AK facing 2 all ins. Call or fold??

NColley

Well F Ivanovic is a cash player, and ofc hes gonna call when in another thread he advocates taking 55% flips early on in tourneys, not that I don't respect his opinion, but its going to be biased towards deep stacked cash poker, and well sure go ahead take that flip early on if you have no edge in the tourney..

As for borinloner, well he gets huge credit for posting tonnes of words often. Now don't get me wrong, alot of his posts are great for explaining exactly his thought processes, and he even often balances his posts by trying to put across the other side of his argument. However, theres no getting around the fact that he barely plays and definately not BH's regularly.

I'm well aware that as far as I can tell I'm in the minority who would fold here, I'm happy with my opinion and its based on relevant experience of these games. If these tourneys contained tough experienced players then I would have to push every cEV situation because I'd have no edge, but thankfully for me, these tourneys contain players that are very poor techinically, seem to never change or improve and so I can pass up small +EV spots early on because I can make chips where I'm a comfortable favourite in the hand.

Anyway, everyone plays differently, otherwise poker would be fairly boring.

Batkin88

Its good to get different opinions as you learn how others think, as stated previously this isn't a call, you should never expect to be going 3 ways with AK here and realistically this should of gone 5 ways, you will likely be running into at least one of the big hands QQ+ and then run into other aces which will reduce your outs. I don't like getting it with AK pre in the 1st 1/2 hours of a tourney anyway especially not here.

Lambert180

I still think this is almost guaranteed to be +cEV (if only marginally) but I have been swayed round to the fold, mostly by NColley. Basically it was the 'I'd rather have 4 MTTs still running with 40xBB in each than 1 MTT with a big stack' and I think that rings true even more so on Sky with the average standard of fields.

BorinLoner

Bringing respective results into the debate is silly and shouldn't happen. The premise of the clinic is to debate on the strength of our arguments. Being a winning player doesn't mean that you get everything right and being a losing player doesn't mean you get everything wrong. It doesn't support your argument to say "I'm a winning player, therefore I know better than you". If your argument can't stand up to scrutiny on it's own strengths, then it's an argument that's been defeated. If it does hold up to scrutiny, then it's a solid argument. The results of the person making any particular argument are irrelevant and don't belong here.

I'm not going to comment further on the hand.

yb

i don't play that many tournies but i'd only be folding if it was the initial limper who shoved. as is i think its unlikely that we're going to be crushed, and i think having a big stack early in tournies is quite undervalued

GELDY

Still #sigh folding myself

nothing here to change my view

rancid

I would only fold if I didn't have enough equity to call.

how much to call, how much to win and how much equity we have is the only thing we need to worry about in making the right decision.

If people opnions are that we don't have enough equity versus the two ranges then ok - fold.

When playing MTT's I would rarther have a big stack then a small one.

What about same action but we hold the nut flush draw on the flop obviously ? who is folding ?

DeucesLive

The last thing I'll say here is, if you think 40xbb at the second level is going to last in a fast paced tourney, you're wrong. Within 10-15 minutes you're looking at your stack being below the 20xbb mark unless you get busy, and given how loose BH tourneys are, you can't bluff at all. So sure, if you happen to hit a big hand you'll get paid, but we all know that doesn't happen often enough. You're probably going to have to get it in a marginal spot, 40xbb (or 30/20 within ten minutes) has almost no fold equity in a BH. 

That's why it's so beneficial in a BH particularly to have a big stack- it gives you appreciable fold equity and coverage of almost any player when a bounty is involved, without your head being at risk- which means people are less willing to call you light, giving you more room to chip up even on missed boards.