How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?

DOHHHHHHH

Been experimenting abit since going back to cash this last 10 days ago.

I'm not gonna be a player who sits and waits for fish to donk off to me I'm always gonna try and take on all players at the table when I can, it's only 30nl they must be exploitable, so what's the best way to go about it?

Is it best to make 3bets pre flop and try and take it down there and then? Or to call in position and try and represent hands down the streets?

It's prob villain dependant, but what kinda things should I factor in when deciding which lines to take?

How do I respond to 3bets in position? Is it just best to fold? Or peel and represent again?

I'll post a few hands as examples, some went well, some didn't.

1)

This villain seems rock solid. Most of the times My previous 3bets have mainly been good squeeze spots in late position with 1/2 players inbetween. He has tended to 4b or fold

*edit, turn sizing looks too big reading it back.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
ronnieg197	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£34.93
sethbear	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£16.98
	Your hole cards	9 J
elbows7	Fold
ChipsOTool	Fold
xxx	Raise		£0.90	£1.35	£28.20
DOHHHHHHH	Raise		£3.00	£4.35	£29.48
ronnieg197	Fold
sethbear	Fold
xxx	Call		£2.10	£6.45	£26.10
Flop
		8 3 2
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£4.20	£10.65	£25.28
xxx	Call		£4.20	£14.85	£21.90
Turn
		A
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£8.10	£22.95	£17.18
xxx	All-in		£21.90	£44.85	£0.00
DOHHHHHHH	Fold
xxx	Muck

2)

Ridic tight player opener here, good squeeze spot? I don't like peeling here with so many people in the pot. With a suited ace or a pp I would but it could get messy with this hand.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
ronnieg197	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£32.16
sethbear	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£14.58
	Your hole cards	9 Q
elbows7	Raise		£0.90	£1.35	£35.04
ChipsOTool	Call		£0.90	£2.25	£61.23
bolly580	Call		£0.90	£3.15	£29.10
DOHHHHHHH	Raise		£3.60	£6.75	£34.13
ronnieg197	Call		£3.45	£10.20	£28.71
sethbear	Fold
elbows7	All-in		£35.04	£45.24	£0.00
ChipsOTool	Fold
bolly580	Fold
DOHHHHHHH	Fold
ronnieg197	Fold
elbows7	Muck
elbows7	Win		£12.90		£12.90
elbows7	Return		£32.34	£0.00	£45.24

3) example of peeling in a 3b pot in position, just fold pre? I thought at first villain was really tight, I dunno if I mis-read him or hes adapted but he plays back at me alot now. Is it best to 4bet or fold or can I peel and make moves on this kind of board?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
xxx	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£55.68
ChipsOTool	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£28.88
	Your hole cards	K 9
bolly580	Fold
DOHHHHHHH	Raise		£1.20	£1.65	£29.67
xxx	Raise		£3.75	£5.40	£51.93
ChipsOTool	Fold
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£2.70	£8.10	£26.97
Flop
		2 10 4
xxx	Bet		£4.80	£12.90	£47.13
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£4.80	£17.70	£22.17
Turn
		8
xx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£6.90	£24.60	£15.27
xxx

4) Same villain as above, it's the first time I've seen him donk lead, no reads on what that might mean. Just fold again?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
spudman1	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£21.31
elbows7	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£27.75
	Your hole cards	Q 7
arnold03	Fold
xxx	Raise		£0.90	£1.35	£29.10
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£0.90	£2.25	£28.98
Timur	Fold
spudman1	Fold
elbows7	Fold
Flop
		2 K 6
xxx	Bet		£1.50	£3.75	£27.60
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£1.50	£5.25	£27.48
Turn
		J
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£3.30	£8.55	£24.18
xxx	Call		£3.30	£11.85	£24.30
River
		K
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH

Any feedback on the hands is cool, but wanna focus more on the thread title if possible

ty.

grantorino

Will give general advice later

1 not the best 3b bluff hand. 3b smaller, think about why, generally just fold pre

2. Just call pre. Squeezing utg opens from redic tight players prob not a great idea without better reads esp as you should be able to call profitably

3. Prefer 4b or fold but its ok

4 fold pre ainec. He didn't donk lead. Float is meh

beaneh

stupidly quick/obvious answer?

Value bet wider, bluff wider, apply lots of pressure, find their weaknesses rinse repeat.

hands -

1 3b smaller, cb smaller, b/f turn is good he just has it.

2 call Q9s IP (try forumlating a better 3bsq/call/fold range here...)

3 smaller pre. have to bet turn once we call flop and he checks, stacks are bad if he c/c though probably give up.

4 3b>peel pre, jam river 2xpot.

yb

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

stupidly quick/obvious answer? Value bet wider, bluff wider, apply lots of pressure, find their weaknesses rinse repeat.
Posted by beaneh

3bet a lot in position, bad TAGs usually adjust by calling more with marginal hands, which you can then exploit in position on the right flops because they don't tend to bluff often postflop either

pr1nnyraid

Without trying to be rude it seems like you are making it up as you go along.. getting yourself into loads of spots with little equity (be it equity to win or fold equity) where the only feasible way of winning a hand is betting. 

I don't mind a laggy style but you have to be thinking alot clearer in the hands, you can put alot of pressure on players by being active pre & post flops but you need a good balance of bluffs / thin value / value and a good read on oppo's & MOST importantly you need to know when to give up. 
When you aren't picking good spots and arent playing this style cautiously, then a nit is going to be very profitable against you. It is predictable and easy and soon enough ppl will just be smooth calling 3bets with KQ v you then c/c 3 streets when they hit top pair. Then you start steaming and lose more etc etc.  

I guess your op is saying "I can win playing like a nit but it's boring, i want to outplay these regs and not just outgrind them"

Note: your reads on opponents are either made up because you think they sound good, or you really aren't thinking, as torino said "ridic tight player opens utg" so you 3bet?! makes very little sense.

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

Without trying to be rude it seems like you are making it up as you go along.. getting yourself into loads of spots with little equity (be it equity to win or fold equity) where the only feasible way of winning a hand is betting.  I don't mind a laggy style but you have to be thinking alot clearer in the hands, you can put alot of pressure on players by being active pre & post flops but you need a good balance of bluffs / thin value / value and a good read on oppo's & MOST importantly you need to know when to give up.  When you aren't picking good spots and arent playing this style cautiously, then a nit is going to be very profitable against you. It is predictable and easy and soon enough ppl will just be smooth calling 3bets with KQ v you then c/c 3 streets when they hit top pair. Then you start steaming and lose more etc etc.   I guess your op is saying "I can win playing like a nit but it's boring, i want to outplay these regs and not just outgrind them" Note: your reads on opponents are either made up because you think they sound good, or you really aren't thinking, as torino said "ridic tight player opens utg" so you 3bet?! makes very little sense.
Posted by pr1nnyraid

Good post. Most of it is spot on. 

I've already identified these problems, you've noted, hence starting the thread. 

Trying to get it clear in my mind how to go about exploiting this type of player. Haven't got a plan at the moment.

pr1nnyraid

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image? : Good post. Most of it is spot on.  I've already identified these problems, you've noted, hence starting the thread.  Trying to get it clear in my mind how to go about exploiting this type of player. Haven't got a plan at the moment.
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

You just have to be on point when it comes to reading the situation / game flow / dynamic at any given time.

Playing an open style like this can be very profitable and more enjoyable, but it's also very swingy. You will start to build grudges and rivalries with different regs and randoms at the table and you need to keep adapting to keep beating them. you will start to find yourself in levelling spots and it is key to keep making the right decision and keeping clarity.

As soon as it gets hazy nit up.

jimifloyd

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image? : Good post. Most of it is spot on.  I've already identified these problems, you've noted, hence starting the thread.  Trying to get it clear in my mind how to go about exploiting this type of player. Haven't got a plan at the moment.
Posted by DOHHHHHHH

The NL holdem workbook-Exploiting regulars by Tri (slowhabit) Nguyen.

KKrippler

In my experience, regs at 30/40nl will not vary their style of play to your laggy image, any big pots your involved with a reg your probably beat and their never folding.

Regs always have the nuts in big pots.

I 8 table now just to stop myself from bluffing too much. I find you may win lots of small pots, but get involved in one big pot to lose any progress/profit vs a reg. Some regs play back but not many.

Its painful as I prefer playing looser but my bankroll prefers if i play like a nit.

rancid

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

In my experience, regs at 30/40nl will not vary their style of play to your laggy image, any big pots your involved with a reg your probably beat and their never folding. Regs always have the nuts in big pots. I 8 table now just to stop myself from bluffing too much. I find you may win lots of small pots, but get involved in one big pot to lose any progress/profit vs a reg. Some regs play back but not many. Its painful as I prefer playing looser but my bankroll prefers if i play like a nit.
Posted by KKrippler

+1 think you'll find yourself outplaying regs/randoms in small pots but in bigger pots they always have it )
Haven't played the limit loads so I can offer little advice - good luck because through NL20-50 they all seem to play the same way - u exploit the weak then lose profit to REG ! They are all nits )
Just need to probably pay more attention when in a big pot with a reg and show up with it more than you don't :S
Kinds found playing laggy is very swingy, I been up and down like a yoyo for months :S

IDONKCALLU

blunt here problem with dohhhhh u have no pateinece this isnt haeds up hyper sit n go where u win most hands this is a 6 max game u have to be patient u cant win every hand u play far to aggro pal 

andybeth

Aggressive and loose play can work well versus most regs at these limits, but I'd slow down a bit If I were u. Good to be loose, but when these guys recognise you're playing loosely, which shouldn't take long, I'd tighten up the range a touch to exploit the times they play back at you.

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

stupidly quick/obvious answer? Value bet wider, bluff wider, apply lots of pressure, find their weaknesses rinse repeat. hands - 1 3b smaller, cb smaller, b/f turn is good he just has it. 2 call Q9s IP (try forumlating a better 3bsq/call/fold range here...) 3 smaller pre. have to bet turn once we call flop and he checks, stacks are bad if he c/c though probably give up. 4 3b />peel pre, jam river 2xpot.
Posted by beaneh

Got 1 thing right then

Thnx all for replies, will try and change a few things next session and see how it goes.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
spudman1	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£21.31
elbows7	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£27.75
	Your hole cards	Q 7
arnold03	Fold
xxx	Raise		£0.90	£1.35	£29.10
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£0.90	£2.25	£28.98
Timur	Fold
spudman1	Fold
elbows7	Fold
Flop
		2 K 6
xxx	Bet		£1.50	£3.75	£27.60
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£1.50	£5.25	£27.48
Turn
		J
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£3.30	£8.55	£24.18
xxx	Call		£3.30	£11.85	£24.30
River
		K
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	All-in		£24.18	£36.03	£0.00
xxx	Call		£24.18	£60.21	£0.12
xxx	Show	Q K
DOHHHHHHH	Show	Q 7
DOHHHHHHH	Win	Flush to the King	£58.41		£58.41

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: How best to exploit TAG regs @ 30nl w/laggy image?:

stupidly quick/obvious answer? Value bet wider, bluff wider, apply lots of pressure, find their weaknesses rinse repeat. hands - 1 3b smaller, cb smaller, b/f turn is good he just has it. 2 call Q9s IP (try forumlating a better 3bsq/call/fold range here...) 3 smaller pre. have to bet turn once we call flop and he checks, stacks are bad if he c/c though probably give up. 4 3b />peel pre, jam river 2xpot.
Posted by beaneh

Got 1 thing right then

Thnx all for replies, will try and change a few things next session and see how it goes.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
spudman1	Small blind		£0.15	£0.15	£21.31
elbows7	Big blind		£0.30	£0.45	£27.75
	Your hole cards	Q 7
arnold03	Fold
xxx	Raise		£0.90	£1.35	£29.10
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£0.90	£2.25	£28.98
Timur	Fold
spudman1	Fold
elbows7	Fold
Flop
		2 K 6
xxx	Bet		£1.50	£3.75	£27.60
DOHHHHHHH	Call		£1.50	£5.25	£27.48
Turn
		J
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	Bet		£3.30	£8.55	£24.18
xxx	Call		£3.30	£11.85	£24.30
River
		K
xxx	Check
DOHHHHHHH	All-in		£24.18	£36.03	£0.00
xxx	Call		£24.18	£60.21	£0.12
xxx	Show	Q K
DOHHHHHHH	Show	Q 7
DOHHHHHHH	Win	Flush to the King	£58.41		£58.41