Total Player 2?

Sky_Poker

For those of you that remember Total Player from while back, we've been discussing it recently and it would be good to get your feedback too please...

- What did you think of it?
- Should we do it again?
- What did you like?
- What would you do differently?
- How would you chose a winner?
- What should the prize be?

It would be good to get your thoughts as it might help us decide if we do it again and, if so, what the format is.

Thanks
Sky Poker

FCHD

In order to give some sensible answers, can you give some explanation of how it worked last time? I believe Dan Brown won it, but that's about it

The_Don90

I missed alot of this but everyone i speak to speaks very highly of it. 

for people like me, and newbies who have literally no clue about TP was, would sky mind explaining the origional format please. 

Sky_Poker

In a (very brief) nutshell...

It was a TV Series on Sky Poker TV, with qualifiers running simultaneously on skypoker.com.

It was like a poker version of a TV talent show, where we whittled down players via challenges with the result being the finding of our 'Total Player' - which as you pointed out was Dan Brown.

Guess it would be hard for you to comment if you haven't seen it but here's a clip on youtube which might help a bit - see here

Thanks
Sky Poker

MAXALLY

Congratulations TommyD.

#endthread

But seriously...

1) In house tutors (obv not orford)

2) A live casino play off.

3) No public voting for eventual winner

4) 3 different levels/discipline

5) 1 years sponsored pro as main prize.

TINTIN

im a biit hazy on the whole issue so a reminder would be good, must be 3 year since it ran now.

i just remember there was 3 mentors who had 6 picks. they follwed their sessions and gave them challenges and whittled down accordingly. i dont remember their selection criteria or even how the final winner was selected but thats a rough out line

MattBates

Was it for MTT's? Cash? STT? All three?

Lambert180

Would absolutely love to see Total Player come back. It was one of the promos that was running when I first started watching 865 (back then) and decided to sign up, so I didn't really use the forum back then but from what I saw on the channel, it looked like a great promo.

I'm not sure the winner being picked by the forum (like last time) is the best way because I think it causes things to become more of a popularity contest as appose to finding the best player. Not sure how else a winner could be picked though.

Prize could possibly be like a 24 month deal with TSP or something, but TSP doesn't seem to be very set in stone as to what events they will play, how often outings happen etc so that's probably not a great idea if people don't really know what they're winning. Maybe Sky could offer to fully stake X player for every leg of the GPS or GUKPT or UKIPT or w/e for a full season.

Am I right that last time, each coach picked a list of around 30 players, which were shortlisted to 6 who got 1-to-1 time with them, and were eventually whittled down to 1 player from each coach? How were the 30 players each picked last time? Just a case of the analyst having to put the time in and watch the games?

FWIW, I think this was the case last time but it shuold be for an up-and-coming player because alot of top top players on the site probably won't benefit hugely (relatively speaking) from the coaching or the prize. I think last time it was aimed at developing players wanting to move to the next level but I may be wrong.

Wilhelm

I remember the old Total Player promotion.  Seems a long time ago now.

I thought the old format was decent.  From memory it was an hour show every Saturday somewhere in the middle or end of the MasterCash broadcast.  I think an hour a week was enough airtime for the promotion and any more time may have been overkill.

The 3 tutors thing worked well, this should be repeated, or maybe even 4.

The only thing that got my goat about the old format was that we were told every week that you would be considered if you played any real-money tables.  I was playing NL4 at the time and used to spend every week trying to make really flamboyant plays so I might be considered, but never was. Admittedly I wasn't good enough, but I don't think anyone playing below NL30 was even featured in any of the shows.  Maxally's idea of a tier system would be good, or perhaps even 1 wildcard pick from each judge for the lower staked players.

The_Don90

I remember back when i was even worse than i am now, I sat on a table with a guy with a star, alias was TP_Nutter - think that was Nutter5932, anyways that gave me a reason to return to sky because i had a goal - i only wanted the star avatar fwiw lol.

Anyways i would love to see a return of this. The 6 picks would be interesting to see, although which experts have picks? 

Also what would be the criteria for the pics would be key.

BorinLoner

I don't know about the specifics but I was aware of the general idea of this last time around.

I think it's a good idea to have each analyst taking part having a group of selections, as last time. I don't think it would be a good idea to have some sort of community selection, though, because some people are more popular and more social than others. That doesn't make them more deserving.



By the way, I'm in total disagreement with Maxally on one thing: I would love to be in team Orford.

Wilhelm

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

Would absolutely love to see Total Player come back. It was one of the promos that was running when I first started watching 865 (back then) and decided to sign up, so I didn't really use the forum back then but from what I saw on the channel, it looked like a great promo. I'm not sure the winner being picked by the forum (like last time) is the best way because I think it causes things to become more of a popularity contest as appose to finding the best player. Not sure how else a winner could be picked though. Prize could possibly be like a 24 month deal with TSP or something, but TSP doesn't seem to be very set in stone as to what events they will play, how often outings happen etc so that's probably not a great idea if people don't really know what they're winning. Maybe Sky could offer to fully stake X player for every leg of the GPS or GUKPT or UKIPT or w/e for a full season. Am I right that last time, each coach picked a list of around 30 players, which were shortlisted to 6 who got 1-to-1 time with them, and were eventually whittled down to 1 player from each coach? How were the 30 players each picked last time? Just a case of the analyst having to put the time in and watch the games? FWIW, I think this was the case last time but it shuold be for an up-and-coming player because alot of top top players on the site probably won't benefit hugely (relatively speaking) from the coaching or the prize. I think last time it was aimed at developing players wanting to move to the next level but I may be wrong.
Posted by Lambert180

I don't think a popularity contest would be the worst thing tbh.  Pretty much rules me out, but it would be nice if the winner had a decent personality.

Lambert180

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

In Response to Re: Total Player 2? : I don't think a popularity contest would be the worst thing tbh.  Pretty much rules me out, but it would be nice if the winner had a decent personality.
Posted by Wilhelm

Yeah 100% agree about personality, and it should come into it I guess but it should only be 1 factor, no1 wants some sicko robot grinder who doesn't know what sunlight or conversation is.

Meh, I'm probably wrong, I'm sure loads of people on the forum are capable of just picking the person they actually believe is the best.

Wilhelm

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

In Response to Re: Total Player 2? : Yeah 100% agree about personality, and it should come into it I guess but it should only be 1 factor, no1 wants some sicko robot grinder who doesn't know what sunlight or conversation is. Meh, I'm probably wrong, I'm sure loads of people on the forum are capable of just picking the person they actually believe is the best.
Posted by Lambert180

They did last time, imo.  Pretty much unanimous win for Dan Brown, well deserved.  Probably had something to do with an incredible hero call he made where he called the guy's hand exactly down to the suits I think.  Then again, if I saw it today, I'd probably think it was standard.

beaneh

maybe have mentors that know more than the players involved if possible? was quite a big flaw in the last version, especially as so many of the mentors got criticised for bringing nothing to the table.

re how to choose a winner, dont just run a shallow stacked 1 off comp and say the winner of it is by default the best ldo.

league format, could have a doubles format where it's a lower stakes player and a higher stakes player and the higher is expected to coach/mentor the lower and it's combined results in 2 different (high/low stakes) leagues where you play multiple games.

FCHD

How long ago was that video made? Orford looks 10-15 years younger than he does now!

The_Don90

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

In Response to Re: Total Player 2? : They did last time, imo.  Pretty much unanimous win for Dan Brown, well deserved.  Probably had something to do with an incredible hero call he made where he called the guy's hand exactly down to the suits I think.  Then again, if I saw it today, I'd probably think it was standard.
Posted by Wilhelm

we now have to take in team loyaties though. Imagine if the final 2 was a TKP'r/Team Diamond (few people in both teams worth) v a THS player. 

BorinLoner

One thing is for sure, it can in no way be based on poker points... We don't need a Total Player that's another rake race.

BorinLoner

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

maybe have mentors that know more than the players involved if possible? was quite a big flaw in the last version, especially as so many of the mentors got criticised for bringing nothing to the table. re how to choose a winner, dont just run a shallow stacked 1 off comp and say the winner of it is by default the best ldo. league format, could have a doubles format where it's a lower stakes player and a higher stakes player and the higher is expected to coach/mentor the lower and it's combined results in 2 different (high/low stakes) leagues where you play multiple games.
Posted by beaneh

You and I, beaneh? I'll coach you, I don't mind.

rancid

- What did you think of it?
- Should we do it again?
- What did you like?
- What would you do differently?
- How would you chose a winner?
- What should the prize be?

IDK

I just wanna be on the telly box !

Lambert180

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

maybe have mentors that know more than the players involved if possible? was quite a big flaw in the last version, especially as so many of the mentors got criticised for bringing nothing to the table. re how to choose a winner, dont just run a shallow stacked 1 off comp and say the winner of it is by default the best ldo. league format, could have a doubles format where it's a lower stakes player and a higher stakes player and the higher is expected to coach/mentor the lower and it's combined results in 2 different (high/low stakes) leagues where you play multiple games.
Posted by beaneh

Great idea... got a partner Beaneh?

Unknown

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

In Response to Re: Total Player 2? : Great idea... got a partner Beaneh?
Posted by Lambert180

Making me cry here Paul

liamboi11

- What did you think of it?

I loved watching total player think watched every episode and like that it gave someone a chance of playing the wsop main event.
- Should we do it again?

defo should come back think I posted a couple of months about wanting it back saying be great getting the likes of for e.g thewy,ryan,stu rutter,redmond coaching every week which would help improve the players game even if don`t get through to next round.
- What did you like?

I liked the the challenges see how different players from each format did at the other formats and if they made profit/loss on the challenge overall.also liked when the mentors were selecting their top 6 then 3 then their final pick was good to see them do this on tv and why they selected that particular player.
- What would you do differently?

don`t know if this is true but heard that coaching was only like an hour a week by private messaging or phone call. I would like the mentors to spend more time with the players if they can maybe few hours or even do group coaching sessions with all their players and each players as a few hands each to discuss.
- How would you chose a winner?

don`t think the voting should be done by the community this time. I think all the mentors plus the rest of sky team should pick the rightful winner on who done best on the challenges,who has improved the most throughout the competition,who done well in all formats. So basically in general who they think best for the prize and best for representing sky.
- What should the prize be?

don`t think it should be one mtt event $10000 buyin I would like a package for the year for say £5k-10k to play like ukipt,gukpt,spts events and maybe the winner can select a few events he wants to playand where it suits them to travel to.

so imo would be great for tv to have the competition back,  great for community to have discussions about the show etc, great for players that may not get to the final 3 or so but was involved and still got some coaching from mentors that may improve their game, finally great to give someone a chance to play a few events that they may not normally have a chance to play and win some moniez.

one last thing the mentors last time got 20% back off any players winnings through the competition which I think is only fair if the mentors are putting a lot of work into this competition so should still apply.

unknown_username

Am I right in thinking that Sparse was one of the three finallists last time? I haven't seen him on Sky for a long time. Does anyone know what he's doing now?

liamboi11

yeah sparce made final 3 no idea what he doing now though

mewillows

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

In Response to Re: Total Player 2? : Making me cry here Paul
Posted by CoxyLboro

dont listen to him Chris. #paulthetraitor

I still think youre awesome xxx

Smitalos

I would say Orford and Tikay havn't aged a bit...

But I don't like to bluff fish.





OOHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!
DOUBLE BURRRNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!

CHILLIE

 love to see the original winner of the first total player to comment on this post for his take on what he got out of it, dantb wasnt it, do sky remember him peddled his name for months as the face of sky then..................................................nothing

bugaloo

needs to be a prize worth winning and something sustainable and memorable

otherwise a waste of time

bugaloo

beanehs idea is a winner

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: Total Player 2?:

needs to be a prize worth winning and something sustainable and memorable otherwise a waste of time
Posted by bugaloo

Disagree, I had a deep run in the first series, and didn't win. It was anything but a waste of time.

I thought there was alot of good points from a participants perspective in the first series. 

Can't comment on the other 2 mentors, but my mentor (David Tuchman) was great and helped me alot. 

It felt like he was genuinely trying to help my game, and make me a better player for the future, not just to give me the best chance of winning the competition. 

Replied to emails and was often around to chat outside of team 'hours'. Really can't have any complaints, the 6 months immediately after the compeition were by far the most profitable 6 months for me in poker (including the last 2 years).

Not surprised to see him go on to bigger things in poker, commenting on the live wsop streams etc. 

Agree with beaneh that some players were better at poker than the mentors, even in Tuck's group. I'm not sure how you can get around that, unless you use some of these players to do the mentoring. 

Or aim the whole thing at players at lower stakes. 

Not sure 'total player' would be the right name for that show though. 

Hope it comes back, will look forward to watching it this time. Channel needs something new/exciting imo.