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Tax on Poker winnings - Sorry think I put this on wrong thread earlier
Hi Tikay, or anyone who may be able to help.
I have been playing poker recreationally for a few years now and over the last 6 months my results have been quite good.
I am considering playing for a living, but have a couple of questions about tax on poker winnings.
Firstly, in the UK, is it correct that poker winnings are tax free?
Secondly, if I were fortunate enough to be sponsored for tournaments, does that change anything about the tax issue?
Thirdly, presumably potential advertising revenue would be taxable.
Many thanks
Graham (STAYORGO)
I have been playing poker recreationally for a few years now and over the last 6 months my results have been quite good.
I am considering playing for a living, but have a couple of questions about tax on poker winnings.
Firstly, in the UK, is it correct that poker winnings are tax free?
Secondly, if I were fortunate enough to be sponsored for tournaments, does that change anything about the tax issue?
Thirdly, presumably potential advertising revenue would be taxable.
Many thanks
Graham (STAYORGO)
Comments
However, unless you have like zero responsibility and can just give it a go and not really care if it fails, I would recommend waiting ALOT more than 6 months of things going well before deciding you can do it as a living.
What stakes do you pay and how much are you winning per month? I'm not bothered if you don't wanna post how much you win a month, but just take an average of them 6 months and are you consistently making £1500+ a month, because otherwise it's gonna be pretty easy to beat that with a normal job and still earn say £400 a month on the side.
Now my average MTT is about $100
I'm thinking of giving it another two months to get to $50K profit, then giving it a go. Does that sound feasible?
Thanks again for the feedback.
Cheers Graham (STAYORGO)
This has been debated extensively and is a sore point for many. You see all those poker pros on TV? Well you are paying for their kids' education, their dentists, their police etc and they're not contributing to yours! If you're on a minimum wage and a poker pro is taking home 200k per year - guess who subsidises who. Yep - you guessed it!
It always makes me laugh when people are asked "Which poker pro do you admire most?" If they ever asked me (they wouldn't) the answer would be "Any of them who decides to pay their taxes and contribute to society instead of taking from it".
Oh - they do pay VAT on their purchases though. And council tax. Just like everyone else.
Are you playing a massive amount of tournaments or have you been getting a few big cashes cos obviously you need to know that even if you're Phil Ivey you could still go through a patch of not winning anything for a long time (depending on how many tournies you play).
Like I said in my other post, I dunno what your situation is in terms of responsibility, whether you have kids/a family, live in your own place and so pay all your own bills and stuff, but I remember a long time ago a guy on here called Gliterbabe who is a VERY good player who plays full-time said that before you start you should make sure you have enough money aside so that if you didn't win/withdraw any money you'd be able to pay your bills for 6 months out of your own pocket.
Virtually all money from poker comes from players so,
all winnings - all losses = zero or near enough
Would seem like a lot of a trouble to set up a taxation system to claim back nought.
Very very true, never thought of it like that.
Pro poker players make a lot of money for the site.
The Site makes a lot of money that is taxed.
Therefore poker players DO contribute to tax...
QED
Its not our decison to whether we pay tax, its the governments. If they started taxing poker then i would pay no problem, youre making out like were tax dodgers.
You are talking about a very very small minority of winning players and an even smaller minority that would actually be liable to pay tax on their winnings in this country.
The vast majority of players would reclaim taxes on their losses, which would cost the government a fortune in lost revenue if they ever changed it.
You really should sit down and have a look at the whole picture before you come to these types of conclusion as I think you really have no idea.
I play poker, I lose most of the time as do a lot of others, So if it were taxed, would you be happy for your income taxes to pay back most tax losses?
I work full time & pay Taxes on my wages, I run my own business & pay Taxes on purchases & Corporation Taxes, Capital Gains Taxes, employer contributions etc etc etc. Do I really want to pay any more? I think Not
It seams your gripe is only with players who make a profit but do not have a full time job. But what about all the players that grind a profit and do have a job or their own business's and already pay taxes? are they not already contributing to the system?
You seam are tarring everyone with the same brush Sir and it is an insult.
The government decides how, when and what we pay our taxes for and until they can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Poker is anything more than a game of chance, it will remain as is. NON TAXABLE
its actually less than 0 because of rake/registrationfees
I'm not saying that professional poker players are doing anything illegal, they're not. But there's a serious anomaly here. How difficult would it be (especially online) to look at net deposits/withdrawals over a year and apply business tax? Anyone making more than, say, 10K/year can be considered to have another source of income and taxed on profits over this amount.
Professional poker players are self-employed businessmen and as such should be subject to the same rules as self-employed plumbers, gardeners and consultants.
I really don't understand how people can justify one set of professionals paying taxes and another not paying taxes!
"running your own business means you are gambling"
I disagree with this, in business you have to have a solid business plan, it is not a game of chance, you invest money into a business plan which is not without risks, but certainly not gambling.
"And if I lost money, the taxpayer WOULD NOT bail me out so I really don't get your point"
There is a difference between being "Self Employed" and Running a "Limited" Company as I do.
If you are self employed you can reclaim paid taxes on your losses, but not if you are "Limited" however, if you are VAT registered you can reclaim VAT (Value Added Tax) on your Purchases.
"Professional poker players are self-employed businessmen"
imo they are not. But they have learnt how to minimise the risks and maximise any profits, but at any given time it is still a game of chance and they could have substantial losses.
"self-employed plumbers, gardeners and consultants I really don't understand how people can justify one set of professionals paying taxes and another not paying taxes"
These types of people charge for their work and are being paid for their services. (No disespect to all plumbers, but finding a decent one can be a bit of a gamble or game of chance lol)
Anyway - we are all entitled to our own opinion and I do respect yours, but I think there are so many complexities, angles and opinions to this topic that an agreement will never be reached by all.