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Tough spot. Call or fold?

Seagull158Seagull158
edited February 2011 in The Poker Clinic
This was the 33rd hand since I sat down. Villain had won several hands without showdown. Went to showdown twice and showed a House and trips. Did I play this OK (apart from min raise PF which happened cos I was reading forum and nearly timed out) and what should I do now?
skotymcg01 Small blind  £0.04 £0.04 £3.35
Brookesy Big blind  £0.08 £0.12 £8.76
  Your hole cards
  • K
  • A
     
COLINJNR Fold     
Seagull158 Raise  £0.16 £0.28 £8.85
Villain Call  £0.16 £0.44 £11.31
skotymcg01 Fold     
Brookesy Fold     
Flop
   
  • 3
  • A
  • 6
     
Seagull158 Bet  £0.32 £0.76 £8.53
Villain Raise  £0.64 £1.40 £10.67
Seagull158 Call  £0.32 £1.72 £8.21
Turn
   
  • K
     
Seagull158 Bet  £1.20 £2.92 £7.01
Villain All-in  £10.67 £13.59 £0.00
Seagull158 ?     
      
  
   
  
   
   
     
      
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Comments

  • ratedRKOratedRKO
    edited February 2011

    I dont think this is a tough spot surely this is an easy call? u have top 2 pair.

    why do you only call on the flop, after the guy re-raises? is it not better to raise and get more money in the pot? I would try and get as much in on the flop as possible, and i would definatly call the turn

    apologies if this is wrong im new here & fancied having a go

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  • thejudge10thejudge10
    edited February 2011
    easy call,agree with above,i would have re raised on flop,with AK what more are you expecting to hit
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  • AcidMan27AcidMan27
    edited February 2011
    I would have raised more pre too unless that's how much you always raise.
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  • Seagull158Seagull158
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    I would have raised more pre too unless that's how much you always raise.
    Posted by AcidMan27
    What range would you put him on then? He's reraised me on the Axx flop and then he's shoved over my raise on the turn when the K comes. Is he going to do that with Ax or Kx?
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  • Seagull158Seagull158
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    I would have raised more pre too unless that's how much you always raise.
    Posted by AcidMan27
    I explained PF raise in OP. Was reading forum and nearly got timed out. Only had time to click raise button as timer ran out.
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  • AcidMan27AcidMan27
    edited February 2011
    Oh yeah sorry, missed that bit.

    I'd personally put him on a weaker ace or a potential flush draw.

    Don't think anybody with a set would just shove on you even with the two hearts on the board.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    pay more attention and dont distract yourself because you miss important reads, does look like a set i would not 3bet the flop and i would fold the turn unless i thought he was bad aggressive
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  • ratedRKOratedRKO
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    pay more attention and dont distract yourself because you miss important reads, does look like a set i would not 3bet the flop and i would fold the turn unless i thought he was bad aggressive
    Posted by N1CK
    surely folding is bad? if you fold good hands like this everytime someone raises then you will never make any money? top 2 pair on that board surely must be good. the range of hands he could do with this, especially at lower levels must make this a winning call over-time?

    looks like a weaker ace to me, if he does have a set i think its just unlucky. over time i think you will win more callin in situations like this than you would lose
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH
    edited February 2011

    lol fold the turn get f o

    snap it off, wheres dudeskin ffs?
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  • JIMMYMADJIMMYMAD
    edited February 2011
    Snap Snap Snap Snap Snap

    Id put him on a weak ace but he possibly hit 2 pair on the flop, thats what I think anyway
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  • Seagull158Seagull158
    edited February 2011
    Thanks for the responses guys. I must think differently to most of you cos I thought he MUST have a set. Then I sat and sweated for 14 1/2 seconds before calling against my better judgement.
    He had a set of 6s and I was well P****D off.
    Is he going to shove with a weaker ace? I just cant see it.
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  • Seagull158Seagull158
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    I dont think this is a tough spot surely this is an easy call? u have top 2 pair. why do you only call on the flop, after the guy re-raises? is it not better to raise and get more money in the pot? I would try and get as much in on the flop as possible, and i would definatly call the turn apologies if this is wrong im new here & fancied having a go
    Posted by ratedRKO
    No apologies needed m8. Thanks for your opinion. Who knows whether its right or wrong?
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  • CLIOKIDCLIOKID
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    Thanks for the responses guys. I must think differently to most of you cos I thought he MUST have a set. Then I sat and sweated for 14 1/2 seconds before calling against my better judgement. He had a set of 6s and I was well P****D off. Is he going to shove with a weaker ace? I just cant see it.
    Posted by Seagull158
    He could have A3/A6 or be going daft with a flushdraw.

    I'm not getting away from this.
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  • jakallyjakally
    edited February 2011

    Unless you've got a  note that narrows his range, it is probably sets, 2 pr, flush draw, and maybe even the odd very weak draw (gutshot).

    Against this range you are fine to call. 

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  • DeucesLiveDeucesLive
    edited February 2011
    it's never a weak ace IMO, or even a strong ace- he has 2 pair or a set I think- not even sure he has a draw really in his range often. But I think A3/A6 is more likely most of the time than 66/33, if your two pair was weaker I could see more argument for folding, but with top 2- not me. You've still got 4 live outs to house up anyway, it's not much to go on but at least you're not drawing dead.

    Ul, I'd have the same suspicion but I think he'd play 2 pair the same way so you can't really get away.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : surely folding is bad? if you fold good hands like this everytime someone raises then you will never make any money? top 2 pair on that board surely must be good. the range of hands he could do with this, especially at lower levels must make this a winning call over-time? looks like a weaker ace to me, if he does have a set i think its just unlucky. over time i think you will win more callin in situations like this than you would lose
    Posted by ratedRKO
    as i said if i thought he was a bad agressive player then i could think about calling, when you get raised or put to a tough decision they either have what they think is the best hands or a bluff you shouldn't worry about getting exploited  because they dont know what your folding, just go with your reads and what makes more sense, ok sometimes you will fold the best hand and thats not a big deal what is a big deal is calling with the worst hand
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited February 2011
    8NL..... wait forget the limits SNAP IT BLOODY OFF !!!

    EDIT : This thread is almost as bad as Deuceslive's FH flat on the river, I did say almost though !
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    he is never min raising a FD on the flop and shoving a FD on the turn, and i dont think hes shoving A6 when the king hits the turn, i know its only nl8 but its no excuse for making bad calls lol

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  • CLIOKIDCLIOKID
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    he is never min raising a FD on the flop and shoving a FD on the turn, and i dont think hes shoving A6 when the king hits the turn, i know its only nl8 but its no excuse for making bad calls lol
    Posted by N1CK
    At NL8 you have to question how much your opponent is thinking though.

    Top two at this level is almost never a fold I'd say.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : At NL8 you have to question how much your opponent is thinking though. Top two at this level is almost never a fold I'd say.
    Posted by CLIOKID
    i agree they dont think to much and its tough to fold top2 but when they do this the alarm bells should ring, i just think this is a set to much of the time and i think its losing money if you call in these spots every time, its all very well saying his range here is xyz but when you really look how this hand is played i think you can narrow his range down to just X Most of the time
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  • salazarsalazar
    edited February 2011
    min raise on the flop and re-raise shove on the turn. What's he saying? He is saying that he is massive. He has either got the flopped set or flopped 2 pair. i would say the set but there is a chance of the 2 pair if he is the kind of player to call raises pre with ace-rag.

    Go with your gut, it is what i do in these spots.
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  • leon621leon621
    edited February 2011
    in all fairness when you post this, most people know that you have lost, otherwise you would not of posted it. no one here has reads on your opponents and without any reads almost all of us are calling this. I think someone has mentioned it already but if you were paying a bit more attention and played this differently pre flop and post flop the set is a bit easier to read and maybe you fold.
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  • DeucesLiveDeucesLive
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    8NL..... wait forget the limits SNAP IT BLOODY OFF !!! EDIT : This thread is almost as bad as Deuceslive's FH flat on the river, I did say almost though !
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    Haha love you dude <3

    Seriously, I'd be getting it in here but I really wouldn't be happy about it. Nick is spot on here, you can go on about how much your opponent isn't thinking, but that's the exact logic that leads you to potentially fold this- this insane overbet is ALWAYS a massive hand. Low limits are very predictable. The only reason it's a call is because 2 pair is still plenty massive and would probably get the same response, but you're behind to a set soooo many times when someone starts putting in crazy raises.
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : Haha love you dude <3 Seriously, I'd be getting it in here but I really wouldn't be happy about it. Nick is spot on here, you can go on about how much your opponent isn't thinking, but that's the exact logic that leads you to potentially fold this- this insane overbet is ALWAYS a massive hand. Low limits are very predictable. The only reason it's a call is because 2 pair is still plenty massive and would probably get the same response, but you're behind to a set soooo many times when someone starts putting in crazy raises.
    Posted by DeucesLive
    Just my opinion but if your folding top two here youre getting bluffed off a lot, maybe higher up 30NL+ it's a fold but not at the micro's.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : Just my opinion but if your folding top two here youre getting bluffed off a lot, maybe higher up 30NL+ it's a fold but not at the micro's.
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    your never getting bluffed in this spot no1 folds an ace at nl8
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  • unknown_usernameunknown_username
    edited February 2011
    i agree i come to the conclusion that no one bluffs at the micros, other than me lol!.


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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : your never getting bluffed in this spot no1 folds an ace at nl8
    Posted by N1CK
    When I say bluff I mean someone with a worse hand making you fold a better one, not total air but some big ace or worse two pair.
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : When I say bluff I mean someone with a worse hand making you fold a better one, not total air but some big ace or worse two pair.
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    i just dont think that happens in this hand just by the way it played out but i understand what your saying
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  • Seagull158Seagull158
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : Just my opinion but if your folding top two here youre getting bluffed off a lot, maybe higher up 30NL+ it's a fold but not at the micro's.
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    Are you sure the reverse isnt true? Arent you more likely to be getting bluffed off at the higher level?
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  • N1CKN1CK
    edited February 2011
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tough spot. Call or fold? : Are you sure the reverse isnt true? Arent you more likely to be getting bluffed off at the higher level?
    Posted by Seagull158
    they love to bluff at these lower levels but only if they smell weakness (bet one street then check the next) as you bet every street reppin an Ace its highly unlikely that he bluff shoves the river, what hes trying to say is that villain could overplay a flopped two pair and think hes good so shoves hoping you have AQ, he cant put you on AK because it got there (which they love to do) so for that reason i guess he would think twice about shoving A3/A6 ADD that to the fact it looks so much like a set i think its a lean towards the fold but hey wtf do i know

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