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views on this hand please...

DAVEYZZDAVEYZZ
edited April 2012 in The Poker Clinic
a hand from a live game last night.

part one
final table
blinds are 1k/2k....9 handed and 3 players limp....

player a raises to 7.5k on the button with 6d 4d (80k behind)
player b reraises all in for 17.5k

folds round to button..a pot of 31k

what should player a do?
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Comments

  • AMYBRAMYBR
    edited April 2012
    looks like 33k to me dave?

    10K to call or 17.5k?

    10k snap call .........17.5k myeah

    Button hero :p
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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited April 2012
    call for pot odds and likely to be live cards so 46 against any ac high card not going to be in to bad shape
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  • grantorinograntorino
    edited April 2012

    Player a: Dont open 6d4d with a shorty in blinds, if you really want to open make it smaller. Now call really really quick

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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited April 2012
    true grentorino with these blinds and u have to look at stack sizes would be stupid to  open with 4 6 lol but think daveyzzzz using a example and i think its a snap call
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  • jugglegeekjugglegeek
    edited April 2012
    Just done some maths and it's pretty good. If player b is the only person left in the hand (which I have assumed, not totally clear from your post) and he is shoving any two cards we have 41% equity so it is +ev 6,810 to call here. If you reduce his shoving range to top 30% then it's still 36% equity so +ev 4,760. Even if it's top 5% of hands (99+, AJs+, KQs & AKo) then we have 29% and it's still +ev 1,890. The only time it becomes -ev is if the shoving range only includes pocket pairs. Even against AA it's -ev 1,390. When you consider the stack size I think he can afford it.

    The stupid move was raising to so much with a short stack in the blinds. Once he had made this move he has to call the rest when the short stack shoves. I take it the BB kicked off because he got his monster hand cracked by 64s. It irks me when players get all worked up because you make a totally standard move. The other night I open shoved 8BBs from the button with A4o and got called by the big blind who had 18BBs and a pair of jacks. Totally standard play and I binked an ace on the flop. I got some stick for this too
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  • DAVEYZZDAVEYZZ
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: views on this hand please...:
    Just done some maths and it's pretty good. If player b is the only person left in the hand (which I have assumed, not totally clear from your post) and he is shoving any two cards we have 41% equity so it is +ev 6,810 to call here. If you reduce his shoving range to top 30% then it's still 36% equity so +ev 4,760. Even if it's top 5% of hands (99+, AJs+, KQs & AKo) then we have 29% and it's still +ev 1,890. The only time it becomes -ev is if the shoving range only includes pocket pairs. Even against AA it's -ev 1,390. When you consider the stack size I think he can afford it. The stupid move was raising to so much with a short stack in the blinds. Once he had made this move he has to call the rest when the short stack shoves. I take it the BB kicked off because he got his monster hand cracked by 64s. It irks me when players get all worked up because you make a totally standard move. The other night I open shoved 8BBs from the button with A4o and got called by the big blind who had 18BBs and a pair of jacks. Totally standard play and I binked an ace on the flop. I got some stick for this too
    Posted by jugglegeek

    i agree..not a good idea not to check stacks before opening so much....

    i did indeed call and of course spiked a six..and got some stick.

    which i can take because to be fair i like to give it out for bad calls.
    (although i think this was a right call)

    cheers all for advice
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  • mickgil75mickgil75
    edited April 2012
                    If there gooD enuf to raise with,there good enuf to call all in with.were these sky players havin a joke ina pub with there 6/4 diamonds and got found out.loooooooooooool
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  • DAVEYZZDAVEYZZ
    edited April 2012
    it was in our  weekly poker league and i was the only sky poker player there :)
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  • rancidrancid
    edited April 2012
    check stack before opening but you know this :S

    yeah I call and laugh when I hit, and shield the right hander )
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  • DAVEYZZDAVEYZZ
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: views on this hand please...:
    check stack before opening but you know this :S yeah I call and laugh when I hit, and shield the right hander )
    Posted by rancid
    indded i do know this...just lazy from me thinking i will nick the 9k pot with a 7.5k raise.......
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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited April 2012

    Dont give players stick for bad calls imo

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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited April 2012

    Hi
    Daveyzz has put it well considering +-ev's. Considering what you have, where you'd be afte calling, stack-size wise i think a call is fair. Your m is 20+ and you're playing for <1/10th of your remaining stack.
     I would however say that you mustn't have noticed his stack size before betting as all-in was likely in small blind, don't u think?  I wouldn't have bet originally with BB still to come before my initial raise but i would have called after his all-in is folded around to me. It seems logical but its just an opinion......

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  • KAM99KAM99
    edited April 2012
    Snap call with 3:1 odds on the call. Against his range you have priced in here to make the call, and should pretty much always make it. Of course thats just on this example, and obviously it shouldn't really happen with his hand, and more so if there are also 3 limpers in the hand. WIthout the shove and only a 3 times raise good chance limpers would come along if not for the shove. However, sure this is just an example of what you should call if you had your raise shoved over, and in this case its a call really.
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  • RogueCellRogueCell
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: views on this hand please...:
    Dont give players stick for bad calls imo
    Posted by GREGHOGG
    Ouch Grog - have you had enough now?
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