Whats my move on the turn?

mattless

Opponent is reg capable of moves, open limps a bit pre, but when raiser plays aggressive.

phenom222	Small blind		£0.05	£0.05	£8.57
mattless	Big blind		£0.10	£0.15	£14.69
	Your hole cards	K K
TWRAMYEP	Raise		£0.40	£0.55	£11.14
POCKETS831	Fold
didalo	Fold
phenom222	Call		£0.35	£0.90	£8.22
mattless	Raise		£1.50	£2.40	£13.19
TWRAMYEP	Call		£1.20	£3.60	£9.94
phenom222	Call		£1.20	£4.80	£7.02
Flop
		J 2 6
phenom222	Check
mattless	Bet		£2.50	£7.30	£10.69
TWRAMYEP	Call		£2.50	£9.80	£7.44
phenom222	Fold
Turn
		Q
mattless	?
TWRAMYEP

percival09

I probz just bet about 5, but I don't think it matters too much whether you choose to bet that amount or shove

DOHHHHHHH

£2.35

EvilPingu

Jam

mattless

his range to call me on flop is jx, set or possibly 77 88 99 1010. Should I not slow down?

grantorino

Check

mattless

wow 4 different answers so far

grantorino

Can't see much reason to bet, you can still jam river if he checks back and you are wa/wb

percival09

it depends on your image

I know with my image I'm double barreling because I'm bluffing here sometimes. It depends how often you 3b, how often you cbet in 3b potsetc...

Checking is fine if you're disciplined enough to lay it down to a bet? Or are you planning to c/r? Realistically, unless villain is bluffing, he's never betting the turn once checked to him with less than KK so I guess that's fine. 

grantorino

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

it depends on your image I know with my image I'm double barreling because I'm bluffing here sometimes. It depends how often you 3b, how often you cbet in 3b potsetc... Checking is fine if you're disciplined enough to lay it down to a bet? Or are you planning to c/r? Realistically, unless villain is bluffing, he's never betting the turn once checked to him with less than KK so I guess that's fine. 
Posted by percival09

 Yeah depends on image a bit,  but it allows him bluff some weak hands or floats, and we often get paid lighter on river when we check than we do on turn

Yeah he shouldn't be bluffing turn often, prob can c/f v some villains with good reads, but I don't fold readless

jams88

Mattless table image is pretty solid.

He looks intrested in the hand on the flop i think your right to say he has jx or set on such a dry flop can't see him having need to raise a set espcially with position. That said i think i bet about £4 and shove the river and hope its the aj

unknown_username

Wrong sizing pre imo. Should be something like <1.35. Probably just shove turn 

IDONKCALLU

like dohhhh bet small so by time river comes get stacks in like 2.40 i dont mind the shove tho to look weak het betting 5 to leave like 2.50 left that looks super strong 

mattless

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

Mattless table image is pretty solid. He looks intrested in the hand on the flop i think your right to say he has jx or set on such a dry flop can't see him having need to raise a set espcially with position. That said i think i bet about £4 and shove the river and hope its the aj
Posted by jams88

 
Thank you I think!? re: my image. Think it is probably a bit laggier than that. Having trouble working out when to slow down. Bet bet bet is my default position

rancid

whatever u do don't fold

shove turn

simonnatur

don't understand majority of responses at all, with these stack to pot ratios on turn, money has to go in all day every day - surely???  or am i missing something.  Pls tell me we're not ever folding whatever he does?

KAM99

Yeah not sure you can like the call on the flop with dry board, but short of C/F I can't see you getting away from this. YOu could bet small I guess but even if he shoves over it you won't be far off 2:1 odds to call unless you bet insanely small. And as its more likely to be a Jx than a set in most cases I'm not sure I'd love checking as he will see that as a give up and bet any Jx hand quite often and it would suck to fold if that was the case. Think most cases I'd end up getting stacked if he has a set.

THENUTS480

Difficult spot i guess in these stakes it helps a lot if you have reads on the villan in question how light hes calling you down and if you feel your hand is strong enough to stack off.but i feel the best cause off action here is maybe just bet the turrn and jam the river or just jam the turn but if we do that maybe he calls us wen were beat and a smaller bet  on the turn will pot comit him to call with hands were beating atm then hes pot commited  for a river shove.Either way the pots bloated with two people calling are 3 bet and i feel yes were beat here sum off the time but were still beating quite a bit off his range i must admit the turn card is a bit sucky and also the flop been such a dry board.But in these lower stakes i feel players call down with a lot less and we are making mistake by checking as i think are cowboys a lot off the times in these lower stakes they is still value to be had here!

grantorino

If you check turn it doesnt mean you don't think there is value to be had, you may think there is more value to be had this way

When Percival mentioned c/f I would imagine it was because most good regs have a hand with showdown value on turn which they should usually check back. I wouldn't c/f without very good reads though

TWRAMYEP

check-call is best against me

mattless

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

check-call is best against me
Posted by TWRAMYEP

lol nh

TWRAMYEP

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : lol nh
Posted by mattless

ty, either way you had to go broke, was a cooler, oh and everything grantorino said

unknown_username

Its trickier than just getting it in. What does he flat 3 bets pre flop with? Thats the key to the hand imo. He prob re raises with AA most of the time so we can rule that out, its unlikely he has KK as we have two of them, does he flat with QQ/JJ? Probably, and they are beating us now so there isnt much we are beating, maybe 10,10  or AK. Its not a drawy board so there are no draws he is calling with on the flop so i think we are behind a fair bit here. Therefore, if villain can make a few moves let him try and float turn with worse hands. Dont think i put it down to be fair but i like giving him some room to make his bluffs. Your losing quite a bit here i think but at least we can try to keep worse hands in if we cant fold by check calling.

THENUTS480

Checking the turn is ok we are showing weakness and the villan may think all the hands that are losing against us are infront.Also if he checks the turn we can value bet the river confident were in front.But your image at the table is very important here im a lag player so wen i have cowboys here i want 3 streets as im capable off multi barreling my junk so when i have marjinal spots like cowboys in this spot i wanna squeeze the max value from my hand.If your a nitty player i understand its more difficult to get 3 streets off value on this spot unless were beat as the villan will know were tight,Checking the turn and if he bets into the pot he will be pot commited either way never folding here as the villan has like £7 back and were getting just over 2-1 on a call either way im happy to stack off here.

grantorino

We can't really get 3 streets when there is less than psb behind on turn

rancid

if oppo flopped a set on u then really well played w/e, reload

u have to ask the question "why is oppo flatting pre against me"

hands like this just annoy me )

grantorino

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

if oppo flopped a set on u then really well played w/e, reload u have to ask the question "why is oppo flatting pre against me" hands like this just annoy me )
Posted by rancid

Why does it annoy you?

What does answering your question achieve?

No one has suggested anything other than getting stacks in. It's questionable imo what's the best way to achieve this is. Percival suggested if we check (which wasn't line he suggested) it should be to c/ f. Against a good tag reg with no aggro history I can see merit to c/f turn when you think about ranges, but if turn checked thru it would be a clear vbet on river

rancid

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : Why does it annoy you? What does answering your question achieve? No one has suggested anything other than getting stacks in. It's questionable imo what's the best way to achieve this is. Percival suggested if we check (which wasn't line he suggested) it should be to c/ f. Against a good tag reg with no aggro history I can see merit to c/f flop when you think about ranges, but if flop checked thru it would be a clear vbet on river
Posted by grantorino

just don't get what the great debate is, oppo flats our 3 bet pre with £10 ish behind, if oppo flops a set yeah w/e -
how do we ever consider c/f


we can check or bet, don't think we ever fold

if the board flops comes nine high does oppo stack off with JJ
kinda the same situation in my eyes _)

percival09

We can bet and get it in, and imo, readless, more times than not if villain is good you're not going to get called by a hand that hero is ahead of, occasionaly you might be ahead ofc and villain might have floated AQ on flop or something random

We can check and imo fold to a reasonably sized bet on the turn. I'm not saying I do this but what's villain betting on the turn that we beat? He's checking back most of his 1pair range.

rancid

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

We can bet and get it in, and imo, readless, more times than not if villain is good you're not going to get called by a hand that hero is ahead of, occasionaly you might be ahead ofc and villain might have floated AQ on flop or something random We can check and imo fold to a reasonably sized bet on the turn. I'm not saying I do this but what's villain betting on the turn that we beat? He's checking back most of his 1pair range.
Posted by percival09

More to the point, what is capable reg flatting 3 bet pre with that we now are ahead by the turn and like you say will stack off to us - such an annoying hand

what I was trying to put across in a previous post is why is vill flatting verus hero's 3 bet in this spot, and maybe hero should ask himself that question - can't see why vill would set mine

mattless

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn?:

In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : More to the point, what is capable reg flatting 3 bet pre with that we now are ahead by the turn and like you say will stack off to us - such an annoying hand what I was trying to put across in a previous post is why is vill flatting verus hero's 3 bet in this spot, and maybe hero should ask himself that question - can't see why vill would set mine
Posted by rancid

If villian has jj (which he does) and is playing against a reasonably aggro reg (which I would say I am at this level) I don't think a call of my 3 bet in position is bad. Its not just set mining he might be prepared to get it all in on a 10 high or lower flop.

Once he calls my flop bet, sets are such a large proportion of his holding, perhaps a check on turn from me is best play, whether I can fold to bet on turn I'm not sure. In play I shoved. At the time i shrugged and thought nh move on, but I do think a better player than me might be able to c/f