You need to be logged in to your Sky Poker account above to post discussions and comments.
You might need to refresh your page afterwards.
Sky Poker forums will be temporarily unavailable from 11pm Wednesday July 25th.
Sky Poker Forums is upgrading its look! Stay tuned for the big reveal!
MENTORS, TUITION, POKER LESSONS
Hi all (TK)
Serious question now !!! ;0)
I have been playing for a few years and feel i am a half decent player not the best and not the worst in the world !!!
I win the odd tournament i enter and finish respectable positions (live and online ) but i look around and see many people that just take it to the next level and are nearly always right up there until the death knocking on the cashing door !! for example on sky poker GLITTER BABE , PENGUIN7 , NUTTER5632, DYLAN12 , To name but a few the list is much longer and you all know who you are ( keep it up ) .
So credit where credit is due to them all, But how can i take my game to the next level As my poker was self taught i may have a big thorn in my game and not even know it ? or i could be doing something wrong that is standard play to these " next level players" as i have said i can hold my own but want that next step to break away from the middle of the pack players and start challenging the cash spots on a regular basis,
Is there anywhere i can have tutoring or lessons (dosen't have to be from sky poker players but any1 anywhere in uk ) from the more established players in order to raise my game another notch as i really want to try and progress a bit more but feel i am hitting a rock with my play/style some times!!!
Many thanks in advance !!!!
Monkey 123
( any1 need a new project ill b the hamster )
Comments
MY BAD
Iam really hoping it finds the right eyes mate !!!
Have you tried training sites with instructional videos? Cardrunners is the best know and widley beleived to be the best training site out there. This is actually affiliated with top pros and goes way beyond introduction onto advanced strategy etc.
Just A Thought !!
Thanks for all your replies guys
I have read some books and i also have dvds !!! but really think some 1 on 1 tuition is the way forward for me IMO but i will have a look at the sites you have suggested , Monthly fees or not i really want to be a serious student and take my game higher so i would see fees as a investment for the future.
monkey123
I sense from the tone & content that you want a serious reply to this, so I'll spend a little time on it & try to answer it comprehensively, & I'll break it up into a series of Posts. (Long forum Posts are bad, as attentiion spans on poker forums are tuned into short, sharp, Posts).
Before doing so, it's important to understand that each of us would benefit from mentoring, but we all have different levels of requirement. You are a profitable player, so need, perhaps "medium level" mentoring, to take you to the next level, our TP-ers are "high-level, advanced" players, so they need a higher level of mentoring. But the great majority of players - I'd say over 90% of them - who play at the lower limits, only need Mentoring at that Level, & they are by far the easiest to help improve, as they just lack the fundamentals. Bear this paragraph in mind later, as I'll return to it.
Let's start with the so-called "Poker Schools" or "Poker Academies", & as ACESOVER commented, I have a particular view on them.
There are two high-profile Mentoring organisations operating in the UK right now, & they charge (varies) around £300 to £350 for a single days mentoring. It's not 1 to 1, there would be, typically, 2 or 3 Mentors present, & 30 or 40 paying customers. These companies are commercial entities, & exist not to teach, but to make money, which is fine & dandy.
Both organisations have attracted much negative comment from the poker world, who feel that the Mentors are not up to teaching. This, actually, is wrong, & unfair. A good player does not necessarily make a good mentor, but a technically correct player CAN make a good Mentor. It's not about the Mentors playing ability, it's about their people skills, & ability to communicate & teach. So just because some of the Mentors have dubious claims to being a top player, does not mean they are bad teachers of the game.
However, personally - personally - I would not touch them with a bargepole, because from what I have seen - & for reasons I won't bore you with, I have examined them closely - they are disingenous not to say dishonest in the way they advertise their product.
One of them advertised the name of a handful of Pros poker players who were labelled as their regular contracted Mentors, & even included their photograph on their Website. I know for certain - 100% certain, as a stated fact - that two of those Pros, both close friends of mine, 1 an EPT winner, another a WSOP Bracelet winner, were never, ever, inviolved with the organisation. They were approached, they said "no thank you", but they were promoted as being on board.
So, for those reasons, I would not go near them. If we plan to spnd £300+ per day on mentoring, we need to trust the organisations. Would you trust a Company that pulled stunts like that? And, imo, for £300 a day, personally, I want 1 to 1 Mentoring, not being in a class of 30 or 40.
Hopefully, in due course, some commercial Mentoring organisations with better ethics will emerge, & if they do, & are sensibly priced, then I'd say they are worth looking at.
Cardrunners training videos.
I have never used these, but I've yet to hear a single bad report about them. I've seen a few of them, & they seem to be high quality stuff. It's medium to high level stuff, & not suitable for "entry level" players.
I interviewed all the Cardrunners founders in Vegas lthe year before last & they seemed decent guys, with integrity.
It's not exactly 1-1 mentoring, but even high level pros - guys like, for example, Julian Thew - commend them highly.
Look around the internet, & various websites offer Cardrunners stuff for free.
Really, I've never heard a bad word about Cardrunners.
Thanks for the heads up on that mate i will stay well clear of that option then !!!!
ps thanks for taking the time to help me out on this matter
monkey123
Books.
Books help a lot of players, but personally, I fail to see how books can really get the job done. We are all different, we have differing needs & weaknesses, & the books offer generic advice.
If you want to go the book route, well Super System seems the one with credibility.
I'm probably wrong to diss books for poker education, & I readily acknowledge that. I just feel, fundamentally, that if we all, for example, followed the same advice, if, say, every poker player on earth read Super System, what advantage would that confer on any one player?
It's a bit like the horse racing tipster who "sells" tips. Why would he do that?
I'm very left-field with this advice though, so you'll have to make your own mind up on books.
Strategy Boards on Poker Forums.
If you can weed out the dross, of which there is plenty on EVERY poker forum, these can be excellent.
Ask good questions, take some care to set the Post out nice & neatly, so you "present it" well, be humble, & say "can you help me please, I have a problem?" People like to be asked to help, & you'll get flooded with replies, which you can then sift through & accept or reject the advice as you see fit.
On some fora, you'll get a sprinkling of smart-a**e replies, just ignore them, don't rise to the bait. When you ask a serious question, & some spotty cretin replies "is this a Level, or are you stupid", it's not exctly helpful, but you'll make money & enjoy your poker, whilst Mr Spotty Spiteful spends his time dissing others.
I won't name other UK poker forums, that's a bit awkward & close to home for me, as many know, but a place called 2 + 2, an American poker forum, is the grand-daddy of all poker forums.
What I would recommend is directly appealing to the better player on any Site. In the case of Sky Poker, what I'd suggest is stick up a Thread asking a sensible question. Make the Thread Title snappy - NEVER use long thread titles, it turns would-be readers off - & set the question out concisely, & explain the context. If, for example, you want a view on a hand you played, ALWAYS include all the pertinent facts. What were the Blinds, how many chips you have, what is the average stack, what stage of the Tourney, how many left, how many paid, what is the table dynamic (aggro, passive), history on the Villain, de de da.
THEN drop a PM to, say, a few of the better players on Sky Poker, & say "guys, do you mind taking a look at this, please?". Despite what the dissers say, there are some VERY good players on Sky Poker, & if you asked, for example, almost any of the Final 18 on Total Player for advice, I can't imagine any would be anything but helpful.
The beauty of this is that it's free. Why pay £300 a day to be part of a group of 30, when you are getting that for free?
As for books though, you are already at a decent standard and have your own style of play. You would not have to read super system and completely revamp your game. You could take little snippets of info that you like and try to incorporate them into your own unique style of play.
I have done the very same thing, i have read say 15 books on poker strategy, and i try to take the best piece of advice or strategy to form my own game and unique style.
Some things you read in poker books you will instantly disagree with, or it may just be that you dont want to play poker that way. But on many occasions when i have read things, something clicks in the back of your mind and you think "wow, i would of never thought of doing that!" or " i think that is a leak in my game as i do the complete opposite in that spot, and by reading this i was wrong"
If you do read poker books, read a vast aray, and get an overall picture of how good players view the game and see what bits you can incorporate into your game. But as tikay says, dont become a robot and copy someone elses style, as many players do this and become very predictable.
BY far the thing that has most improved my game is poker forums! After around a week of just reading posts on strategy, it will stick out like a sore thumb who knows what they are talking about, and who's advice you want.
I would advise you, that when you are in a tournament or a hand comes up and you have found it tricky or it was a wierd spot and u are unsure, post the hand history up in the forum. You will get good honest feedback on your play from numerous players. Even if everyone slates your play, at least you may have identified a weak point in your game that you can work on.
Before, i would log on and play poker say for 3 hours straight and log off. Now i may play for 2 and a half hours, and spend the other 30 mins on the forums commenting on oother peoples hands and posting my own. Its good to continuously analyse your game, and you can only improve from other peoples advice.
I hope i this helps mate, if you get any hands that were tricky post them up, or pm me it and ill happily give you my point of view.
Thanks again guys !
Dantb10 thanks so much for your time also to reply to my post, It means a lot as you are 1 of my "next level players" i am talking about (keep it going) i would of liked to have talked to you at Luton but never had the chance my good friend HITMAN_RV had the honour tho !!!! I think i will try for Swansea if you are there i will say hi then !! thanks for the PM option i will be taking you up on that .
Thanks Again to every 1 that has posted a reply
monkey123
in the last few months.thanks
Bear with me, I'll Post later today on that subject.
Or there is a brilliant poker pro on youtube search gder01. I cannot tell you how much $ I have won after watching his videos and following his advice.
First of all never pay for lessons from anyone without seeing how good they are, and I dont mean they won a couple of donkaments. I mean by crushing the level above you want to be taught at every day. You see this by cold hard cash, ask to see their account, bank statement etc etc.
Lessons wont be cheap, if anyone is any good at poker they dont need the money.
I have taught family and friends to play some didnt have the work ethic and packed it in after a week or so, but a few really worked at it. The two people who really worked at it now crush 100nl for thousands a year. One never played the game before and the other was a poker enthusiast who was a losing online player, before I helped them.
I also have regs from 100 NL and 50NL pm me for help, I like talking poker so I help them and I am sure other regs will help. However if anyone is serious about making £££ I would be happy to mentor/ give lessons if they make it worth my while. PM if anyone interested.
Some great info from Tikay & Dan as usual, & thanks to all for helping mi mate.
Like you Jock, I shall be following this one closely
WD all!!
p.s. How do i book some private poker lessons with Kitty Lea?
Just seen this post after coming in fron work.
Tikay has gone into various methods available to you with regards to paying for tuition, books etc.
For me personally, I have only ever read one book and that is Gus Hansen's book which details every hand he played when he won the Aussie Millions - great book and a worthwhile read!! I have many friends who read various books day in and day out - but for me - books don't work - I have tried but I don't feel they improve me at all - that is just me, for others it may work.
With regards to mentoring, I am the same as Dantb10 - I feel by posting hands on the forum you learn, and I am more than willing to chat with you on MSN or even in a PM with regards to any hands, situations etc you would like to discuss privatley, and that goes for anyone else as well - just send me a pm.
I like to discuss hands with others and have done with Dan mostly, sometimes it is just nice to be reassured that you played the hand correctly or even get a different view on a hand from an independant.
If you want a hand m8 - just holla!!
Dylan
The Hitman
And TWO of the major things i have taken in from this post ?
THE FORUM IS A POWERFUL TOOL
AND I HAVE FRIENDS I DIDNT KNOW ABOUT THAT WILL DO ANYTHING TO HELP
MONKEY123
I am going to try my luck with the bounty hunter tonight so if you see me or play against me and you see anything i have done right or wrong please let me know !!!
GOOD LUCK PEEPS
Monkey123
I think the 1st call was a value call hoping for the set on the flop and also a chance to take a head (chance to get out if the cards are high on the flop too) but before i know it i am calling an all in ???? my logic coin flip against some 1 protecting the small stack for heads up against them with ak aq aj ect or even small pair !!! how WRONG was i ???