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would you find it as fun if you ALWAYS had losing sessions tho TK? I would imagine that a losing session is a rare occurance for you. whemever you play online you always seem to cash in a tournie or 2 that covers your BIs for the others that you busted out from. plus you get more than occasional binks for decent sums....thats not even factoring your Luton 'going to see the great railways of the world' fund.....
but yeah i think a lot of people on here take poker far too seriously. we sometimes forget that to most people its a hobby where they don't mind losing Xamount per week....as opposed to going down the pub for a night they can ahve fun for 3/4 hours AND actually have a chance of banking a profit. one of my friends is totally hopeless. barely knows the rules. but he once won a donkie at Luton for like 300 quid and it made his month.
No I just thought it was classless and a clear indication of the reasons why he is banned from here for life.
the play is "creative" down here in the nl4 trenches
"unfortunately" for me, given my bankroll, this is where i have had to start learning to play just over a year ago.
it has taken a while because - i didn't play that often in the early days;it was more recreational then before i took it more "seriously" but i have learnt and now have recovered all my earlier losses and reloads.
so you can learn here but, like me, from scratch which you pod are obviously not.
the aim is to move up once the bankroll permits to see how much i have learnt or how many "bad" habits i've got.
posting hands in the clinic, or just reading the posts, has been a good learning tool. people are always willing to advise even if you don't agree with it. as you say those moves that are respected at larger levels sometimes aren't at nl4 usually because people don't know them as such. alot of people are recreational players or just pure gamblers imo. they play how they want as they are entitled to do. it just gives you more wilder swings (as a % of bankroll for me) which you have to take on the chin and move on.
i know you didn't say so pod, but for others to say we are all bad down here is a bit insulting. it assumes we are here because this is the best we can do rather than that some are relatively new to the game and need to start somewhere and this is the cheapest way to learn basics or for other reasons.
good luck at which ever level you decide to play
The things you say to some of the lesser skilled players on the tables are disgusting and just totally childish tbh, you don't have a right to call anyone classless.
FWIW 4nl players are terrible in terms of the average person's thought process. But, that is where you get a lot of beginners and so it is not surprising.
If you can't come up with a strategy to beat loose/passive, tight/passive players, then it is merely a flaw in your ability. So either you are not as good as you think you are or the 4nl players are better than you when playing you.
Each level is different and it is a test of skill to see if you can adapt and learn to beat the different levels.
Those guys saying the beats are worse in lower levels should just adjust thier range and not get in as many marginal positions etc, hey presto, the beats dont occur so frequently.
Just because you cant 4 bet light and run a three barrel bluff at 4nl does not mean its rubbish, it means you have to play different.
If you cant adadpt your game to the situation is that not a flaw in your own game?
yet if a player on 50p/£1 calls with52s and wins a big pot (£50) on the mastercash show he is a "genius" or "thinking outside the box"
poker snobbery ftw.......
Who do u think you would fare better against?
I think that is the point being made why its difficult to beat NL4
Some great Posts on here, most of which I strongly agree, or disagree, weith.
Apart from "BelovedLtd", (aka Razz specialist Mr Jon MW, who said "why play the game if it upsets you that much when you don't win), Walesy summed it up best for me. He said.....
".....i know you didn't say so pod, but for others to say we are all bad down here is a bit insulting....."
Which is nail, & head.
It's almost certainly an age-thing, but it sits so badly to me to see such bad manners, calling other players insulting names. And just because someone does not play poker so well, does not make them an idiot. I've player poker with many a genius, at least one of whom was Knighted for his genius, & they can't play poker too good, but that does not make them a donk.
I played Golf for a goodly while, too, & that was very much a "manners maketh man" game, & if you called a 28 handicapper an idiot, you'd be thrown out of the Club pdq. Quite right too.
Ugh ugh ugh.
I’m not going to say much that hasn’t already be said, but I think this takes thread back to the op. You want to make the move to cash. Now judging by past posts, not including this thread, I’m guessing that your a decent player that knows his way around the felt. That said and with the availability of a decent bank roll, I don’t think you should be hanging around the 4nl arena.
That is not to criticise the level, but you want to take your poker to the next level. This whole argument about starting at the bottom, with your ability seems a bit lost on me.
This debate takes me back to when Both Rich Orford and Ed Giddins (I think), hosted a show with that out spoken nutter they call John McCririck.There was a debate regarding women not improving their game because they play in women only tournaments, therefore not learning the aggressive side of the game. Although I totally dislike this guy and am horrified to admit this, there was some sense to the point he was trying to make. Giddins also made a comment a long the lines that, if you play golf with better players your game can only improve.
As mentioned previously, It can be boring playing ABC, at 4nl, simply because of the value which does lead to the type of holdings being played that are less likely to be played at higher levels or as often at least. Although in principle the value of a raise of 4x 6x 8x bb should be the same at what ever level we play, it’s not and can affect the way you adapt to the level, as well as already mentioned affecting your own opening range, which will be much wider at the lower tables. So are you learning anything or just picking up habits that would hinder your game at a higher level.There’s a lot of good advise on this thread, so what ever level you find the most suitable, I wish you well.
Mac