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DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?

Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
edited December 2011 in The Poker Clinic
No big reads, any way I can cbet here or have to check ?


CasimoSmall blind 50.0050.001007.50
BigM19Big blind 100.00150.002270.00
 Your hole cards
  • Q
  • Q
   
usmFold    
Dudeskin8Raise 280.00430.001495.00
-Typhoon-Fold    
persephersCall 280.00710.002140.00
CasimoFold    
BigM19Fold    
Flop
  
  • K
  • 5
  • 6
   
Dudeskin8
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Comments

  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    yep, same if you had a king
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67
    edited December 2011
    Well if ya c-bet and get called what are ya gonna LIKE as a turn card ?? any spade , any card that makes an oppos str8 ?? any ACE ?? think ya better check OR just shove and hope.
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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited December 2011
    id c bet here if u get called then slow down try n get to showdown as chaeap as possible 
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  • -Typhoon--Typhoon-
    edited December 2011
    I blinked and missed this and had to check through the hh.

    It was a strange one this, but you gotta c/b, if not only to rep the K, but to stop any drawing spades. The only problem is how much without putting yourself in danger, any action back then i think it's a fold.

    I Was playing the same guy on a £5.5dym at the same time as this, so had a bit more info. 

    Typhoon
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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011

    I wouldnt c bet unless i was prepared to stack off

    I would prob c/f

    If he checks the flop i might b/f the turn 1/2 pot

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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    Well if ya c-bet and get called what are ya gonna LIKE as a turn card ?? any spade , any card that makes an oppos str8 ?? any ACE ?? think ya better check OR just shove and hope.
    Posted by debdobs_67
    dont do this
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited December 2011
    I ended up checking as any cbet would need tobe at least 300 leaving me pretty short. 

    Turn comes a blank but I check again then decide to shove as his bet looks stealy and probably thinks I have nothing after checking twice so might call light, thoughts ?

    Ok so Google Chrome = bad for HH's

    I check, he bets 355 I shove. 
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  • simonnatursimonnatur
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    I wouldnt c bet unless i was prepared to stack off I would prob c/f If he checks the flop i might b/f the turn 1/2 pot
    Posted by GREGHOGG


    very awkward, with your stack size to make a bet on the flop that doesnt look obviously weak, without getting committed. I would still c bet 270,   fold to a check raise and hate to put in a penny more if called and dont get to showdown for free.

    Many players in blinds will take a look at a flop with QJs  89s Axs type hands getting the price you offered (even if theyre technically wrong) so i think you have to cbet to fold these hands out
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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    I ended up checking as any cbet would need tobe at least 300 leaving me pretty short.  Turn comes a blank but I check again then decide to shove as his bet looks stealy and probably thinks I have nothing after checking twice so might call light, thoughts ? Ok so Google Chrome = bad for HH's I check, he bets 355 I shove. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    dangerous strategy in a dym imo, and readless too.

    did he fold?

    I prefer a small delayed c-bet as stated. He can still call with worse, and the end will likely go c/c (unless u hit a Q lol)
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  • simonnatursimonnatur
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    I ended up checking as any cbet would need tobe at least 300 leaving me pretty short.  Turn comes a blank but I check again then decide to shove as his bet looks stealy and probably thinks I have nothing after checking twice so might call light, thoughts ? Ok so Google Chrome = bad for HH's I check, he bets 355 I shove. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8

    what was the outcome of the hand?
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  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    u lot r crazy )

    pot of 710

    c bet u have 10 bigs if no joy

    very high chance oppo folds

    how do you not c bet :s



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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    u lot r crazy ) pot of 710 c bet u have 10 bigs if no joy very high chance oppo folds how do you not c bet :s
    Posted by rancid
    pot control ftw in dyms. being oop here sucks.

    this is why i wait until the turn before doing anything.  Im happy to c/f the flop.


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  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    what does a delayed c bet achieve here ?

    Happy to take it down on wet flop with a c bet tbh and add 710 to my stack

    would we check AK on that flop :S
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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    what does a delayed c bet achieve here ?Happy to take it down on wet flop with a c bet tbh and add 710 to my stack would we check AK on that flop :S
    Posted by rancid
    1. it means we can control the pot and bet when we are more likely to be ahead imo with no aggressive action from the opponent on the flop. Also means he cant float the flop if hes good enuf to float.
    2. I might check AK on the flop sometimes yes if i hae reads
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  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    PROS & CONS GREG !!





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  • simonnatursimonnatur
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet? : 1. it means we can control the pot and bet when we are more likely to be ahead imo with no aggressive action from the opponent on the flop. Also means he cant float the flop if hes good enuf to float. 2. I might check AK on the flop sometimes yes if i hae reads
    Posted by GREGHOGG
    I hate checking the flop - with that board texture I don't think we can ever be checking the flop with top pair or better - so it doesnt take a genius in this situation to realise he can confidently bet top pair for value or bet half the pot as a bluff whilst putting us to the test for our tourney life with our hand effectively face up.

    I'm not saying we should turn our hand into a bluff, but a cbet is very plausible given the action and we are statistically much more likely in the villains eyes to hold AK than our actual hand.

    If we get action we can get away with circa 10bb stack so all is not lost.
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  • JohnConnorJohnConnor
    edited December 2011
    In Response to DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    No big reads, any way I can cbet here or have to check ? Casimo Small blind   50.00 50.00 1007.50 BigM19 Big blind   100.00 150.00 2270.00   Your hole cards Q Q       usm Fold         Dudeskin8 Raise   280.00 430.00 1495.00 -Typhoon- Fold         persephers Call   280.00 710.00 2140.00 Casimo Fold         BigM19 Fold         Flop     K 5 6       Dudeskin8
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    I think I c-bet here most of the time to be honest. It's a great flop to c-bet. The problem is it's a great situation not to. You're likely either way ahead or way behind here, you can't put the villain on a straight draw and you're unlucky if he has a flush draw. That situation strongly favours checking, I think, and if I was in position I would almost certainly check one street for pot control. At the end of the day, though, I still have to c-bet. First, as has been mentioned, I'm betting all my Ks so I need to balance those. Secondly, I just can't surrender the iniative in the pot. If I check I've got no idea what a bet from my opponent means, if I bet then I will gain a better understanding of where I am, I think.
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  • psyconaugtpsyconaugt
    edited December 2011
    Rep the king and bet out, if player calls shut down. if players shoves fold
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited December 2011
    He had pocket Kings, yes KK in his hand, suffice to say the shove didn't get through. 
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    He had pocket Kings, yes KK in his hand, suffice to say the shove didn't get through. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    lol unlucky Dude
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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited December 2011

    Lol, no wonder it took u so long to own up to what he had Dude

    so in this instance my method gets me off cheapest innit :)


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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited December 2011
    Still feel unsure about cbetting as I'm turning my hand into a bluff but OOP I guess it's probably better. 
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  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    Still feel unsure about cbetting as I'm turning my hand into a bluff but OOP I guess it's probably better. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    Your not bluffing, you have a good value hand - you will get folds the majority of the time so all is good
    You may even get calls from worse and then it gets checked down.

    But it does bring about the argument of getting worse to fold, which is never good !

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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited December 2011
    On that board I don't think QQ is a value hand, only draws call me that I beat but then how do I know they have a draw and not a K which makes up a high percenatge of their range. 
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  • rancidrancid
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: DYM - QQ K-high-flop, cbet?:
    On that board I don't think QQ is a value hand, only draws call me that I beat but then how do I know they have a draw and not a K which makes up a high percenatge of their range. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    Poker sometimes is a little difficult )
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