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Conspiracy theory at Elland Road!

Just a line of thought kicking about at the moment........

Basically, after exiting administration a few years ago it is believed that the creditors (people owed money) would only recieve 8p in every £1 owed as part of the deal. It is also believed that if Leeds regained top flight status over the next 5 years then this 8p turned in to pretty much the whole lot which is where this conspiracy theory comes together.......

Now, Grayson is known for running a tight ship and reasonably succesfully and a club as big as Leeds were always going to get out of League 1 even with no transfer budget as the clubs turnover allowed such an advantageous wage structure opposed to teams like Hereford, Yeovil, MK Dons etc etc. Now, Bates has spent very very little on the team but it has been reported he has spent over £9million on the stadium (yep, the one he does'nt own!). 

At the end of this season this 'creditor agreement' made years ago is to become exempt and Bates waits for the transfer window to close before sacking Grayson and appointing a man in Warnock with a proven record of promotions. We all know the current team has no chance of promotion as it is simply no where near good enough which is why he made sure we couldnt get some better players in during the transfer window that may fluke us in to contenders. 

Warnock sounds like a man who takes no prisoners and at his stage in his career will not be pushed around by someone like Bates and he would not have taken this job (a club he has openly admitting he dislikes) without some sort of transfer kitty promised during the summer. This gives Warnock the time to look at the current crop and see where he needs to strengthen.

Basically, by hook or by crook, it looks like Leeds could actually be looking at having a go at a serious push for promotion next season which is great news for the fans but you have to feel for the people owed money as they aint seeing a penny of it now. Does'nt sit right with me.

Disclaimer, these accusations are only alleged and part of a conspiracy doing the rounds.

Thoughts please.

Comments

  • edited February 2012
    Bates out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • edited February 2012
    Wow wow wow ... Leeds fans are accepting Warnock after he said he dislikes them??

    I dont know much about the Lower English leagues or how administration is worked. I do however rate what Warnock has done with various clubs. Although probably never managed it in the premiership.

    However i know north or the border, If someone was appointed who openly admitted previous they disliked the club, that manager would very unlikley get into the stadium.

    I do believe Leeds have some good players, well one i know of anyway, Robert Snodgrass is one i rate highly. Maybe not premiership material but definetly good enough for the championship.

    However best of luck to Leeds
  • edited February 2012
    With Bates anything could be true.

    I'm just glad he never got his foot in the door at Wednesday when he was sniffing around.

    Most of these rumours are usually started by an irrate fan though so it could all be a load of rubbish.


    I do think Warnock will do well with you. He knows what he's doing in the lower leagues.
  • edited February 2012
    IM no legal expert but being a pompey fan i know a bit about adminstratioln and CVA (creditors voulentery agreements)
    the cva is granted when the majority of creditors agree to take a percentage of what they are owed to allow the business to continue they are generally issued with a final settlement date of by which all moneys must be repayed i dont think they are renegotiable after they have been signed.
    when Milan Mandric took us out of administration the first time (not in 2010 when we got relegated from the premiership but in about 2001 or 2002) he payed creditors 5p in the pound whenn we got promoted many local businesses were not happy as we were now cash rich and they were all well out of pocket.

     
  • edited March 2012
    In Response to Re: Conspiracy theory at Elland Road!:
    Wow wow wow ... Leeds fans are accepting Warnock after he said he dislikes them?? I dont know much about the Lower English leagues or how administration is worked. I do however rate what Warnock has done with various clubs. Although probably never managed it in the premiership. However i know north or the border, If someone was appointed who openly admitted previous they disliked the club, that manager would very unlikley get into the stadium. I do believe Leeds have some good players, well one i know of anyway, Robert Snodgrass is one i rate highly. Maybe not premiership material but definetly good enough for the championship. However best of luck to Leeds
    Posted by The_Don90
    1st bit -  What else can we do Don? We have a chairman who has openly said that he hates Leeds as a club in the past and has labelled the fans 'morons' after complaining about ticket prices and lack of investment in the squad. Safe to say 90% plus of Leeds fans want this man out of the club asap. Bates' ticket pricing and attitude to running the club is the main reason why most people dont bother attending anymore. Attendances are well down on last season and down on when we were in League 1 and Bates doesnt seem to mind as long as he builds his hotel on the side of the stadium. 

    As for Warnock, well, he too has said he dislikes us and there have been some nastiness from the fans to him when he was in charge of visiting teams in the past. If i am honest, i didnt really want him but what can you do? If we all do a Blackburn and dont support the players, coaches or the board then we are as bad. Its not the players fault and you have to get behind them. I do think that this is Warnocks biggest club and at his stage in his career (i think he is 63) it could be his last chance at having a dig at the PL with a big club. He will do everything in his power to get us up and i think that he wont take any bull from Bates so i cant ask for anymore from him. Will i ever stand at the bar and profess to love the bloke? Probably not but all he can do is his best, if he does that then i will support the bloke.

    2nd bit - You will do shortly.

    Yesterdays game was a huge improvement and if thats how we are going to play then bring it on. 100% better.
  • edited March 2012
    In Response to Re: Conspiracy theory at Elland Road!:
    IM no legal expert but being a pompey fan i know a bit about adminstratioln and CVA (creditors voulentery agreements) the cva is granted when the majority of creditors agree to take a percentage of what they are owed to allow the business to continue they are generally issued with a final settlement date of by which all moneys must be repayed i dont think they are renegotiable after they have been signed. when Milan Mandric took us out of administration the first time (not in 2010 when we got relegated from the premiership but in about 2001 or 2002) he payed creditors 5p in the pound whenn we got promoted many local businesses were not happy as we were now cash rich and they were all well out of pocket.  
    Posted by BADBOY985
    Administration is basically a way of swindling money off people. The only people who come out of it well are the administrators themselves which tells its own story on how ethical the system is.

    At Leeds, when we were attempting to come out of administration we had 3 offers on the table. The main creditor was an offshore company who basically said the only CVA they would approve is one where Bates remains the chairman. It was heard at the time that this particular offer was the worst on the table yet it got through. Amazingly, (alledgedly, i have to say that) Bates is said to be working for an offshore company. Good innit.

    Leeds have sold numerous players since administration (Delph for £6mill, Schmeichel £1mill, Howson £3.5mill, Gradel, £1mill+ among others). Ticket prices have gone through the roof and are more expensive than most PL clubs inc Man Utd, Man City whilst remianing one of the highest attended clubs in the championship. Also, the wage structure is quite tight with the top earners reported to be earning 12K a week which is nowhere near the top payers in this league. Just makes you wonder if the money is being skimmed off to repay these offshore companies still owed money from the Ridsdale era.

    Basically, it stinks, and we get no info from the club apart from Bates thinks we are 'morons' for wanting some of our money to be spent improving the team slightly rather than selling off our better players and replacing them with free transfers and emergency loanees whilst increasing ticket prices on a regular occurance. 

    How can a chairman spend up to £9 million on a stadium he doesnt own and wont say who owns it?
  • edited March 2012
    100% ARGEE about administration the only people who loose out are the honest businessman who provide services which the clubs dont pay for. the current rules are totaly corrupt clubs having to pay each other,player and agents before paying taxe and bills.
    The government should do something about these rules.
    weve got 3 main creditors Gaydamak who was the one who let us run up 100 million pound of debts and is still getting our parachute payments and charging the club for using the car park behind the fratton end as he still owns it he also forced the club shop and ticket office to close as he shoved the rents up when he sold the club.
    The other is chanaria who is owed 17 million from csi the last owners who he sold the club to and csi who spent 11 million on players and wages and unbeliviebaly are entitled to get it back from the club!
    The clubs so disorganised at the moment the programe advert people phoned up a local electrical company offering the a full page advert for just £2000 the company said we would love to as soon as you send us the £25000 you owe us for work we did 2 years ago!
  • edited March 2012
    Yep,its shocking how the vultures circle when a club is in trouble and how the club is sold off in bits only for it to cme back and bite later on. Its a viscious circle and one thing i will say about Leeds is that i doubt it will happen again anytime soon here as its really run on a tight budget now. Its one thing i agree with at the club, it just stinks that all the money is spent on improving a stadium that we currently cant fill. No point having a PL club when the team is only League 1 standard. It has to be balanced.

    As for Portsmouth, i feel for the fans, as i do for any club in administration. I dont have to tell you how bad it is but the one thing i did really enjoy when we were in trouble is the atmosphere. When we started on -15pts in League 1 that season it was awesome. It was us against the world and probably ranks as one of the most enjoyable seasons i can remember. I guess you boys down there will really pull together again and get behind the team. Hope you get out of it ok again.

    If you go under, Southampton look like they could be going up and its just down the road. ;-D 
  • edited March 2012
    The problem we have is that weve done nothing to cure the problems that have been going on for years and through the last 4 owners 1 gaydamak spent 100 million and ran the club i a totaly unserstainable manner, the next one al suliman didnt have any money,the one after that al faraaj (or el mirage as he was named) most people in Pompey dont belive ever existed and didnt have any money and then CSI who had lots(£250 million)  of other peoples money from lithuania that they are now being extradited to be prosecuted.
    The biggest joke of all is all these past the fit and propper tests!
    weve got players on 20,30 and 40k a week who still have up to 2 years to run on their contracts.
    we need to spend 2 years getting financialy sorted ourselves sorted and forgetting about results.
    As for Scumhampton they may well be going but will always have to look at a tropphy cabinet that has 1 measly FA cup for 126 years of trying.
    If Pompey get liquidated there will be a pheonix club starting non league next season and fratton park can only be used for sport so the shister and con mens assets will be worth nothing
  • edited March 2012
    In Response to Re: Conspiracy theory at Elland Road!:
    In Response to Re: Conspiracy theory at Elland Road! : Administration is basically a way of swindling money off people. The only people who come out of it well are the administrators themselves which tells its own story on how ethical the system is. At Leeds, when we were attempting to come out of administration we had 3 offers on the table. The main creditor was an offshore company who basically said the only CVA they would approve is one where Bates remains the chairman. It was heard at the time that this particular offer was the worst on the table yet it got through. Amazingly, (alledgedly, i have to say that) Bates is said to be working for an offshore company. Good innit. Leeds have sold numerous players since administration (Delph for £6mill, Schmeichel £1mill, Howson £3.5mill, Gradel, £1mill+ among others). Ticket prices have gone through the roof and are more expensive than most PL clubs inc Man Utd, Man City whilst remianing one of the highest attended clubs in the championship. Also, the wage structure is quite tight with the top earners reported to be earning 12K a week which is nowhere near the top payers in this league. Just makes you wonder if the money is being skimmed off to repay these offshore companies still owed money from the Ridsdale era. Basically, it stinks, and we get no info from the club apart from Bates thinks we are 'morons' for wanting some of our money to be spent improving the team slightly rather than selling off our better players and replacing them with free transfers and emergency loanees whilst increasing ticket prices on a regular occurance.  How can a chairman spend up to £9 million on a stadium he doesnt own and wont say who owns it?
    Posted by DrSharp
    Why dont the fans set up a fan trust and attempt to takeover with backing??? Just my opinion i know currently theres a similar movement in scotland with rangers.

    I actually watched the first half of the Southapton game and i couldnt believe how many empty seats there was. although the same could be said for the blackpool v Hull game.

    I dont know full goings on with fans for clubs i have no affiliation with, but from watching 2 seperate teams that are both former premiership clubs with a major town sdupporting as a fan base im suspecting that its not the clubs that are the issues.

    IMO Stadiums of former Premiership clubs are built to support them in the Premiership and clearly they arent filling in the Championship. Obviously i'm likley wrong as your a leeds fan.
  • edited March 2012
    I remember Leeds paying 75% of Fowler and 80% of Robbie Keanes wages whilst they were playing against us and scoring past us. Was very difficult to take. I dont know how these fit and proper tests work but  they have to be stricter in my opinion.

    Good luck.
  • edited March 2012
    In Response to Re: Conspiracy theory at Elland Road!:
    I remember Leeds paying 75% of Fowler and 80% of Robbie Keanes wages whilst they were playing against us and scoring past us. Was very difficult to take. I dont know how these fit and proper tests work but  they have to be stricter in my opinion. Good luck.
    Posted by DrSharp
    Ive heard of people saying "ill leave if you pay the differance in the paydrop for the duration of my contract here" usually thats a very small % of their new wage, 80% seems brutal.
  • edited March 2012
    Don, Empty seats are largely down to the ticket prices. Against Southampton i reckon it would have been classed as a cat A game and therefore would have probably cost £34+ in the stand opposite the tv cameras and the game is on tv. The other factors affecting the crowds are that we sell all our best players at the end of each season and replace them with free transfers or old codgers like Michael Brown who dont have a club.

    As for the wages thing, it was hard to take but we had to stop losing money as quick as we were. Administration is horrible for the fans involved. There was talk of a fans group getting together but that quickly died out without too much noise being made.

    I'm not sure what you mean when you say "both former premiership clubs with a major town sdupporting as a fan base im suspecting that its not the clubs that are the issues."  But all i can say is that the fans are extremely peeved with the board at the moment and most fans, myself included, wont have much to do with the club until things change.

    Bates is improving the stadium because he says' we are a premier league club' when we clearly have a team more suited to league 1. As i said in the original post, i think he will have a go next season as the CVA agreement should be annulled at the end of the current season so he doesnt have to pay anymore of the debts off, apart from his bosses probably.

    Whats happening at Rangers? I know they have gone into administration but i dont know how bad it is or how close they are to going bust?
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