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Studying poker actually makes you worse.....discuss

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  • edited February 2011

    One more thing.....

    A bankroll is for winning players, a budget is what learning/losing players require.

    Not inferring you are a losing player maggiesdad just pointing this out here, BRM gets mentioned on nearly every show but no one states you must be a winning player for it to be relevant.

    Got that one off my chest.

  • edited February 2011

    I think everybody has their own style and reading books can be dangerous as you try to adapt your natural game to incorporate bits you have taken from reading a book.

    Although I think the better players would benefit from more studying of the game as they will have enough natural ability and skill to take on the parts which will benefit their game.

    Understanding what you are doing is the most importanat thing, not thinking "ah, in the book it said I should bet x amount in this situation" you need to know why you are making a certaine move and not just because you read it somewhere..

    So to sum up, studying = good for the better players
                        studying = dangerous/bad for the less gifted players
  • edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Studying poker actually makes you worse.....discuss:
    One more thing..... A bankroll is for winning players, a budget is what learning/losing players require. Not inferring you are a losing player maggiesdad just pointing this out here, BRM gets mentioned on nearly every show but no one states you must be a winning player for it to be relevant. Got that one off my chest.
    Posted by stien
    Hi Stien.......thank you for your responses. No offence taken. I think that I have clarified my own thinking as stated in my other post. I now think I know why instinctive is best for me. I am a reasonably intelligent fella, nothing fantastic but I can walk and chew gum at the same time. However, maybe my poker intelligence is never going to be good enough to take on board the fair and reasonable advice that books/forum's/video's provide.
  • edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Studying poker actually makes you worse.....discuss:
    I think everybody has their own style and reading books can be dangerous as you try to adapt your natural game to incorporate bits you have taken from reading a book. Although I think the better players would benefit from more studying of the game as they will have enough natural ability and skill to take on the parts which will benefit their game. Understanding what you are doing is the most importanat thing, not thinking "ah, in the book it said I should bet x amount in this situation" you need to know why you are making a certaine move and not just because you read it somewhere.. So to sum up, studying = good for the better players                     studying = dangerous/bad for the less gifted players
    Posted by cookie83
    This is nonsense
  • edited February 2011
    Don't confuse instinct with sub-conscious learned behaviour. Do you really think people can be born to instinctively play poker correctly?

    You have learned the correct thing to do through experience. i.e you have tried a way of playing and gained the positive reinforcement of it winning you money, which caused you to repeat it. loosing plays visa versa.

    If you don't read strategy, you won't try any alternative methods as often, and therefore cannot gain the positive reinforcement which would cause you to 'learn' and adopt the methods which are better. Thus improvement of your game would be slowed or halted.
  • edited February 2011
    As a further point:

    Reading strategy does not necessarily mean you have to adopt that strategy, but it does increase your knowledge about how people play the game, which is equally important to a successful player.

    or some i'm told :)
  • edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Studying poker actually makes you worse.....discuss:
    if your just playing for fun and your not bothered about loosing some money winning some money then dont study poker. If you are playing to make a real hardcore profit or playing as a job i would study poker due to then you would make more money in the long run.
    Posted by JIMMYMAD
    Agree 100%  I tried reading a couple of books coz i felt that was the thing to do just coz i was playing more every week. However, it felt like studying (hard work ) and i started to lose the enjoyment factor. Packed up the reading and just play for the fun but i also agree with the other post, simply by playing i learn something nearly every game.
       Should also point out that just visiting the forum a couple of times a week is an education.
     and listening to the presenters and guests shouldn't be undervalued.
            Thought provoking question !  
                     Hope you have fun at the tables whatever   
  • edited February 2011
    Thank you to everone who contributed. I would have liked to get a few more opinions but it seems to have run it's natural length.
  • edited February 2011


      HI Mike, very interesting thread. IMO the problem with reading books can sometimes be the conflicting advice given by players with different styles. For example, Harringtons books are , to a degree, all about survival wheras Eric Lindgre is about playing with a very aggressive style. I dont think tha treading books makes you a worse player, what someone reading a book needs to do is to use advice that suits your own playing style. It is very difficult to change the way you instintively play and have immediate effect.
      And i fully agree with your statement regarding bankroll and being able to comfortably afford to lose a couple of buy ins.
  • edited February 2011
    What a brilliant thread, I really enjoyed reading everybodies comments.
    I have heard other players say the same "Reading books have made my poker worse".
    I do not believe this, you can only gain knowledge by reading books, playing the game for years and having a bit of luck.
    I personally was more fortunate as a beginner(beginners luck they say).
    But having played a lot of poker and read a lot of books , my game has improved tremendously, what lets me down is not having enough patience and discipline and my game starts to go to pot when I get bored.
  • edited February 2011
    What I would say is the main bit of knowledge you need, is to know the level of knowledge of your opponent. (if that makes sense).

    There is no point getting into "I know that you know that i know...." mindeset vs someone who hasn't a great deal of knowledge of the game or some1 who is sat with 10 big blinds on a cash table.

    Knowing the odds etc etc is only worth while when playing other regular grinders who understand bet sizing and what ever weird and funky moves you want to you. Some players I will snap call an all in with AJ where as some players I wouldn't get my money in pre with AK / QQ
  • edited February 2011
    Im quite a successful player on Sky in MTTs & i have never ever read a book on poker in my life. The easiest way i found to learn was from my own mistakes & studying the table very carefully & picking up info from other players.

    You obviosly need to know the basic maths side of the game, BUT once you have been playing a few months this becomes 2nd nature & once you know the odds of certain situations happening you are half way there. (eg the x4, x2 turn & river being a good example).
    .
    At the end of the day i think most people develop there certain style of play within the 1st few months of learning the game & that will be very hard to change by just reading books. In my opinion i think personality comes into it a some point, if your not naturally aggressive you wont win.

    I also think you need to be level headed at all times & understand the game for what it is, you will have alot of bad times & bad beats, but to be successful you need to know that variance plays a massive part - the problem is NO book can teach you this, hence why most people go on tilt & start making very bad plays.

    Bankroll management is the key to success, as stated in alot of posts in this thread, if you start playing outside your BR it will only lead to one thing which is 'Going on tilt' cos the losses hurt you very hard & before you know it you start playing terrible chasing your cash. (Every poker player has done this at one time or another)

    Ryan
  • edited February 2011
    Response to Re: Studying poker actually makes you worse.....discuss:
    Im quite a successful player on Sky in MTTs & i have never ever read a book on poker in my life. The easiest way i found to learn was from my own mistakes & studying the table very carefully & picking up info from other players. You obviosly need to know the basic maths side of the game, BUT once you have been playing a few months this becomes 2nd nature & once you know the odds of certain situations happening you are half way there. (eg the x4, x2 turn & river being a good example). . At the end of the day i think most people develop there certain style of play within the 1st few months of learning the game & that will be very hard to change by just reading books. In my opinion i think personality comes into it a some point, if your not naturally aggressive you wont win. I also think you need to be level headed at all times & understand the game for what it is, you will have alot of bad times & bad beats, but to be successful you need to know that variance plays a massive part - the problem is NO book can teach you this, hence why most people go on tilt & start making very bad plays. Bankroll management is the key to success, as stated in alot of posts in this thread, if you start playing outside your BR it will only lead to one thing which is 'Going on tilt' cos the losses hurt you very hard & before you know it you start playing terrible chasing your cash. (Every poker player has done this at one time or another) Ryan

    Posted by goodylad21
    Hi Ryan
    Nice post......used to think you were a bit of a plank....but I may have been a bit hasty! (no offence)
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