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Guess the hand?

unknown_usernameunknown_username
edited July 2012 in The Poker Clinic
Hi folks,
Playing in bh....see if you can guess the hand i faced or guess the range of hands i should have faced? It'll be fun seeing if there's a concensus. I'll put the hd up tomorrow night. No reads but table have had a lot of limpers.
If you think i've played it poorly please say how i should have approached it too.

PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalanceshaggy68Small blind 40.0040.003020.00profman15Big blind 80.00120.004100.00 Your hole cardsKA
Call 80.00280.002940.00salz7312Fold    5558
@ 688
Bet 480.001600.002060.00profman15Call 480.002080.003220.00Turn  A

All-in 1020.007360.000.00profman15Unmatched bet 1160.006200.001160.00profman15ShowKA
Show8Q   River  6    Win 6200.00  
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Comments

  • jams88jams88
    edited July 2012
    i guess q8 of spades
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  • BorinLonerBorinLoner
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    i guess q8 of spades
    Posted by jams88
    Oh damn!... I was going to guess that.

    Alright. I'll take 5c7s... What do I get if I win?
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  • clubhammerclubhammer
    edited July 2012
    I agree with jams - he seems quite intuitive
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  • 12671267
    edited July 2012
    ermmm why arnt you c-betting the flop ?

    When you shove the turn what do you think he has   :S
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  • splashiessplashies
    edited July 2012
    Q♠8♠ everyday of the week :)
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited July 2012
    6 2 o/s
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  • UareLIMPERUareLIMPER
    edited July 2012
    HAHAHAHA boo hoo hoo telll me another bad beat story please, why do you call on the flop?


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  • UareLIMPERUareLIMPER
    edited July 2012
    HAHAHAHA boo hoo hoo telll me another bad beat story please, why do you call on the flop?

    As for how it could be play i might just shove pre as AK is pretty bad on the flop
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  • GlenelgGlenelg
    edited July 2012
    He’s put 20% of his stack in on the flop.  I think you have to ask yourself  “is this weak or strong?”  The only way to find out is to put him to the test ?   Personally,  I’d put another  880/960 in and see what happens.   If he folds good, if, as you say he’s been limping, he shoves, you know your answer.   At this level it’s never a shove pre,  IMO?
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  • jams88jams88
    edited July 2012
    i like your line pre, im cbetting the the flop though and folding to a riase if he flats its probably going in on the turn and we lose anyway so unlucky.
    As played i think you have to fold to his bet on the flop when you check call for turn and then its just getting it in and losing to a guy who called with q8 for who knows what reason ul
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    ermmm why arnt you c-betting the flop ? When you shove the turn what do you think he has   :S
    Posted by 1267
    As he called my initial raise, i was sure as i could be that he had a pocket pair but not AA or KK. Maybe AJ, AT. Once the Ace hits, i put myself ahead because of the top kicker. I didn't bet the flop as this chap had been been betting quite a bit for other people so lef it for him to do as didn't fancy the ai check raise at that stage.
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    Well how good was that guys....you're just too good. I've SUCH a lot to learn!!!!!!!!
    Are you all related to Daniel Negreanau?
    Sorry for wasting your time but at least it gave you a chuckle, eh?
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    HAHAHAHA boo hoo hoo telll me another bad beat story please, why do you call on the flop?
    Posted by UareLIMPER
    Hi fella

    Its not a bad beat story and i'm not sobbing. I was having a bit of a laugh (which i messed up!)asking the forum to guess the hand but was asking the forum what i should have expected when i got the call after raising all the limps. I expected a pocket pair but not AA or KK really. What range would you put him on? It was a surprise as odds were against pocket 8's so i diregarded the trips TBH. It was a solid problem asking advice.
    So in future, don't bother taking your valuable time to answer a problem you feel is a 'bad beat story' as its obviously beneath you. My apologies.
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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop
    edited July 2012
    Without reads he could have had any 8, any 6, any ace, any straight draw, backdoor flush draw!!

    I would have cbet flop, then folded to a re raise.

    If he then flatted a cbet then unlucky.
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  • jonjo75jonjo75
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    HAHAHAHA boo hoo hoo telll me another bad beat story please, why do you call on the flop? As for how it could be play i might just shove pre as AK is pretty bad on the flop
    Posted by UareLIMPER
    The fact you would shove pre with 50BB tells me all i need to know about your poker and why so rude.
    The OP was putting it up for a bit of fun for the forum.
    Try another one Prof.
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  • Curt360x27Curt360x27
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand? : The fact you would shove pre with 50BB tells me all i need to know about your poker and why so rude. The OP was putting it up for a bit of fun for the forum. Try another one Prof.
    Posted by jonjo75
    +1

    'Oh I have no post flop skillz so i'll just er......... wait............ all in 50bb!'
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    Without reads he could have had any 8, any 6, any ace, any straight draw, backdoor flush draw!! I would have cbet flop, then folded to a re raise. If he then flatted a cbet then unlucky.
    Posted by donkeyplop
    Is that normal play?
     I wouldn't expect call of 320 more with any 8 or 6 unpaired. So what is the range of calling hands in this position from the bb.Thats why i made the raise so big to get rid, hopefully, of people fishing with weak hands. He now has a idea i've got a premium hand so surely he should only be set mining or reraising with AA/KK? Yes? Is this logic flawed?
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  • jams88jams88
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand? : Is that normal play?  I wouldn't expect call of 320 more with any 8 or 6 unpaired. So what is the range of calling hands in this position from the bb.Thats why i made the raise so big to get rid, hopefully, of people fishing with weak hands. He now has a idea i've got a premium hand so surely he should only be set mining or reraising with AA/KK? Yes? Is this logic flawed?
    Posted by profman15
    Its harder to assign ranges in Bounty Hunters espcially the £2.30 ones. I tend to anaylise the table into how they play rock/maniac/loose/passive ect. Doing this you will realise that somepeople will call with any 2 cards if they already have money in the pot regardless of the raise size. If they are suited they can get a flush and get an bounty and if they are no suited well they have 2 different suits to make a flush with even better call call call
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited July 2012
    If you are checking the flop, I think you should fold to his bet.
    Also with the pre flop action I wouldn't even raise it pre, as you will have to put so much in to get all of them to fold! But there is always one donkey that come along and you don't have a made hand. So I would just flat behind and keep the pot small even if I do hit. It seems quite early aswell so no need to go crazy yet.
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    HAHAHAHA boo hoo hoo telll me another bad beat story please, why do you call on the flop? As for how it could be play i might just shove pre as AK is pretty bad on the flop
    Posted by UareLIMPER
    Where is the bad beat?? Shoving AK pre is basically turning your hand face up, and only getting called by better. Constructive comments on the forum please.
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  • Curt360x27Curt360x27
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    If you are checking the flop, I think you should fold to his bet. Also with the pre flop action I wouldn't even raise it pre, as you will have to put so much in to get all of them to fold! But there is always one donkey that come along and you don't have a made hand. So I would just flat behind and keep the pot small even if I do hit. It seems quite early aswell so no need to go crazy yet.
    Posted by Batkin88
    Should be raising 100% time here! I mean if your not popping it up with a hand as big as AK, then what are you raising with?

    Last time I checked raising with AK isnt 'crazy'.
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited July 2012
    Re read what was actually wrote, and you shouldn't raise it 100% what a ridiculous thing to say.
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  • Curt360x27Curt360x27
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    If you are checking the flop, I think you should fold to his bet. Also with the pre flop action I wouldn't even raise it pre, as you will have to put so much in to get all of them to fold! But there is always one donkey that come along and you don't have a made hand. So I would just flat behind and keep the pot small even if I do hit. It seems quite early aswell so no need to go crazy yet.
    Posted by Batkin88
    The majority of the time we don't have a made hand when we are raising pre.
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  • Batkin88Batkin88
    edited July 2012
    Yes I am aware of that, lol what are you doing?? Going through my paragraph and reiterating the points I have made.
    The point which I made is that you are not getting rid of these limp callers pre in a £2.30 BH and AK isn't that strong if you have 2 set mining and the others coming along with any 2. If you miss you have to c-bet to continue showing strength but if a limp caller gets any part of this board there shoving, and this early in a tournament it isn't worth risking your stack with AK.
    AK is overplayed way too much by cash players in MTT's, it's a good hand but I would rather have 78 suited early in a tournament when the blinds are this small lol AK is a nice shoving hand when blinds are big but not now.

    I don't see the point in throwing 20% of your stack in and probably have to fold to most flops. IMO
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    Yes I am aware of that, lol what are you doing?? Going through my paragraph and reiterating the points I have made. The point which I made is that you are not getting rid of these limp callers pre in a £2.30 BH and AK isn't that strong if you have 2 set mining and the others coming along with any 2. If you miss you have to c-bet to continue showing strength but if a limp caller gets any part of this board there shoving, and this early in a tournament it isn't worth risking your stack with AK. AK is overplayed way too much by cash players in MTT's, it's a good hand but I would rather have 78 suited early in a tournament when the blinds are this small lol AK is a nice shoving hand when blinds are big but not now. I don't see the point in throwing 20% of your stack in and probably have to fold to most flops. IMO
    Posted by Batkin88
    Hi Batkin
    Some really good points made in your posts especially concerning early stages play. (by the way i'm not a cash player). I thought my raise wa big enough to get the fisherman out of the pot and maybe get me plaing v 1 other whoi would assume had a pocket pair (hence my check on flop which would have been a fold had he bet)or win the pot. So would you have just checked and saw the flop? I didn't honestly expect someone looking for flush draws to call after my raise. That was the way i looked at it and it was obviously wrong. Ta for your help guys. lets just try to keep the debate well-mannered and lacking in angst....after all we have enough of that at the tables!!
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  • pr1nnyraidpr1nnyraid
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    Yes I am aware of that, lol what are you doing?? Going through my paragraph and reiterating the points I have made...
    Posted by Batkin88
    I think you and Curt.. are just arguing for the sake of it. Point being it's +EV to flat call with AK here & it's +EV to raise with AK here. So it can be down to preference. Personally prefer to raise here for many reasons I won't delve into, but I wouldn't argue with someone wanting to limp here to reduce variance in the tournament. Obv batkin you play a lower variance style and that is shown through your steady ROI, so thats cool.. 
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  • bolly580bolly580
    edited July 2012
    ?? well this was pretty pointless
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  • UareLIMPERUareLIMPER
    edited July 2012
    Mabye i was wrong that this was a bad beat story, just seemed like one. 

    What i am saying is yes you probably think you are good most times when u see what turn card, but I dont undersatnd the call on the flop, you say u put him on a pocket pair so ur calling to try and hit a K or A? and even if u do hit he may still already have you crushed (like he does now).

    What I am saying about shoving is if you cant find a fold with AK on a flop then you mabye should just shove pre with so many limpers, not that I personally would do it. And its more like 37BB as your playing his stack, not your own. 

    Dunno though mabye im wrong i hate tornies really!
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited July 2012
    In Response to Re: Guess the hand?:
    Mabye i was wrong that this was a bad beat story, just seemed like one.  What i am saying is yes you probably think you are good most times when u see what turn card, but I dont undersatnd the call on the flop, you say u put him on a pocket pair so ur calling to try and hit a K or A? and even if u do hit he may still already have you crushed (like he does now). What I am saying about shoving is if you cant find a fold with AK on a flop then you mabye should just shove pre with so many limpers, not that I personally would do it. And its more like 37BB as your playing his stack, not your own.  Dunno though mabye im wrong i hate tornies really!
    Posted by UareLIMPER
    Hi fella
    I appreciate ur reply mate. I think the check on flop was that i had it fixed in my head that he had pocket pair  and was going to all-in. I was 'lucky' if you can say that to catch Ace so thought i was then ahead with two pair and top kicker. It was just one of those hands but you can see there's been a variety in people's opinions. If i'd done it right and blotted out his hand , i'm sure some people would have guessed at pocket pairs or maybe AJ+. Bad beat stories are a bit of a bore. I only give them back in return. cheers fella...say hello if we sit at a table together eh?
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