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nl20 hand, any comments welcome

SlykllistSlykllist
edited April 2012 in The Poker Clinic
I'm working on trying to improve my cash game at the moment (I'm very much a tournament specialist) and personally thought I played this hand pretty well.  Any comments very much appreciated.

My read on the villian was that his game wasn't great, which is probably where I went wrong, I think a better player folds here?

Have purposefully not shown hand outcome as I want to hear honest opinions about the way I played the hand that are not influenced by the result. 

Please be as brutal as you like, I need all the advice I can get :)
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
liamboi11 Small blind  £0.10 £0.10 £19.90
looserfish Big blind  £0.20 £0.30 £9.23
 Your hole cards
  • Q
  • 10
   
7king Fold     
villian Call  £0.20 £0.50 £13.27
Slykllist Raise  £0.70 £1.20 £33.19
liamboi11 Fold     
looserfish Fold     
villian Call  £0.50 £1.70 £12.77
Flop
  
  • K
  • 5
  • 10
   
villian Bet  £1.70 £3.40 £11.07
Slykllist Raise  £3.40 £6.80 £29.79
villian Call  £1.70 £8.50 £9.37
Turn
  
  • 4
   
villian All-in  £9.37 £17.87 £0.00
Slykllist Call  £9.37 £27.24 £20.42
  
   
  
   
  
   
      
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Comments

  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited April 2012
    i know u should never limp in any kind of structure but i think with this hand its ok to limp q 10 diamonds i would want to get multiway and win a big pot rather then get it heads up on flop with the villains bet i would call in position with the stacks and i dnt like your call with all in 
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited April 2012
    Pre is fine flop is fine you can just call because of his stack size but he has basically played it like he has the king or a set. As played i think you should fold the shove as you should be majority of the time be well behind needing a diamond which doesnt pair the board.
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  • elldixon18elldixon18
    edited April 2012
    I'd prefer getting it in on the flop where your equity is highest.

    After the pot donk bet, I'd be moving that slider up around £5 - £6, (not min raising) see that he only has a few more quid left after that - and probably just put him all in there and then.

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  • EvilPinguEvilPingu
    edited April 2012
    Limp/Call pre, bet pot on the flop, shove turn....Villain may as well hold up a sign saying "I have a set!" here. 

    It's a fold when villain jams the turn, because you're not getting the right price to draw to your flush, and 2nd pair is never ahead here.

    Hate the min re-raise on the flop. I don't mind shoving the flop although it holds up a sign saying "we have a draw", I don't mind raising to £6ish and calling a shove, I don't even mind a call and reassessing on the turn. Anything but a min raise tbh.
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  • salazarsalazar
    edited April 2012
    Pre fine, flop your raise should have been bigger (£5-6). As played, fold to shove on turn, you don't have the price to draw
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  • scotty77scotty77
    edited April 2012
    Raise more pre flop like 80/1

    Raise more flop like 5.50

    Turn is annoying and why we shoulda raised more flop.  We are ahead of a few ver specific hands tho which have picked up equity turn.
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  • ybyb
    edited April 2012
    i'd just flat the flop tbh, we have decent showdown value but when we get stacks in our equity is not going to be that great, and there aren't many better hands at all that we're going to get folds from.
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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited April 2012
    flat flop he wont fold Kx or better. If you are going to raise make it bigger

    fold turn
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN
    edited April 2012
    I prob call pre, unless i think i have a big edge over the table

    post flop bet more on flop to commit them, £5 then prob get all in vs Kx but we have most equity on the flop. Bit of a sigh calling of turn with 1 card left i think as played its snap fold turn
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  • WHOAMI196WHOAMI196
    edited April 2012
    Pre fine with me, flop min raise doesn't make sense you need to make it bigger because when you bluff you need fold-equity and when you have a strong made hand you need value from draws etc, its somewhat tricky with a huge draw, raising flop is sorta bluffing but with tons of equity, so don't mind raising with the idea of getting it in, but i like flatting flop too.

    Turn is a bit ugly, but it is a easy fold, looks like he is poss overplaying a kx or protecting 2 pair type hand and if that is the case we have around 25% chance to win the hand, and we are not getting 4-1 on our money, so fold.

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  • percival09percival09
    edited April 2012
    either flat call flop or raise bigger
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  • simonnatursimonnatur
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 hand, any comments welcome:
    Limp/Call pre, bet pot on the flop, shove turn....Villain may as well hold up a sign saying "I have a set!" here.  It's a fold when villain jams the turn, because you're not getting the right price to draw to your flush, and 2nd pair is never ahead here. Hate the min re-raise on the flop. I don't mind shoving the flop although it holds up a sign saying "we have a draw", I don't mind raising to £6ish and calling a shove, I don't even mind a call and reassessing on the turn. Anything but a min raise tbh.
    Posted by EvilPingu
    Evilpingu,

    20nl, Villain playing short stack, open limps cutoff, Hero's read: he's not very good...

    does he have to have a set to shove here???? don't think he needs more than A10 or deffo any Kx
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  • simonnatursimonnatur
    edited April 2012
    By min reraising flop you have let him play Kx perfectly against you **.  9/10 times oppo will put us on flush draw and call and see a safe turn card before shoving.

    ** although at this level 67dd, other worse flush draws, pocket pairs 66-99 cant be completely ruled out.
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  • EvilPinguEvilPingu
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 hand, any comments welcome:
    In Response to Re: nl20 hand, any comments welcome : Evilpingu, 20nl, Villain playing short stack, open limps cutoff, Hero's read: he's not very good... does he have to have a set to shove here???? don't think he needs more than A10 or deffo any Kx
    Posted by simonnatur
    Agree, but second pair still isn't ahead.
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  • SlykllistSlykllist
    edited April 2012

    Thanks for all the comments guys.

    I went to bed thinking about this hand last night and came to similar conclusions to you ie.  I should have raised bigger on the flop at least then I don't have to make a bad decision on the turn when he jams.

    Cheers

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  • rancidrancid
    edited April 2012
    raise more pre

    stick it all in on flop

    just read some comment, don't understand the raise more pre versus this effective stack - if we go to £5+ we not folding right :S fill me in as if we raise more - then we may aswel shove it

    plus oppo is donking flop pot size - mmmmm WTF! really don't get it what the limp/calling range - 55/K10/AJ
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  • AMYBRAMYBR
    edited April 2012
    Raise more or flat pre.

    Limping in limped pot is not the same as open limping.

    If we min flop to get oppo to ship I guess its ok, but would rather see a raise that doesnt polarise us as much,  I prob just ship it though.  Dont want to be in this exact spot on turn.
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  • SkyPokerTVSkyPokerTV
    edited April 2012

    Hi, 

    Thank you for your post, Would you like us to analyse your hand on tomorrows Poker Clinic show at 8pm, if so please post your hand ID and which Tournament or Cash Table its from. 
    Unfortunately we can only show tables from Tournaments and Cash Tables with the TV icon by them. 

    All the best


    TV TEAM

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