading its look! Stay tuned for the big reveal!

The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!

edited March 2011 in Area 51
Now i will start off by saying im undecided by this and i love sky poker for it's comunity and tournements and im a recreational player who has a few good results and can hold my own i do not think i will be the next internet star lol but enjoy the game.
now to me the reason why they may fix it is simple it's common business sense if you only have the best players winning then the recreational players will not play or less will play as the oposition is to good which then diminishes you customer base which as we all know means less players playing sit and go,tournements and cash which means less rake for the operator,now  what could we do to make our business more sucessful hmmm we could tweak it just a little to level the playing field this way the less experienced players get to win too and get the required enjoyment from playing and keep comming back thinking positive that maybe they can win a little and at the same time getting the required enjoyment level out of there new hobby,which then ups your customer base which as we know more customers means MORE RAKE for the operator and that is FACT.
so to me this is a simple but very strong reason as to why they might tweak it a little,if it was your business and it could not be proved or amazingly difficult to prove as we all know it would be (i would imagine it would take a hell of a lot of time effort and money possibly just to get it to court to get access to the rng programme) so what would you do if it was your business.

Comments

  • edited March 2011
    Never thought of it that way  ;o)
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    Never thought of it that way  ;o)
    Posted by elsadog
    its business rule number 1 customer is king keep your customers happy!!!! simples
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : its business rule number 1 customer is king keep your customers happy!!!! simples
    Posted by dalty

    and everyone here in area 51 appears happy,

    well most of us are,

    i try and spread some love, but get told its unwanted :(
  • edited March 2011
    I think if I was a business like sky making so much money, the risk reward wouldn't be worth it.  Far better to rely on the fact that a lot of people enjoy spending disposable income on gambling and win or lose they will be back.  How many people do you know make a profit on horses or football coupons?  I know I don't but I still enjoy doing it.  Do you think ht bookies try to get the odd game or race fixed to ensure the punter wins so they come back.  No - they just trust their judgement in probability and accept that sometimes the punter will win even though the odds are in bookie's favour so long term he makes a profit - a bit like a skilled poker player v a less skilled.  He will hit his miracle card sometimes anyway so no need to fix it in his favour
  • edited March 2011
    do you belive horse racing or dog racing is corrupt???
    if you do ask yourself this why is it companies like sadbrokes and mr hills are allowed to own dog tracks ie monmore because surely this is a conflict of interests if mr x puts his 10 acc on in sadbrokes and the first nine win and his last one runs at monmore in the 415 and he stands to win 2 million do you not think sadbrokes will do everything in there power to get it beat ie pull the bunny late trap opening to stop the speedy traper afterall it is there track and there staff that drive the hare!!so if you believe this then you believ that these companies are open to corruption afterall why would they want to own a dog track they do not make much money they could invest there money in better more profitable things surely or are they after an edge over the punters and why is it within the gambling industry that it is accepted for them to have this conflict of interests and why have the government not looked in to this conflict of interests may be some one gets a backhander and as we all know with government this is not so unbelievable now is it.so if you believe they could be corrupt then you must ask yourself this why would they not tweak the rng to keep the bussiness plan on track.
    over to you x files
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    I think if I was a business like sky making so much money, the risk reward wouldn't be worth it.  Far better to rely on the fact that a lot of people enjoy spending disposable income on gambling and win or lose they will be back.  How many people do you know make a profit on horses or football coupons?  I know I don't but I still enjoy doing it.  Do you think ht bookies try to get the odd game or race fixed to ensure the punter wins so they come back.  No - they just trust their judgement in probability and accept that sometimes the punter will win even though the odds are in bookie's favour so long term he makes a profit - a bit like a skilled poker player v a less skilled.  He will hit his miracle card sometimes anyway so no need to fix it in his favour
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    very nieve the bookmaking industry is the greediest industry out there i know i work in it they tell us to push push push roulette get em on it do freebies etc then they sneakily hide the gamcare leaflets in a remote corner they want everypenny out of everyone and if you belive corruption is not in this industry you are very nieve my friend.now im not saying either way wether it is rigged or not but the arguments for being so is very compeling.
  • edited March 2011
    They get their edge on the punter by giving them slightly worse odds than they truly believe so if they think a horse / dog / player / team has a 50/50 chance of winning they give you odds of 5/6, so if they get 10 bets of £6 on 10 different 50/50s believing they will win 5 and lose 5 the take in £60 and pay out £55.  And since most punters put on accumulators, every extra horse or team they add tips the %margin between offered odds and actual perceived possibility in the bookie's favour.  This is how they make their money and why small, local bookies who could never have the clout to influence any result also make profit
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : very nieve the bookmaking industry is the greediest industry out there i know i work in it they tell us to push push push roulette get em on it do freebies etc then they sneakily hide the gamcare leaflets in a remote corner they want everypenny out of everyone and if you belive corruption is not in this industry you are very nieve my friend.now im not saying either way wether it is rigged or not but the arguments for being so is very compeling.
    Posted by dalty
    Yes I can see why they WOULD do it just don't think they would cos they can make enough money honestly
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    Now i will start off by saying im undecided by this and i love sky poker for it's comunity and tournements and im a recreational player who has a few good results and can hold my own i do not think i will be the next internet star lol but enjoy the game. now to me the reason why they may fix it is simple it's common business sense if you only have the best players winning then the recreational players will not play or less will play as the oposition is to good which then diminishes you customer base which as we all know means less players playing sit and go,tournements and cash which means less rake for the operator,now  what could we do to make our business more sucessful hmmm we could tweak it just a little to level the playing field this way the less experienced players get to win too and get the required enjoyment from playing and keep comming back thinking positive that maybe they can win a little and at the same time getting the required enjoyment level out of there new hobby,which then ups your customer base which as we know more customers means MORE RAKE for the operator and that is FACT. so to me this is a simple but very strong reason as to why they might tweak it a little,if it was your business and it could not be proved or amazingly difficult to prove as we all know it would be (i would imagine it would take a hell of a lot of time effort and money possibly just to get it to court to get access to the rng programme) so what would you do if it was your business.
    Posted by dalty


    i would agree if it were not for the fact that most people are losers,and have by their sharkscope graphs not ever won anything,surely if it was fixed it could make anyone win,poker has a big skill element ,and as you get better you realize just how much you have to learn......


    the same faces ,the good players are always at the money end of big tournements,because they are the best players,granted luck plays a part in the final places,but to be at those places requires a great deal of know how...

  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    They get their edge on the punter by giving them slightly worse odds than they truly believe so if they think a horse / dog / player / team has a 50/50 chance of winning they give you odds of 5/6, so if they get 10 bets of £6 on 10 different 50/50s believing they will win 5 and lose 5 the take in £60 and pay out £55.  And since most punters put on accumulators, every extra horse or team they add tips the %margin between offered odds and actual perceived possibility in the bookie's favour.  This is how they make their money and why small, local bookies who could never have the clout to influence any result also make profit
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    this is fact most small local bookies are going out of business because of the lack of recreational money around so the big boys are buying up all of these businesses.so why is it they would invest millions in dog track when they get so little return back??and do you believe dog and horse racing is straight??greed is the answer to most corruption and this is a greedy industry.
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    I think if I was a business like sky making so much money, the risk reward wouldn't be worth it.  Far better to rely on the fact that a lot of people enjoy spending disposable income on gambling and win or lose they will be back.  How many people do you know make a profit on horses or football coupons?  I know I don't but I still enjoy doing it.  Do you think ht bookies try to get the odd game or race fixed to ensure the punter wins so they come back.  No - they just trust their judgement in probability and accept that sometimes the punter will win even though the odds are in bookie's favour so long term he makes a profit - a bit like a skilled poker player v a less skilled.  He will hit his miracle card sometimes anyway so no need to fix it in his favour
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    as stated by yourself a lot of people ENJOY spending disposable income if they lose the majority of time to the more skilled player they then get to a stage where they do not ENJOY playing poker and leave to spend else where thus diminishing your customer base and meaning less return from rakes.simple really tweak it keep the majority happy and the minority who do not belive would have a near imposible task proving otherwise due to the amount of time data and effort required to prove otherwise.
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : i would agree if it were not for the fact that most people are losers,and have by their sharkscope graphs not ever won anything,surely if it was fixed it could make anyone win,poker has a big skill element ,and as you get better you realize just how much you have to learn...... the same faces ,the good players are always at the money end of big tournements,because they are the best players,granted luck plays a part in the final places,but to be at those places requires a great deal of know how...
    Posted by djblacke04
    you are more than welcolme to sharkscope me and you will see im not a losing player im in small profit but pretty much breakeven so im not just whinging about beats i can take these but just trying to point out reasons why they may tweak the rng it makes an intersting argument certainly one to think about and as i said in one of my posts it's one for the x files guys out there.
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : you are more than welcolme to sharkscope me and you will see im not a losing player im in small profit but pretty much breakeven so im not just whinging about beats i can take these but just trying to point out reasons why they may tweak the rng it makes an intersting argument certainly one to think about and as i said in one of my posts it's one for the x files guys out there.
    Posted by dalty

    i have to confess, i have been there myself,and because i didnt understand,the true nature of the game,coincidently when i would have described myself as a break even player,i couldnt rationalize the hands that were dealt and of course blamed the dealer....my only point is, that, if someone calls u and they have a 10% draw or less,u must have played the hand wrong.....bet size is normally the culprit...


    good luck

    toby...
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : i have to confess, i have been there myself,and because i didnt understand,the true nature of the game,coincidently when i would have described myself as a break even player,i couldnt rationalize the hands that were dealt and of course blamed the dealer....my only point is, that, if someone calls u and they have a 10% draw or less,u must have played the hand wrong.....bet size is normally the culprit... good luck toby...
    Posted by djblacke04
    mate im not complaining about bad beats far from it ive done ok this month but it is wether they would rig it or not and reasons for it,why am i bothering you might think well i have seen so many holywood type hands and shocking beats on here just recently to give me cause for concern.
    ayrgreame you have not answered my question why would sadbrokes want to own a dog track when it makes so little money and takes so much time and effort to run for very little return?? and as for margins i work in a bookies so i know all about these and you are quite correct in your argument there but what is to stop these companies making more with a little edge ie owning dog tracks,next time your in the bookies and you have your money on that reliable fast trapper who always leads and is 5/4 fav and always comes out last on the bags meeting ask yourself why and take a close look at when the traps open and where the hare is and why did he smash his head on the traps before they opened it only takes a split second mate and i can say with 100% certainty this goes on how do i know because i worked in the greyhound industry for years before moving to the enemy and working in the bookies.i also know sadbrokes are ruthless many times in the winter when the track has been frozen at monmore they have heavily salted the track beyond belief to get the meeting on,do you know what salt in the sand does to a dogs paws it aint a pretty sight mate! so why do the trainers do nothing you say because they fear for there contracts on there because they are so lucrative due to the retaining fees ladbrokes pay simple.why are sadbrokes desperate to keep it on profit from the shops they make a whopping 25% of there turn over from dog racing so no dog meeting is millions of shop turnover lost. 
  • edited March 2011
    Yep i gotta admit that whenever i play live i see constant high cards on the board AND the flop nearly always comes down 3 of the same suit


    HONEST ;)
  • edited March 2011
    If you believe that businesses will not take any opportunity to increase profitability you are a misguided fool. Most peole who make the statement that it can't happen have no experience of business. Business is business and it's ruthless. And ruthless companies succeed.

    I don't gamble - the bookie ALWAYS wins in the long term.

    I don't do slots or casino - you can't win, it's designed that way, and it's legal.

    I play poker - is it all above board? I have my doubts, but it's beatable.
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    If you believe that businesses will not take any opportunity to increase profitability you are a misguided fool. Most peole who make the statement that it can't happen have no experience of business. Business is business and it's ruthless. And ruthless companies succeed. I don't gamble - the bookie ALWAYS wins in the long term. I don't do slots or casino - you can't win, it's designed that way, and it's legal. I play poker - is it all above board? I have my doubts, but it's beatable.
    Posted by elsadog
    The best example i think you missed Alan is Blackjack.

    You go to a casino you lose your welcomed back with open arms. But if you go and win consistantly they wont let you play!!!!!

    FACT
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : The best example i think you missed Alan is Blackjack. You go to a casino you lose your welcomed back with open arms. But if you go and win consistantly they wont let you play!!!!! FACT
    Posted by The_Don90

    In the 80's I used to frequent Salford Casino. A mate and me played Blackjack and probably just about held our own against the house. Whenever we went there was a Chinese man and wife there, they were playing blackjack every night of the week. They were losing about a thousand a night and were treated like Royalty. The Casino Manager would come down especially to say hello to them every night. 

    It's business.

  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : as stated by yourself a lot of people ENJOY spending disposable income if they lose the majority of time to the more skilled player they then get to a stage where they do not ENJOY playing poker and leave to spend else where thus diminishing your customer base and meaning less return from rakes.simple really tweak it keep the majority happy and the minority who do not belive would have a near imposible task proving otherwise due to the amount of time data and effort required to prove otherwise.
    Posted by dalty
    Aye coz people who lose on football and horses (like me) never go and bet on it again do they?  Why would poker be different.  People see it as entertainment same as you would spend money to go to the pictures or a football match - they don't necessarily expect to get money back but it's a bonus if they do
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    I think if I was a business like sky making so much money, the risk reward wouldn't be worth it.  Far better to rely on the fact that a lot of people enjoy spending disposable income on gambling and win or lose they will be back.  How many people do you know make a profit on horses or football coupons?  I know I don't but I still enjoy doing it.  Do you think ht bookies try to get the odd game or race fixed to ensure the punter wins so they come back.  No - they just trust their judgement in probability and accept that sometimes the punter will win even though the odds are in bookie's favour so long term he makes a profit - a bit like a skilled poker player v a less skilled.  He will hit his miracle card sometimes anyway so no need to fix it in his favour
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    phaps you havent noticed the reccession that we are in,people have less disposable income than ever b4,thats why you see so many business cutting prices,offering deals etc..online poker is a different sort of business,no BOGOF here,and customers have to be kept,so what the OP is suggesting makes perfect sense.,as for the bookies/horseracing,again a different sort of business,but clearly has got its 'bent' side,races are 'fiddled' and you can guarentee that sometimes they'll be 'fiddled' in the bookies favour.the monetary system that we've all grown up under encourages dodgy practice by those in the right positions(usually those with the money already or those wanting a big slice of the money).  just to add,skypoker did drop me £5 bonus in my account,can only assume this was bcoz i hadnt played here for 3 months,well it worked,i came back,won a few quid and then eventually  lost the fiver.
  • edited March 2011
    Life is full of angles and possibilities some people question these some go on with life with there eyes shut or maybe you guys who keep posting on here defending online poker to the max maybe just maybe have your doubts too but are just trying the posibilty that if you become a sky ambasador and defend it maybe the cards may fall more favourably for you,otherwise why else would you become so obbsesed with what goes on here and feel the need to post all the time as it makes no difference to you what other peoples opinions are maybe your just trying your own angles.
    time for xfiles
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    Life is full of angles and possibilities some people question these some go on with life with there eyes shut or maybe you guys who keep posting on here defending online poker to the max maybe just maybe have your doubts too but are just trying the posibilty that if you become a sky ambasador and defend it maybe the cards may fall more favourably for you,otherwise why else would you become so obbsesed with what goes on here and feel the need to post all the time as it makes no difference to you what other peoples opinions are maybe your just trying your own angles. time for xfiles
    Posted by dalty

    There's probably a lot of truth in this. 

  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : Aye coz people who lose on football and horses (like me) never go and bet on it again do they?  Why would poker be different.  People see it as entertainment same as you would spend money to go to the pictures or a football match - they don't necessarily expect to get money back but it's a bonus if they do
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    i agree but poker is a little different because you control your own destiny in poker where with footy and horses it's out of your control so with constant losses on poker you would soon realise you wernt good enough so most people would give up where as only a few would continue.but with footy and horses the buzz and adreneline rush of ohhh so close this time are enough to keep you comming back.with poker theres a buzz too but it does not affect the brain the same which is why most poker players are not gamblers of all things.
  • edited March 2011
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!!:
    In Response to Re: The answer to why they may fix online poker!!! : i have to confess, i have been there myself,and because i didnt understand,the true nature of the game,coincidently when i would have described myself as a break even player,i couldnt rationalize the hands that were dealt and of course blamed the dealer....my only point is, that, if someone calls u and they have a 10% draw or less,u must have played the hand wrong.....bet size is normally the culprit... good luck toby...
    Posted by djblacke04
    are you reffering to this mate because you may of cracked it here!!

    so we sit down again,and u ask why,well i did originally want to prove that these off sites run by major uk companies are fair and true to the game...

    but obviously i cant,as outdraw after outdraw continues...to be fair i played 4 games this morning at 5DYM , have gone down to these as i have no real reason to play anything else ,it just does you over,anything where there is any real money,is either won by some nobody who has never played on the site b4,or mysterious players that seem to miraclulously take every regular out...

    so today as i said we played 4 this morning and won every one...no outdraws no horrendous bad beats,just normal poker...and then in game 5 it started...

    kk v AJ flop jj5

    nice..
    could of just done my over with the Ace ,but hey i suppose i have had enough of that....lol...

    then in possibly the most intriguing play of the day..

    i get 77

    flop come 3 7 K

    i raise 1000 ,he pushes all in

    i think for a while and call,what he got 45 ....yup 45....reriased me all in, a quick check of the stats found him to be awful and in quite a lot in the red...

    so what does the turn bring....a  6......yup another donk saver....yes i think we will call them that....its like the shody players are somehow helped,so that the weaker plays are rewarded...coincidence ..i think not...

    so played the BH,and in bb get raised 3 x with 34 suited...

    so i call....

    flop comes 345..wow nice...he bets i raise 4x he goes all in...i call..

    he turns 10 10

    turn is a q
    and yes this time of course it comes a 5...

    higher two pair...f off ...it never ends ...and in fact i think that the old limiting is back on again..

    it is quite obvious that the amount of rake you generate is rewarded in your play..

    play 5000 games at 55 with a 5 rake you looking at 25k up...if you are any good...so thats the most you will get...

    have sat down and watched for the last three months and , they are all the same...is mathmatical,and quite obviously fixed...because without the fix people like me would bankrupt every single donk on there...so i have one more game left on here ....then i will publish my findings....and it aint pretty...i mean bad beats are supposed to be the odd,occasion,for me its a way of life....

    so if you actually want to play a fair game i suggest you sign up to realdealpoker.com at least then you might find out how good you really are...

    and when it opens in March i shall continue with my blog..

    ps did i mention that i have won 7 out of 10 live tournements i have played....

    very honest of you to say you've been there and i sincerely hope your right on how staright it is i guess time will tell. oh and some of the obseneties from your blog had to be edited lol.

  • edited March 2011
    p.s. dj this aint a cheap shot at you mate but i actualy believe that maybe if some of us doubters read this and try and improve our game like you have endeavored too maybe then maybe we can turn it around and the world of online poker will be all good again.as i stated in my original post i was undecided
Sign In or Register to comment.