IF...................

unknown_username

yh but youre clearly a sock Edgesortin. only post is this one and no history on SKY. Wouldn't just be agitating would we?

GELDY

mr edge has clearly outplayed me in the troll stakes

67Bhoys

Welcome to Sky Poker Mr edge, nice of you to get involved in the community forum right away.

MattBates

In Response to Re: IF...................:

Good point about knowing the facts bit like a marriage break up speak to one side and it'll all seem obvious it's the others fault but it's never so simple not sure the forum should be used as the courtroom though but fully understand if someone is feeling under threat that they want some validation
Posted by GELDY

I have to agree with young Geldy here.

Never had an issue with hitman or got involved in any of the team stuff. We have always got on fine whether it be at the tables or at the bar at live events.

Whilst it must be frustrating to have accusations made about you if they are untrue I don't see any purpose in this thread. All it is doing is having pro hitman people come on here and say he is a great guy and wouldn't do it. Then others come on and say they know the truth and know what he has done. Where is that really getting anyone?

Sky need to do their investigation, this sort of thing isn't good for the sky community and there wont be any winners in this thread!

EdgeSortin

In Response to Re: IF...................:

yh but youre clearly a sock Edgesortin. only post is this one and no history on SKY. Wouldn't just be agitating would we?
Posted by luvBWFC

This isnt about me or anyone else that feels compelled to condemn the fella. Me only having made only 1 post and being new to this forums is irrelevant and seems a strange response to what was a detailed and balanced post (I even stated that i felt he was suckered into it, this is exactly what the guy himself said when admitting it so how am I aggravating it?). I am a fan of Sky Tv Poiker shows and I have always held Sky in the greatest esteem, I have watched the shows for a very liong time. I first saw this colluding story on a forum and eventually followed the trail to one that had the evidence. I am very interested as i am a strong defender of online poker and the principles it represents so any negative gamesmanship is of the upmost interest to me. This is obviously a more high profile case as the person in question who has now admitted colluding is not only a Team Captain of a well respected team but is also well connected and on "Friends" terms with a number of Sky "Faces" and TV PresentersThe person himself has been on the Sky TV Show, so of course this case is being discussed on many general poker sites. 

There is not much left to say, the guy has admitted colluding. He has created a mitigation but regardless of reason or excuse, he has admitted colluding with another member to gain either him or his associate an advantage. This goes against the fundamental principles of online poker and is one of if not the biggest taboo. He has said that he doesnt want to be unsporting but he WAS. He admits that he should haveknown better, well that is a certain fact especially given his standing on Sky and within poker and his team. He says he immediately admitted it to Sky representatives, now this may be an issue as why has no action been taken? I am sure Sky are dealing with it.

His basic defence is "Worse things have happened and it was Heat of the moment and he was suckered into it". These are fair points and i am sure Sky will take them board BUT he has broke a fundamental rule of Sky Pokers and a rule that has seen numerous people banned. Sky will have to decide on what is right but given this is such high profile case ( A captain of a key team and a known face from off the TV and its tours) then I am sure they will take the opportunity for the good of online poker as a whole and make an example of him as anything else would not bode well for their reputation or that of the industry. There are many examples where this has happened with reputable Poker Sites and the rules and outcome are quite clear.

I am sure that Sky will do the right thing.

67Bhoys

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I have to agree with young Geldy here. Never had an issue with hitman or got involved in any of the team stuff. We have always got on fine whether it be at the tables or at the bar at live events. Whilst it must be frustrating to have accusations made about you if they are untrue I don't see any purpose in this thread. All it is doing is having pro hitman people come on here and say he is a great guy and wouldn't do it. Then others come on and say they know the truth and know what he has done. Where is that really getting anyone? Sky need to do their investigation, this sort of thing isn't good for the sky community and there wont be any winners in this thread!
Posted by MattBates

Hit the nail right on the head.

EdgeSortin

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I have to agree with young Geldy here. Never had an issue with hitman or got involved in any of the team stuff. We have always got on fine whether it be at the tables or at the bar at live events. Whilst it must be frustrating to have accusations made about you if they are untrue I don't see any purpose in this thread. All it is doing is having pro hitman people come on here and say he is a great guy and wouldn't do it. Then others come on and say they know the truth and know what he has done. Where is that really getting anyone? Sky need to do their investigation, this sort of thing isn't good for the sky community and there wont be any winners in this thread!
Posted by MattBates

And him taking the time to come on and admit that he collude was a nice gesture and will save them a lot of time and effort. It couldn't have been easy for him to admit to openly breaking the rules regardless of his mitigation however I guess when confronted with screenshots of you doing it he didn't have much choice.

It's no ones business now but Sky who will of course being dealing with it and deciding on the correct punishment. A quick and fair outcome will protect the image of Sky and Online Poker as a whole and regardless of if you like the guy or not, that's what's important here.

unknown_username

I wish I had your dedication!

I joined 4 years ago, and you have been an inspiration throughout all that time!

The names supporting you on this thread are like a who's who? of Sky Poker.

there will always be Plonkers!

Don't let them get to you!

You've earned our respect!!!

The plonkers have nothing but our contempt!!!

tsarina

I am not getting involved in this one.  I believe mattbates to be correct in his analysis that no good will come of this thread.  It is indeed unfortunate that the thread was started in the first place.  There may be one or two fellow players as old as I am who will recall the former Jonathan Aitken stating he would fight with the sword of truth shortly before he got convicted of dishonesty offences and got sent to spend some time at Her Majesty's pleasure.  #justsaying

VespaPX

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : Having just seen screen shots of the alleged colluding on a FB group called SKY POKER TOURNAMENTS I fully agree with the above comment of Mrsduck. Be wary of judging someone regardless of the good they have done in the past as people are A: Not always what/who they seem and B: Can change. With my own eyes I have seen evidence of colluding and this comes in the form of damming screenshots taken during the DTD tournament. I read also that these have been sent to Sky and reported however should it be allowed I am happy to post them here but I am sure that Sky would prefer to deal with this in house. What is posted there and clearly documented breaches the following rules: 15.3 Collusion between you and any of our other customers, as determined at our sole discretion, by sharing “hole” cards or by any other methods is strictly forbidden. To detect collusion, we use sophisticated software to analyse hands, game play history and suspicious activities. Our system monitors card history, betting patterns, player history and gameplay, including all bets, for all customers, up to and including the last round of betting where applicable. We also look at various other sources of information as part of our anti-collusion checks. We reserve the right, in addition to other measures, to restrict seating and/or to prohibit customers from playing at a particular poker table or in a tournament, including restricting two or more customers from playing together at the same table or in the same tournament and you agree to cooperate fully with us in respect of such measures and to investigate any such activity. The use of 3rd party software (Messaging Services) were used to assist a member to collude with another in order to gain an unfair advantage over other members. As the posts are time stamped and the members identitys are known it is now very east for Sky Poker to use their "sophisticated software to analyse hands, game play history and suspicious activities" to confirm the hands discussed and to confirm that the relevant members acted accordingly and colluded. Having seen the evidence that is available and now out in the public domain I assume that Sky will take this very seriously and act accordingly.   I am sure that everyone will agree that at no point should a members previous good character, positive actions and friendships within a company give him an advantage over the rules AND their disciplinary process. People make mistakes and this seems that it may be a case that someone may have been stupidly and naively suckered into giving and receiving hand info but they still colluded, they will forever been known within poker as a colluder and the evidence of that collusion will be there forever. They can make excuses now and say that they told people after the fact but during the conversations and more importantly during the game, that person gave away hands, accepted hand information and crucially they acted upon it and commented that they done so...... They colluded. Online Poker is struggling already with allegations so when one comes to light with evidence like this has we are left in the hands of the authorities (or Sky in this case) to do what is right not only for its members but also for the reputation of poker as a whole.
Posted by EdgeSortin

I'm sure Sky know their own rules without having to copy & paste them on the forum.
As a newbie you sure seem to know your way round on here !

MAXALLY

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I'm sure Sky know their own rules without having to copy & paste them on the forum. As a newbie you sure seem to know your way round on here !
Posted by VespaPX

+1

...or maybe...just maybe, a banned member with an axe to grind?.

From the forum guidelines...(as rules and regs are being quoted on here now)

Duplicate Accounts

Duplicate accounts are serious offences which go against Sky Poker’s terms and conditions. Any posts which are suspected to come from a duplicate account will be dealt with by the Moderators, with steps to close down any accounts concerned more than likely.

I am sure Sky Poker/Moderators will be able to deal with this.

bigal36903

amazing, he admits CHEATING, yet you all defend him.

you are blinded, BEING CAUGHT ONCE, HOW MANY MORE TIMES HAS HE CHEATED?

is THS going to be tarred with the collusion brush ?

EdgeSortin

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : +1 ...or maybe...just maybe, a banned member with an axe to grind?. From the forum guidelines...(as rules and regs are being quoted on here now) Duplicate Accounts Duplicate accounts are serious offences which go against Sky Poker’s terms and conditions. Any posts which are suspected to come from a duplicate account will be dealt with by the Moderators, with steps to close down any accounts concerned more than likely. I am sure Sky Poker/Moderators will be able to deal with this.
Posted by MAXALLY

I am not a "newbie" to Sky, I have been a fan of the TV channel for many years and have read this forum on a daily basis as I do with many other poker forums. You may be surprised to hear that there are people who watch the shows and read the forum that do not participate in the site. I take offence to any accusations and I find it very insulting, is this the normal way to treat new contributors when they join. I have never had an account on Sky before today and Sky and moderators are free to check my IP, pc data or make any other ID or security checks they deem necessary. 

It seems a hypocritical way of deflecting from the OP's admittance of collusion but be assured that I am only hear as an interesting fan of Sky Shows and online poker itself. 

VespaPX

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I am not a "newbie" to Sky, I have been a fan of the TV channel for many years and have read this forum on a daily basis as I do with many other poker forums. You may be surprised to hear that there are people who watch the shows and read the forum that do not participate in the site. I take offence to any accusations and I find it very insulting, is this the normal way to treat new contributors when they join. I have never had an account on Sky before today and Sky and moderators are free to check my IP, pc data or make any other ID or security checks they deem necessary.  It seems a hypocritical way of deflecting from the OP's admittance of collusion but be assured that I am only hear as an interesting fan of Sky Shows and online poker itself. 
Posted by EdgeSortin

Enlighten us please as to why, if you have been reading the forum on a daily basis, that this thread happens to be your first postings?
Nothing else over the years interested you on here?

Oh and you do know 861 is no longer broadcasting right?

Phantom66

MODS?

Whatever the truth of accusations - I am not on any fb sky poker forum so I cannot view the evidence for myself. Even if I could it wouldn't be up to me to judge, that can only be done by the Sky Poker team. 

These threads in poker chat do no-one any favours, and they certainly dont promote teams in a good light.

Suggest this is closed please?

F_Ivanovic

Nice poem. Why did you choose to name the poem "If"?

Slykllist

In Response to Re: IF...................:

Nice poem. Why did you choose to name the poem "If"?
Posted by F_Ivanovic

I think that had a lot more to do with Rudyard Kipling!

DOHHHHHHH

In Response to Re: IF...................:

Nice poem. Why did you choose to name the poem "If"?
Posted by F_Ivanovic

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I think that had a lot more to do with Rudyard Kipling!
Posted by Slykllist

Thread saved!

lucy4

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : I think that had a lot more to do with Rudyard Kipling!
Posted by Slykllist

He did write exceedingly good poems...

DOHHHHHHH

Ugh, think I've just pwnd myself by falling into the Ivan trap, in which case I just saved the thread myself.

wpwp

EdgeSortin

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : Enlighten us please as to why, if you have been reading the forum on a daily basis, that this thread happens to be your first postings? Nothing else over the years interested you on here? Oh and you do know 861 is no longer broadcasting right?
Posted by VespaPX

Yes, do know that the channel ended.

I don't see why I should justify my choice to read a forum and not post but let me assist your somewhat strange request.

I love this forum but mainly because of the clinic. I read many forums, on this forum in particular I enjoy the clinic and I feel that as a section it is under represented as it is a valuable asset for the Sky Brand. many poker players have groups and set discussions in which they share hands however the clinic is open forum and not only that it is well respected and supported. As a newbie to poker the back catalogue of answers and advice in that section would give you the knowledge to hold your own at a fairly good level and having an impartial area of a forum to place hand requests with the knowledge that you will get an answer from players with advanced level of skill. There are other areas of poker forums like that but many seem biased, unused or clicky where the clinic is friendly, open and offers sound advice.

Your question about why I decided to post now is quite frankly none of your business but again let me help you;

I am a firm supporter of online poker. I have for years supported operators and sites in the face of heinous allegations. As we know there has been numerous confirmed cases of fraud and deception on the part of sites and members alike but in whole the industry self corrects and manages rule breaking. We have seen some huge offences that have rocked the foundations and we have seen them dealt with in a correct manner and this goes from the top to the bottom, from one man who is trying to collude a few hands to a WSOP bracelet winner trying to fraudulently obtain millions. Its big business and gets people and companies into big trouble. I have a real interest in this and am proud in the way that the industry try's to regulate itself by managing these issues firmly because this is the only way to uphold pokers reputation and we have come a long way. This is why I commented on this, because I have a keen interest in the reputation of our industry and I support it at all times.

So when I see a name I have seen not only on the forum but on the tv channel being linked to colluding it gets my attention and when I see the evidence and then him bravely admitting it on here I feel like commenting because MrsDuck was very true in that you shouldn't back a horse until you have read the form and ironically within a couple of hours the guy in question admitted it so as I said that saved Sky a lot of hassle and validated the "wait for the facts" reason that I posted.

I understand that this is an emotive issue for many, the guy is very well respected and is the captain of a huge team that seems to underpin the whole Sky Community so I get the defending of him even after he has admitted it and I get people condemning him, both are entitled to their opinion and as has been said before, Sky have left not only my post sup but also the thread so they are happy for it to be debated even after he has admitted it so we are all free to offer our opinion.

As I have said previously, Sky and only will decide what cause of action to take with the offender.

bbMike

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : Enlighten us please as to why, if you have been reading the forum on a daily basis, that this thread happens to be your first postings? Nothing else over the years interested you on here? Oh and you do know 861 is no longer broadcasting right?
Posted by VespaPX

There was a thread not that long ago where a reg highlighted collusion during the 6max promo, later proven, surprised our friend's interest wasn't piqued at that one. Sad though it seems, these things/images doing the rounds are being propagated by a team captain who used to play DTD as a THS member. I don't care to guess at the objective, but a new player joins a team opens a cookie jar to multiple players waiting for one to put their hand in. Leaves the team saying there isn't enough help or encouragement for new players and he's off to buddy up with Outlaws who are undoubtedly more of a laugh. He doesn't stay long, but long enough to go and paste the excerpts that fit his/their agenda. Whatever this is about I hope those involved consider it to have been worth their while.

67Bhoys

In Response to Re: IF...................:

In Response to Re: IF................... : Yes, do know that the channel ended. I don't see why I should justify my choice to read a forum and not post but let me assist your somewhat strange request. I love this forum but mainly because of the clinic. I read many forums, on this forum in particular I enjoy the clinic and I feel that as a section it is under represented as it is a valuable asset for the Sky Brand. many poker players have groups and set discussions in which they share hands however the clinic is open forum and not only that it is well respected and supported. As a newbie to poker the back catalogue of answers and advice in that section would give you the knowledge to hold your own at a fairly good level and having an impartial area of a forum to place hand requests with the knowledge that you will get an answer from players with advanced level of skill. There are other areas of poker forums like that but many seem biased, unused or clicky where the clinic is friendly, open and offers sound advice. Your question about why I decided to post now is quite frankly none of your business but again let me help you; I am a firm supporter of online poker. I have for years supported operators and sites in the face of heinous allegations. As we know there has been numerous confirmed cases of fraud and deception on the part of sites and members alike but in whole the industry self corrects and manages rule breaking. We have seen some huge offences that have rocked the foundations and we have seen them dealt with in a correct manner and this goes from the top to the bottom, from one man who is trying to collude a few hands to a WSOP bracelet winner trying to fraudulently obtain millions. Its big business and gets people and companies into big trouble. I have a real interest in this and am proud in the way that the industry try's to regulate itself by managing these issues firmly because this is the only way to uphold pokers reputation and we have come a long way. This is why I commented on this, because I have a keen interest in the reputation of our industry and I support it at all times. So when I see a name I have seen not only on the forum but on the tv channel being linked to colluding it gets my attention and when I see the evidence and then him bravely admitting it on here I feel like commenting because MrsDuck was very true in that you shouldn't back a horse until you have read the form and ironically within a couple of hours the guy in question admitted it so as I said that saved Sky a lot of hassle and validated the "wait for the facts" reason that I posted. I understand that this is an emotive issue for many, the guy is very well respected and is the captain of a huge team that seems to underpin the whole Sky Community so I get the defending of him even after he has admitted it and I get people condemning him, both are entitled to their opinion and as has been said before, Sky have left not only my post sup but also the thread so they are happy for it to be debated even after he has admitted it so we are all free to offer our opinion. As I have said previously, Sky and only will decide what cause of action to take with the offender.
Posted by EdgeSortin

Ever thought of writing a Novel Edge? at the rate your posting now, it would be done in no time.  I've even got a title for you...

The Forum, a life on the Edge

By the way, you seem to be fixated on the offender.  Does the alleged offence not have to have more than one offender, or was the offender allegedly colluding with himself?

TommyD

Enough

Closing the thread.  Going to take me a little while to pick through all the of passive aggressive hinted accusations, double talk and one eyed reasoning.  At this time I don't know all of the facts so I have no idea what rules were broken, who broken them or if indeed anything as been.  I have however been sent several interesting screenshots from now deleted posts here and other places of social media.  I will be packaging them all up and sending them as a bundle to the appropriate people.

If anyone wants further explanations as to why I have closed this thread, feel free to PM me.

If anyone has concerns about possible collusion, bullying on the forum, cheating and/or misrepresentation, feel free to contact SkyPoker customer care.  If you want to talk about any of these issue before this, please feel free to PM me.

I will now be closing this thread, if I see any new ones along these lines turn up, I reserve the right to delete them without warning or explanation.

Thank you.