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Can i even call this?

CrunchybobCrunchybob
edited May 2011 in The Poker Clinic

Hey guys, early on in a dym £2.25, can i even make this call? surely he has a king right?
MADSPARKS Small blind   15.00 15.00 1955.00
clewso Big blind   30.00 45.00 1680.00
  Your hole cards
  • J
  • J
     
King44 Call   30.00 75.00 2350.00
x Call   30.00 105.00 2045.00
DarrenI Fold        
Crunchybob Raise   90.00 195.00 1875.00
MADSPARKS Fold        
clewso Fold        
King44 Call   60.00 255.00 2290.00
x Call   60.00 315.00 1985.00
Flop
   
  • 2
  • K
  • 4
     
King44 Check        
x
 Check        
Crunchybob Bet   180.00 495.00 1695.00
King44 Fold        
x All-in   1985.00 2480.00 0.00
Crunchybob Fold        
x Muck        
x Win   675.00   675.00
x
 Return   1805.00 0.00 2480.00
I got revenge as he was the person i knocked out to cash :D

Plus was my betting ok?

thanks guys
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Comments

  • ace001ace001
    edited May 2011
    I would never have played jacks in dym tournament.
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  • JohnConnorJohnConnor
    edited May 2011
    Make it 150/180 pre. Bet a bit bigger on flop but the idea is fine, it's a definate bet/fold.
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    I would never have played jacks in dym tournament.
    Posted by ace001

    Why?


    Thanks Johnconnor, i heard ur the yoda of DYMS :)
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited May 2011
    Hi Bob.

    It is very early on here. Raise bigger pre flop always seems to be the common opinion here as loads of people like to see flops early in this level of DYM's and i tend to agree with that. JJ does'nt play too well 3-handed so raise it up, you are nearly always in front pre.

    The bet on the flop is just about ok i suppose but i would like to see it a bit bigger personnally. 3/4 pot at least.

    As for the call, its very early but it looks like he could be protecting his flush draw and i may just call and then watch him turn over K,Q or something. Dont mind the fold tho, dym's are all about survival.
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  • rancidrancid
    edited May 2011
    raise more pre - could either be KQ, KJ or draw - player dependant

    bet the flop 270 or something
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    Thanks guys, i guess i was playing in respect to the blinds...i find jacks diffucult to play, they might aswell be 9's or 10's, cos as soon as a ace king or queen comes down u feel like ur behind.

    thanks for the help guys
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  • GlenelgGlenelg
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    Make it 150/180 pre. Bet a bit bigger on flop but the idea is fine, it's a definate bet/fold.
    Posted by JohnConnor
    I would be interested to know what difference 2/3 x bb &  5/6 x bb makes in this situation??

    Pad
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  • rancidrancid
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : I would be interested to know what difference 2/3 x bb &  5/6 x bb makes in this situation?? Pad
    Posted by Glenelg
    Essentially if you make it 3xbb if one player calls then everyone calls, plus it kinda encourages people into the pot and do you really wanna let some dirty king into the pot like K10 when you have JJ.

    If you make the pre raise bigger than K10 don't look so good does it.
    Plus if you get called when raising 4/5 bb's then you know your up against something ) well thats the basic theory anyway
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  • TommyDTommyD
    edited May 2011
    Defo raise bigger pre, we want to isolate or pick up the dead money here.

    I'm ok with your flop bet as played, personally I would make it slightly bigger but not by a heap.  Certainly fold after the shove.

    DYMs are all about taking uncontested pots IMO, your stack is fine, move onto the next hand.
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : I would be interested to know what difference 2/3 x bb &  5/6 x bb makes in this situation?? Pad
    Posted by Glenelg
    Maybe ur new book will help ;) lol


    It is annoying though ppl shove with anything nowadays...like this...rar!!!
    I_fold Small blind   10.00 10.00 2550.00
    Crunchybob Big blind   20.00 30.00 2000.00
      Your hole cards
    • K
    • K
    		     
    CRASHHAT Call   20.00 50.00 1240.00
    Andy134 Fold        
    darryl1976 Call   20.00 70.00 1950.00
    I_fold Raise   50.00 120.00 2500.00
    Crunchybob Raise   200.00 320.00 1800.00
    CRASHHAT Fold        
    darryl1976 Fold        
    I_fold Call   160.00 480.00 2340.00
    Flop
       
    • 10
    • 9
    • 2
    		     
    I_fold All-in   2340.00 2820.00 0.00
    Crunchybob All-in   1800.00 4620.00 0.00
    I_fold Unmatched bet   540.00 4080.00 540.00
    I_fold Show
    • 9
    • A
    		     
    Crunchybob Show
    • K
    • K
    		     
    Turn
       
    • 9
    		     
    River
       
    • 5
    		     
    I_fold Win Three 9s 4080.00   4620.00
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  • GlenelgGlenelg
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : Maybe ur new book will help ;) lol

    I did try to swop it for a TSP entry but Mandy wasn't keen! lol. I've said I'll give it to Dohh if he divulges survivor strategies. 

    P
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? :
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : Maybe ur new book will help ;) lol I did try to swop it for a TSP entry but Mandy wasn't keen! lol. I've said I'll give it to Dohh if he divulges survivor strategies.  P
    Posted by Glenelg
    I'd rather have the book..put it next to toilet will be read in no time :D lol
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? :
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : Maybe ur new book will help ;) lol I did try to swop it for a TSP entry but Mandy wasn't keen! lol. I've said I'll give it to Dohh if he divulges survivor strategies.  P
    Posted by Glenelg

    I reallllyyyyyyyyyyyyy want that book !!

    Gonna hav to bluddi buy it!
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  • GlenelgGlenelg
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : I reallllyyyyyyyyyyyyy want that book !! Gonna hav to bluddi buy it!
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    I'm guessing when I get it, it'll be like greek to me so when I stick it on flea-bay I'll give you a shout!!
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited May 2011
    Yeah i raise more pre 150ish because of the 2 limpers

    B/F as played fine

    2nd hand make a note for next time ez money if people are shoving that light
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    Cheers guys,illraise pre more.. never feel comfortable with jacks as ino tht some players call pretty much anything with a ace in hand so if ace or king falls dno what to do lol.
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    Cheers guys,illraise pre more.. never feel comfortable with jacks as ino tht some players call pretty much anything with a ace in hand so if ace or king falls dno what to do lol.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    Yeah they are tricky especially in a DYM, if there were no limpers 90 is fine imo unless you have a calling station then add a few blinds :P

    I also would defo bet out because half the time you will take the pot down with AK on the board as you were the initial raiser
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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited May 2011
    more pre, b/f flop is fine
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  • AyrGraemeAyrGraeme
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Can i even call this?:
    Hey guys, early on in a dym £2.25, can i even make this call? surely he has a king right? MADSPARKS Small blind   15.00 15.00 1955.00 clewso Big blind   30.00 45.00 1680.00   Your hole cards J J       King44 Call   30.00 75.00 2350.00 x Call   30.00 105.00 2045.00 DarrenI Fold         Crunchybob Raise   90.00 195.00 1875.00 MADSPARKS Fold         clewso Fold         King44 Call   60.00 255.00 2290.00 x Call   60.00 315.00 1985.00 Flop     2 K 4       King44 Check         x Check         Crunchybob Bet   180.00 495.00 1695.00 King44 Fold         x All-in   1985.00 2480.00 0.00 Crunchybob Fold         x Muck         x Win   675.00   675.00 x Return   1805.00 0.00 2480.00 I got revenge as he was the person i knocked out to cash :D Plus was my betting ok? thanks guys
    Posted by Crunchybob
    Don't do anything different here in my opinion - this is not a clever player picking off a weak bet (structure of DYMs clever players don't do that with all-ins) this guy has something - he may have hit the hand or he may have a draw, but a fold is the correct play.

    Don't listen to the cliches "Bet more pre, bet more on the flop"  In my opinion that only leads to you losing more chips here.  Beting smaller in the long run actually increases the skill factor as it makes the stacks deeper in relation to the pot so if you think you have a skill edge play it the same way next time.

    Refreshing to here a different view and not the same old cliches trotted out don't ya think - anyway gl pal
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  • AyrGraemeAyrGraeme
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : I would be interested to know what difference 2/3 x bb &  5/6 x bb makes in this situation?? Pad
    Posted by Glenelg
    Spot on mate, effective stacks are 70 bb so 3bb is fine - I think he is getting called regardless
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  • silentbobsilentbob
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : Yeah they are tricky especially in a DYM, if there were no limpers 90 is fine imo unless you have a calling station then add a few blinds :P I also would defo bet out because half the time you will take the pot down with AK on the board as you were the initial raiser
    Posted by YOUNG_GUN
    I may have misunderstood what you're saying YG but he did lead on the flop. It was x who c/r AI.
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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited May 2011
    part of your skill edge is making people put ina lot of money when they are behind
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : I may have misunderstood what you're saying YG but he did lead on the flop. It was x who c/r AI.
    Posted by silentbob
    Think YG means that if i have Jacks, and a ace and king come on the flop there is a good chance if i c-bet i could take it down as the oppo thinks i have a ace or king, when they have nothing.
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  • MADSPARKSMADSPARKS
    edited May 2011
    i would have raised more pre flop crunchy i remember the game, you shpuld have made it harder for him to call
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  • AyrGraemeAyrGraeme
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    part of your skill edge is making people put ina lot of money when they are behind
    Posted by grantorino
    If it was a cash game I would agree 100%
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  • percival09percival09
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Can i even call this? : Don't do anything different here in my opinion - this is not a clever player picking off a weak bet (structure of DYMs clever players don't do that with all-ins) this guy has something - he may have hit the hand or he may have a draw, but a fold is the correct play. Don't listen to the cliches "Bet more pre, bet more on the flop"  In my opinion that only leads to you losing more chips here.  Beting smaller in the long run actually increases the skill factor as it makes the stacks deeper in relation to the pot so if you think you have a skill edge play it the same way next time. Refreshing to here a different view and not the same old cliches trotted out don't ya think - anyway gl pal
    Posted by AyrGraeme
    well no, online it is essential to be technically correct, or as close to it as possible. and raising to 90 at 15/30 after 2 limpers is giving both players 3.5/1 to make the call, and you don't wanna be 3 handed with JJ. Crunchybob, you have the right idea in mind with this hand, i.e. raising pre and betting the flop, but you just have to make the adjustments to make it an unprofitable call for your opponents, because you gave them both the odds with that raise. 
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  • CrunchybobCrunchybob
    edited May 2011
    Thanks guys, this is something i have eradicated now, i been raising more pre flop and its been working. think i went on a 5 game dym run last night.
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  • AyrGraemeAyrGraeme
    edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this?:
    In Response to Re: Can i even call this? : well no, online it is essential to be technically correct, or as close to it as possible. and raising to 90 at 15/30 after 2 limpers is giving both players 3.5/1 to make the call, and you don't wanna be 3 handed with JJ. Crunchybob, you have the right idea in mind with this hand, i.e. raising pre and betting the flop, but you just have to make the adjustments to make it an unprofitable call for your opponents, because you gave them both the odds with that raise. 
    Posted by percival09
    Again, in a cash game I agree 100%
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