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30NL Interesting Hand

edited February 2012 in The Poker Clinic
is this shove too marginal?

Only read is BB has 3 bet squeezed couple of times this session, when BB folds  dont see any hand which UTG can call with which beats the range im representing and the call I think is quite awful  IMO. 

However is this too marginal with 1010 and can back rasiing only be effective with premium hands.

 Only interested due to reading an article by Ross Jarvis this month on back raising but is it more of a tournament concept?   

*Would appreciate no Super Nit views 

Hand History #481477081 (13:43 20/02/2012)PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalancebichasilaSmall blind £0.15£0.15£29.10rev26Big blind £0.30£0.45£44.19 Your hole cards1010   chiptasticRaise £0.90£1.35£23.35Knowles001Call £0.90£2.25£28.72beamer1968Call £0.90£3.15£35.70Chrissy_CRaise £3.00£6.15£23.14bichasilaFold    rev26Fold    chiptasticCall £2.10£8.25£21.25Knowles001All-in £28.72£36.97£0.00beamer1968Fold    Chrissy_CFold    chiptasticAll-in £21.25£58.22£0.00Knowles001Unmatched bet £5.37£52.85£5.37chiptasticShow10J   Knowles001Show1010   Flop  824   Turn  2   River  3   Knowles001WinTwo Pairs, 10s and 2s£51.05 £56.4

Comments

  • edited February 2012
    J10 minging

    a heartbraking flop

    a sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet turn and river

  • edited February 2012

     Well you only want and will realistically get better hands such as JJ/QQ to fold in this example -

     

    The aim is to get better to fold so if you have 44 and you flat then feel the 3 bet is light and you have no implied odds to call then back raise will get better to fold as playing oop blah blah is not good and no flop your going to love

     

    I thinks that’s the back raise thing, not 100% though

    back raising looks like a very strong move, but obviously your oppo thought otherwise  and wanted a race!

  • edited February 2012
    Love to know what Chrissy had here, mega lolz if it was Jacks :D
  • edited February 2012
    back raising shove(with 1010) = donk

    Calling shove with j 10 = hilarious
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    back raising shove(with 1010) = donk Calling shove with j 10 = hilarious
    Posted by WHOAMI196
    WhoAmi being the correct term because your a nobody, i asked for no Supernit comments please.
    im guessing yur just call and set mine kind of guy. Also if back rasiing with 1010 is so bad why did in the article i read say the exact same hand was played so well by the guy who won EPT London so is he a donk. 

    i hope your not just another forum guy who doesnt even play and just LOVES sky's Community . Or worse 2p/4p Reg    
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand : WhoAmi being the correct term because your a nobody, i asked for no Supernit comments please. im guessing yur just call and set mine kind of guy. Also if back rasiing with 1010 is so bad why did in the article i read say the exact same hand was played so well by the guy who won EPT London so is he a donk.  i hope your not just another forum guy who doesnt even play and just LOVES sky's Community . Or worse 2p/4p Reg    
    Posted by Knowles001
    Maybie beacuse say 1. it was a tourney 2. the original opener may be a nit, so shoving 1010 v him is not good 3. loose big stack squeezes(say button?), pushing out the original open-raiser 4. 1010 is prob good too shove v loose big stack...(nice +ev back raise spot)

    So what if i was a 2p/4p reg? so what if i just love skys community? problem?

    I am not going to tell how bad you are; or help you, just continue to play like this, dont care.

  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand : Maybie beacuse say 1. it was a tourney 2. the original opener may be a nit, so shoving 1010 v him is not good 3. loose big stack squeezes(say button?), pushing out the original open-raiser 4. 1010 is prob good too shove v loose big stack...(nice +ev back raise spot) So what if i was a 2p/4p reg? so what if i just love skys community? problem? I am not going to tell how bad you are; or help you, just continue to play like this, dont care.
    Posted by WHOAMI196

    I think i'll pass on your ivey knowledge. interested to how you play it though, the old call and close your eyes and hope no overcrad comes routine by just calling evry street pretty much turning your hand face up and any scare card you almost have to fold. Although i said BB in oeping post i meant button had been squeeziing often so i think my shive is +EV against his 3 betting range as although i actually had 1010 it will often look much stringer and may get him to fold up to JJ AND AQ often.

     just dont understand how statements like 1010 back raise = donk are justified by no explanation    
  • edited February 2012
    Fred gone a bit off the rail

    back raise for value or as a bluff, depends on the opener

    if opener is wide and 3 better is wide, then back raise bluff

    if opposite then back raise for value

    or if oppo may think your re stealing then do it for value

    move depends on dynamics/meta but the fine line is for value -

  • edited February 2012

    When you talk about bb squeezing do you mean btn?

    If btn 3bets light or squeezes often and opener is straight forward Tag I like it

    And no, I doubt btn folds JJ+, but he may well fold a ton of hands we flip with and he has position.

  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    When you talk about bb squeezing do you mean btn? If btn 3bets light or squeezes often and opener is straight forward Tag I like it And no, I doubt btn folds JJ+, but he may well fold a ton of hands we flip with and he has position.
    Posted by grantorino

    Prefer opener was loose aggroo
  • edited February 2012
    Very interesting hand. Don't post results though, see how you got almost as many posts "lol"ing at the call with JTs. It's pretty much a re-squeeze. I read the same article and didn't really get it but seeing this hand I do now. The orrigional 3-better could be just making a squeeze from the button and must also worry about the chances of a 3-way all in. Easy for him to suspect aces or kings must be somewhere. The BB can't have a monster because he would surely have 4-bet so he probably has an implied odds type hand (sc/pp etc)

    Think that this move makes you hand super polarised between AA/KK and total air. And it will confusse players since what ever you have you have made a move (either you have flat called with a monster or you have shoved with nothing). Think that if you are going to bluff then any hand is good however I suspect that hands that will have better equity against AA are better for when the bluff goes wrong, ironically hands like JTs.

    Thing I want to know is what hands do you call with here if you are the BB? If you are bluff catching what hand should call the bet? surely if we only call this bet with AA/KK then we aren't going to find ourselves able to call hardly ever and are going to get run over. He's making a stand with JTs, partly because he thinks you are on a bluff, but also maybe to say "don't do that again because I will call light"
  • edited February 2012
    ^^^ - . He's making a stand with JTs, partly because he thinks you are on a bluff, but also maybe to say "don't do that again because I will call light" ^^^

    Or because his cards are oh so pretty, is more like it !!!
  • edited February 2012
    Hi,

    Could you please let us know which table it from?

    Kind Regards
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    Hi, Could you please let us know which table it from? Kind Regards
    Posted by SkyPokerTV
    Hi How do i find that out? checked the hand histiry and stuff. Would relly like it to be analysed on Tv and for otheres opinions please.
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    ^^^ - . He's making a stand with JTs, partly because he thinks you are on a bluff, but also maybe to say "don't do that again because I will call light " ^^^ Or because his cards are oh so pretty, is more like it !!!
    Posted by Die_hard
    Good point, but what do i know . I,m just a 2p/4p reg :)

    MP
  • edited February 2012
    don't see how you can ever represent a huge hand with the huge over shove. This just screams - pls just fold and let me have the money in the middle. dont see how this will ever get BETTER to fold.

    Surely the hand you're trying to represent would raise to £7-10 with intention of shipping flop.

    Only point of note for me is that it could be a good play to shove against specific opponents with a slowpplayed monster for precisely this reason
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand : Hi How do i find that out? checked the hand histiry and stuff. Would relly like it to be analysed on Tv and for otheres opinions please.
    Posted by Knowles001
    Hi,

    If you go to your hand history it will tell you which tables you have played in. And you should be able to find it in there.

    All the best

    TV Team
  • edited February 2012
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand:
    In Response to Re: 30NL Interesting Hand : Hi, If you go to your hand history it will tell you which tables you have played in. And you should be able to find it in there. All the best TV Team
    Posted by SkyPokerTV
    Hi these are details of hand table : Legnica

    20/02/201213:43481477081Hold'emLegnicaNo Limit£0.15/£0.30£24.25£52.85£26.80Details
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