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AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......

Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
edited July 2011 in The Poker Clinic
FRANKIE247 Small blind   £0.02 £0.02 £1.34
X Big blind   £0.04 £0.06 £19.77
  Your hole cards
  • A
  • K
     
Dudeskin8 Raise   £0.20 £0.26 £4.46
Hancox Fold        
Y Raise   £0.52 £0.78 £4.63
manfred Fold        
FRANKIE247 Fold        
X Raise   £0.80 £1.58 £18.97
Dudeskin8
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Comments

  • grantorinograntorino
    edited July 2011
    readless I fold this and feel good about it
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  • AMYBRAMYBR
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    readless I fold this and feel good about it
    Posted by grantorino
    +1
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67
    edited July 2011
    Ya gotta fold really , how can ya be ahead ?
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited July 2011
    So I'm ALWAYS stacking against one Vill but not two ?
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    So I'm ALWAYS stacking against one Vill but not two ?
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    Yeah i aint foldin vs 1 oppo UNLESS i have a very very gd read ;) xx
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  • jakallyjakally
    edited July 2011

    Easy fold at this level I would think.

    Getting AK in PF is ok as long as you think oppo is happy to play for stacks with at least AK & QQ, and you are 100BB's deep or less.

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  • jenny_IYYjenny_IYY
    edited July 2011
    Imo AK is the most overated hand in poker and most definatley plays better in mtts or stts than it does at cash tables.

    Most of the time on cash tables you either win small with it or lose big and i always feel better playing small pps or suited cons than i do when im playing AK, unless of course the stack sizes at the table change the dynamics or there is a player who you know will put it all in light.

    But the best advice i could give anyone new to the game is not to fall in love with AK because afterall its only ace high.
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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    So I'm ALWAYS stacking against one Vill but not two ?
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    I would usually stack v 1 villain, but not always. I sometimes would stack v 2. The question I would ask is how often do you see people cold 4bet light? Not often at microstakes so readless its a fold imo

    Also I disagree with Jenny's post. AK is a very strong hand, and you often win decent pots due to the fact it dominates so many other hands when you flop top pair
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  • jenny_IYYjenny_IYY
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre...... : I would usually stack v 1 villain, but not always. I sometimes would stack v 2. The question I would ask is how often do you see people cold 4bet light? Not often at microstakes so readless its a fold imo Also I disagree with Jenny's post. AK is a very strong hand, and you often win decent pots due to the fact it dominates so many other hands when you flop top pair
    Posted by grantorino

    Each to there own i feel my friend, we all have our own thoughts on the game but i never feel happy when playing deep on cash and having my full stack at risk with only T/P T/K unless ofcourse its v the table idiot, because anyone who is remotley ok at poker wouldnt be putting there stack in with weaker and i would say ive made more cash over the last 7 years v players who wont fold T/P T/K or O/Ps than anyone else.

    Best of luck. Jenny.
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2011
    A,K is a different animal in cash in my limited experience. 100BB's + is a lot to commit on A high pre flop. I understand Jenny's point completely. I fold this too, there is a lot of money behind.

    The flip side of AK is that against other premium hands (8,8 upwards) it is statistically 53% favourite so long term it is a profitable hand (i think i heard Hartigan going on about it at some point on a show). Knowing that, i still find the fold here.
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    A,K is a different animal in cash in my limited experience. 100BB's + is a lot to commit on A high pre flop. I understand Jenny's point completely. I fold this too, there is a lot of money behind. The flip side of AK is that against other premium hands (8,8 upwards) it is statistically 53% favourite so long term it is a profitable hand (i think i heard Hartigan going on about it at some point on a show). Knowing that, i still find the fold here.
    Posted by DrSharp
    Then you will never be profitable at cash then ? vs 1 oppo there are very very few players that fold , including most of the very TOP PLAYERS ON THIS SITE XX
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  • jakallyjakally
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    Imo AK is the most overated hand in poker and most definatley plays better in mtts or stts than it does at cash tables. Most of the time on cash tables you either win small with it or lose big and i always feel better playing small pps or suited cons than i do when im playing AK, unless of course the stack sizes at the table change the dynamics or there is a player who you know will put it all in light. But the best advice i could give anyone new to the game is not to fall in love with AK because afterall its only ace high.
    Posted by jenny_IYY
    As the players you face become more skilled / more aware, it's pretty important to have a balanced game.
    If  you only 3 bet, or 4 bet with Aces, Kings and maybe Queens then good players will notice and adjust accordingly... hence it becomes v.difficult to get value for hands.

    It therefore helps to have other hands in your 3b / 4b range.... one of the best ones to add is AK.

    If other players know your 3b / 4b range is wider, then they will be happier to call / get it all in with a wider range.
    Then when we have AA or KK, we start to get calls from JJ / TT etc...
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre...... : Then you will never be profitable at cash then ? vs 1 oppo there are very very few players that fold , including most of the very TOP PLAYERS ON THIS SITE XX
    Posted by debdobs_67

    Against one villain, i dont fold. This is against 2 villains which changes the decision somewhat. With the betting pattern so far, at NL4 i am probably behind quite a lot of the time and with only 20p invested i am happy to leave them to it.

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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited July 2011
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre......:
    In Response to Re: AK facing 3bet and 4bet. pre...... : Each to there own i feel my friend, we all have our own thoughts on the game but i never feel happy when playing deep on cash and having my full stack at risk with only T/P T/K unless ofcourse its v the table idiot, because anyone who is remotley ok at poker wouldnt be putting there stack in with weaker and i would say ive made more cash over the last 7 years v players who wont fold T/P T/K or O/Ps than anyone else. Best of luck. Jenny.
    Posted by jenny_IYY
    Yeah I agree we can't always stack off pre with AK, and we certainly cant always stack off with TPTK in single raised pots 100BB deep against good players. Bad players often completely overplay it. However I disagree with the "win a small pot lose a big one" line because we nearly always get at least 2 streets of value from dominated hands, and this will happen more than we fold to a raise postflop or get our money in bad.

    Also preflop 3betting and 4betting AK can get a lot of hands with good equity against us to fold, and the points jakally made are all good also.

    Like you say though, each to their own, you obv know how to play
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