You need to be logged in to your Sky Poker account above to post discussions and comments.

You might need to refresh your page afterwards.

Sky Poker forums will be temporarily unavailable from 11pm Wednesday July 25th.
Sky Poker Forums is upgrading its look! Stay tuned for the big reveal!

Microstakes Cash Tv Table

edited December 2012 in Poker Chat
At the moment on Sky there is no Tv table for the Cash microstakes players,i fully understand that the excitement and good viewing is at the higher end of the range.Personally i always watch Top of the pots and find it a great show.

However there are a couple of reasons why i would think it a good idea to have at least one Tv table for the microstakes.The players at the lower levels myself included are generally the players who have the most to learn and would benefit from seeing hands analysed on the show.

There is also the unique factor of Sky Poker showing the hands on Tv and i feel that this could be an attraction which would entice new players to join the site.

Just my thoughts on this and i would be interested in what other people think.

Comments

  • edited December 2012
    +1

    I know some hands at 4NL would be a nightmare to analyse on 861 but they could mostly just have it as hand that people specifically post in for the show and they're gonna look at them first anyway to make sure they aint just stupid
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    +1 I know some hands at 4NL would be a nightmare to analyse on 861 but they could mostly just have it as hand that people specifically post in for the show and they're gonna look at them first anyway to make sure they aint just stupid
    Posted by Lambert180
    lol at the thought of TK, Richard and some professional poker analyist trying to make sense of some NL4 hands I've seen.

    "We'll this guy has limped UTG with J6s... what do you make of that Scotty?"
    "I don't like it. But we havn't seen the dynamic at the table."
    BTN makes it 40p with AK,
    "obviously he should fold but let's see what he actually does..."
    UTG calls and flop comes K62r
    "Right TK, what do you make of this 4p bet from UTG?"
    and so on and so on for no reason.

    There's nothing much to analyse. Once you have said "don't open limp pre", "bet top pair untill you get raised, then fold" and "don't bluff, you have almost no fold equity at these stakes" that is pretty much all there is to say.

  • edited December 2012
    I like the way that a huge move is called "reckless" and "perhaps he's a novice player" when it's low stakes games being shown but a similar move at high stakes is called "aggro" or "high level thinking"
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : There's nothing much to analyse. Once you have said "don't open limp pre", "bet top pair untill you get raised, then fold" and "don't bluff, you have almost no fold equity at these stakes" that is pretty much all there is to say.
    Posted by jugglegeek
    +1 to this.

    It's far less interesting to talk about play through the streets when you know that the likely reasons for each action are that the players don't really understand too much about the game. It also has to be said that most of the good players at the lower limits will be playing a straight, tight ABC game. Even if you get a hand without limping and without bizarre bets through the streets, it's probably just going to be a cooler between two of those tight, ABC players. - Not very interesting.

    FCHD - Usually those differences in commentary are quite fair. Not just because the players at higher levels are generally better but also because they recognise which boards are good to float, raise as a bluff, raise for thin-value, etc. and at lower levels they just don't. The same move can be good on one board and terrible on another, or great against one player but terrible against another.

    Of course there are weak players at higher levels, just not as many.
  • edited December 2012
    watching low stakes cash on tv = boring
    I fully understand how it's good for the low stakes players, but for the audience as a whole, it's boring.
  • edited December 2012
    Sky used to have a 10nl mastercash table I used to try get on it every week lol maybe should bring it back with the mastercash show with an hour for each level I think that was very popular.but yeah I agree micros are not going to be as interesting as the higher stakes but thats to be expected.The positive side though it will be good for micro players to get analysis and see where they are goin wrong and get some very useful advice plus every1 loves a bit of tv time lol
  • edited December 2012
    Still though, I understand how a tv icon on a low stakes table might make more people join the site/play cash, and then Sky don't even have to show any hands from that table lol! just stick a tv icon and boom, demand increases by 50% gtd
  • edited December 2012
    I never liked the Saturday Mastercash shows, for the record. I much prefer the diversity of the current format.

    In the past I supported the idea of having micro stakes TV tables. I've changed my opinion since playing a few hands at those levels and the thought of these stakes being a regular feature of the shows doesn't give me pleasant, tingly feelings.

    For the sake of the occasional Sky Poker School show on micro stakes, I think they could have a TV table at that level. Such a table would only need to be a temporary fixture in the few days before the show for which it's intended, though. I would not see any problem with a one hour show, every few months, being taken up by NL4 "action".
  • edited December 2012
    I'd be far more interested in an hour of 2p-4p cash than another hour of "Top Of The Pots" which usually features some dreadful play (as well as a lot of excellent play of course) at levels which I'd never aspire to play even if I had the cash.

    Even so, the setting up of a 2p-4p TV table does not mean they have to show any of it, but it does mean that low stakes players can ask for the hands from that table to be featured on Poker Clinic for example.
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    I'd be far more interested in an hour of 2p-4p cash than another hour of "Top Of The Pots" which usually features some dreadful play (as well as a lot of excellent play of course) at levels which I'd never aspire to play even if I had the cash.

    Even so, the setting up of a 2p-4p TV table does not mean they have to show any of it, but it does mean that low stakes players can ask for the hands from that table to be featured on Poker Clinic for example.
    Posted by FCHD
    That's something I would very much like to avoid.

    I have no problem in principle with hands being shown from micro stakes. I just don't like the idea of them appearing frequently, especially if they'd take up time on the clinic that could be used for better things.

    The Poker Clinic as it is does have problems with hand request volume. I don't think this would be a good remedy for those problems, though.
  • edited December 2012
    Agree with the senitment here

    Just on a side note, I wish all you lot with grey heads would actually get avatars! I actually have to read your name to work out who is posting! :)
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    I'd be far more interested in an hour of 2p-4p cash than another hour of "Top Of The Pots" which usually features some dreadful play (as well as a lot of excellent play of course) at levels which I'd never aspire to play even if I had the cash.
     
    Even so, the setting up of a 2p-4p TV table does not mean they have to show any of it, but it does mean that low stakes players can ask for the hands from that table to be featured on Poker Clinic for example.
    Posted by FCHD
    Oh, and I don't agree with this.

    Yes, you do see the odd poor play but a large majority of TOTP hands involve plays that would be a good idea which could work if the hands and circumstances were different. Someone can run a very good, intricate bluff that would be brilliant if their opponent doesn't have the nuts. The times when their opponent does have the nuts, they look stupid... but you don't see the times those bluffs get through because the pot doesn't get big enough to make the show.
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    Agree with the senitment here Just on a side note, I wish all you lot with grey heads would actually get avatars! I actually have to read your name to work out who is posting! :)
    Posted by GREGHOGG
    I feel the grey avatar best reflects my alias. Everyone else using it needs to change. :)
  • edited December 2012
    everyone change to a lemon imo
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : That's something I would very much like to avoid. I have no problem in principle with hands being shown from micro stakes. I just don't like the idea of them appearing frequently, especially if they'd take up time on the clinic that could be used for better things. The Poker Clinic as it is does have problems with hand request volume. I don't think this would be a good remedy for those problems, though.
    Posted by BorinLoner
    "Better Things" - I've heard it all now. That is quite offensive.

    Until you've seen the situation, you don't knpw whether the play at a particular 2p-4p hand is going to be more or less interesting than a hand at £2.50-£5.

    I take it you play at medium-high stakes and you're alright Jack,
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : "Better Things" - I've heard it all now. That is quite offensive. Until you've seen the situation, you don't knpw whether the play at a particular 2p-4p hand is going to be more or less interesting than a hand at £2.50-£5. I take it you play at medium-high stakes and you're alright Jack,
    Posted by FCHD
    You don't like my point, so you use the word "offensive" to try to gain ground in the debate? My name's not Jack, by the way. Address the argument, not the player - Getting personal just undermines your argument. Besides which, making a debate about whether a particular blind level should be shown on TV into a question of my morality, ethics or integrity is of dubious merit.

    Those "better things" will be analysis that doesn't nearly always start with "Don't limp" or "Just bet your hand for value" as was mentioned in jugglegeek's post. The reason this will almost always be the advice is because that's almost always the way to play well at micro stakes levels. The thought of having several low stakes hands take up one of the few hours of the shows that are open to hand requests is not something that I like.

    Now, to address your point of being offensive: I don't think a blind level can be offended. I think if I had said "You are a low stakes player and therefore stupid/bad/dull", then you would have a point. I did not say any such thing. However the play at those levels is dull, frequently bad and the players are generally not highly skilled. (I don't think lacking poker skill makes anyone stupid)

    For what it's worth, I rarely play at any level. When I do play, it's usually MTT's or SNG's, not cash. Does that make my opinion less legitimate, more legitimate or does it make no difference?
  • edited December 2012
    Maybe Sky don't want to show hands lower than NL20 on their TV channel because they don't want to shout about how they charge 7.5% rake for NL4-10 and 5% for everyone else. Cat and pigeons introduced... *steps back!*
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    Maybe Sky don't want to show hands lower than NL20 on their TV channel because they don't want to shout about how they charge 7.5% rake for NL4-10 and 5% for everyone else. Cat and pigeons introduced... *steps back!*
    Posted by jugglegeek
    They do reward those levels with slightly greater C4P's though. That's got to make up for the higher rake, no?

    No.
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : They do reward those levels with slightly greater C4P's though. That's got to make up for the higher rake, no? No.
    Posted by BorinLoner
    Maybe I'm being stupid, but how do they?

    It's 6 points per £1 of rake regardless of whether you pay your £1 rake @ 4NL or 1000NL
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : Maybe I'm being stupid, but how do they? It's 6 points per £1 of rake regardless of whether you pay your £1 rake @ 4NL or 1000NL
    Posted by Lambert180
    Because you get that £1 raked (proportionally) more easily at NL4 than at NL100.

    So for every £1000 you put in at NL4, you pay £75 in rake and get 450 points.
    At NL100 that £1000 only sees £50 raked and 300 points.
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    I like the way that a huge move is called "reckless" and "perhaps he's a novice player" when it's low stakes games being shown but a similar move at high stakes is called "aggro" or "high level thinking"
    Posted by FCHD
    Just a big +1 to this.
  • edited December 2012
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table:
    In Response to Re: Microstakes Cash Tv Table : Because you get that £1 raked (proportionally) more easily at NL4 than at NL100. So for every £1000 you put in at NL4, you pay £75 in rake and get 450 points. At NL100 that £1000 only sees £50 raked and 300 points.
    Posted by BorinLoner
    Lol oh yeah, of course, higher rake = higher C4P, but yeah I think I'd just take the lower rake please :)
  • edited December 2012
    could they not show some hands in big blinds, compare two hands and the play in two hands, then have to guess which was the higher stakes hand and which was the low stakes etc.

    deffo good idea to get more of the lower limits on tv too.
  • edited December 2012
    Thanks to all who replied.
Sign In or Register to comment.