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does he have kings?

edited May 2011 in The Poker Clinic
First hand of £3.30 dym, does he have pocket kings? ace king? was fold correct?
reddevil92 Small blind   10.00 10.00 1990.00
alyman Big blind   20.00 30.00 1980.00
  Your hole cards
  • A
  • 8
     
sandy1989 Fold        
gylo76 Raise   100.00 130.00 1900.00
Gary401 Fold        
Crunchybob Call   100.00 230.00 1900.00
reddevil92 Fold        
alyman Fold        
Flop
   
  • A
  • 3
  • 8
     
gylo76 Check        
Crunchybob Bet   115.00 345.00 1785.00
gylo76 Call   115.00 460.00 1785.00
Turn
   
  • K
     
gylo76 All-in   1785.00 2245.00 0.00
Crunchybob Fold        
gylo76 Muck        
gylo76 Win   460.00   460.00
gylo76 Return   1785.00 0.00 2245.00
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Comments

  • edited May 2011
    Run arounnd do a little dance then call imo, only hand i put him on that were losing to is AK if he has a set your just unlucky i snap this off.
  • edited May 2011
    Assuming villain isn't a known spoz why would he check call AK on a flushing A high flop? If he was trying to be tricky his next move probably isn't to smash it in when he hits top two. I would rule out AK, though who knows at £3 DYM?

    I would call expecting to see a lot of qj/dd/cc draws here, maybe a set of 8s, but I make poor decisions so it was probably the KK ;)









  • edited May 2011
    fold pre, save urslelf the problem
  • edited May 2011
  • edited May 2011
    Jeez why does everyone always say fold pre, you think ppl win poker tournemants by folding pre everytime? i had a suited ace, first hand of the dym thought i'd have a pop. i ended up cashing so i must of done something right lol.
  • edited May 2011
    The way it played i dont think it is AK. Does look a lot like KK to be fair.

    Anymore info on villain? Its very early in proceedings. Does he play mega tight early doors in these usually? If he does then KK is very likely.
  • edited May 2011
    I think its a snap call, also dont mind the call pre because we have a suited ace in position
  • edited May 2011
    Thankyou Young Gun, someone with a brain cell lol. its the first hand in this dym, so i have no info, i wasnt going to risk being eliminated so i folded, i think he could of done 2 things, hit kings and checked to which i would of fired another barrel, or panicked at seeing such a brilliant hand and hitting all in. if he did hit then im glad he went all in and saved me chips :)
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    Jeez why does everyone always say fold pre, you think ppl win poker tournemants by folding pre everytime? i had a suited ace, first hand of the dym thought i'd have a pop. i ended up cashing so i must of done something right lol.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    this

    esp when ur gonna get urself in2 sticky spots where u dnt know wot 2 do

    having called pre this is now a call
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    Jeez why does everyone always say fold pre, you think ppl win poker tournemants by folding pre everytime? i had a suited ace, first hand of the dym thought i'd have a pop. i ended up cashing so i must of done something right lol.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    Maybe you just did less things wrong than the 3 that failed ;)
  • edited May 2011
    I think he can stack of 77 + here still, i dont think he ever has Kings fwiw , only hand im worried about is AK but people are silly in these so i still snap call
  • edited May 2011
    so the 3 things that failed? calling pre flop, folding after shove? and the other one is?

    i see it so many times, ppl folding hand after hand, then u get to level 5 or 6 with around 10bbs and just looking for a marginal hand to shove only for someone to call with a better hand. doesnt it make sense to see a cheaper flop with semi hands that could hit?
  • edited May 2011
    even with a mid pair, so early on wit no reads ppl get worried about the aces, kings etc hitting. dont fink he would risk his tournament life for a measley 460 chips...looking back on it, i think i played this hand well and made the right fold in the end.
  • edited May 2011

    This is a very standard fold preflop, everyday day of the week, in a DYM.

    Once you have called pre you have to stack off imo otherwise there is no point in the playing the hand in the first place.

    Q. What were you hoping to hit when you called preflop with A8s?

    A. Two pair or a flush.

  • edited May 2011
    yeh or quad aces :)...
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    even with a mid pair, so early on wit no reads ppl get worried about the aces, kings etc hitting. dont fink he would risk his tournament life for a measley 460 chips...looking back on it, i think i played this hand well and made the right fold in the end.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    LOL why post and then comeback to say you think you played it best, have a look at different views and next time your in a similar position you will judge it better maybe if you bet a bit more.

    Blinds are low also so you still have enough chips to comeback :P
  • edited May 2011
    i posted it straight away as it happened, as i was sittng there thinking if he had kings or ace king, wouldnt he just trap me? i appreciate the comments and stuff, but looking back on it and seeing as i did cash i think folding was the best option. was wondering how other ppl wud play it.
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    i posted it straight away as it happened, as i was sittng there thinking if he had kings or ace king, wouldnt he just trap me? i appreciate the comments and stuff, but looking back on it and seeing as i did cash i think folding was the best option. was wondering how other ppl wud play it.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    results orientated pokerz FTW!

    if u dnt wish for gd advice and 2b corrected dnt post hands!

    dym's have a pretty easy strategy (esp at the lower levels) which enables u2 get the highest poss % of cashes over time, and in this case, u av played all 3 streets incorrect!
  • edited May 2011
    fold pre, fistpump get it in on turn
  • edited May 2011
    now thats where i dont understand.

    street 1. matter of opinion whether or not i shud of got involved or not. some said yes some said no.

    street 2. i hit top 2 pair on flop. i bet the pot, he calls(not much else i can do here).

    street 3. king on turn, he goes all in. i think either representing ace king, or set of kings. i fold...some ppl are saying shove and some fold.

    personally i don't think i did ne fing wrong, i was purely asking ppl at the time whether or not they think he had ace king or kings...i was confused cos if i had ace king or kings, i would of checked, for him to probably bet, for me to either re-raise or call, but try and eventually go all in.

    whether i wud of cashed or not this hand still took place, so kinda guess its not all results orientate :).
  • edited May 2011
    i dont mind coming in on the button there, fold pre is optional, people do love to say it though.

    The turn jam is the kind of thing you see people do when turning a set there, so I understand why you suspected K's. 

    Still its going to be a tricky fold, could so easily be so many other hands
  • edited May 2011
    Street 1 it can go either way call or fold here depending on how nitty you are

    Street 2, bet more

    From turn its really about getting it all in imo

    Shanx is spot on though i dont think you should be posting replies such as its all about opinions and mine is right, if you want people to be constructive i suggest maybe you listen or maybe have a debate
  • edited May 2011
    Read through this post from beginning to end after YG's above comment.

    Key issue with DYM is your not playing to win, just not to lose, so you dont really want to be gambling too much.  Calling with "a suited A" A8 is gambling tbf, especially calling off 5bb's from EP raiser.

    I think your overall approach is interesting.  Your comment about coming in when blinds are small rather than whittling down and jamming 10B's later on does have merit.  But then electing to fold when one of the hands you've come in on early with connects so well does seem very counter intuitive.

    Personally I've always felt that the above approach is very dangerous.  As your likely always going to be hitting some aspect of the board, creepy creepy catching monkey, investing over streets, ending up in no mans land.  If your sat deep you have more post flop options, but these dyms are pretty shallow turbo's, with no real margin for coming in significantly behind and catching up.

    Each to their own tho :p
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    now thats where i dont understand. street 1. matter of opinion whether or not i shud of got involved or not. some said yes some said no. street 2. i hit top 2 pair on flop. i bet the pot, he calls(not much else i can do here). street 3. king on turn, he goes all in. i think either representing ace king, or set of kings. i fold...some ppl are saying shove and some fold. personally i don't think i did ne fing wrong, i was purely asking ppl at the time whether or not they think he had ace king or kings...i was confused cos if i had ace king or kings, i would of checked, for him to probably bet, for me to either re-raise or call, but try and eventually go all in. whether i wud of cashed or not this hand still took place, so kinda guess its not all results orientate :).
    Posted by Crunchybob
    u bet 1/2 pot
  • edited May 2011
    lol i must read properly i thought blinds were higher and just a min raise, so i agree pre fold is good

    5x bb raise i would not be calling with anything but QQ+ here

    if it was a 2 x or maybe 3 x i dont mind flatting here pre but ignore the rest of what i said, Cheers AMYBR you made me realise it was a 5 x raise

    im with stupid :P
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    Read through this post from beginning to end after YG's above comment. Key issue with DYM is your not playing to win, just not to lose, so you dont really want to be gambling too much.  Calling with "a suited A" A8 is gambling tbf, especially calling off 5bb's from EP raiser. I think your overall approach is interesting.  Your comment about coming in when blinds are small rather than whittling down and jamming 10B's later on does have merit.  But then electing to fold when one of the hands you've come in on early with connects so well does seem very counter intuitive. Personally I've always felt that the above approach is very dangerous.  As your likely always going to be hitting some aspect of the board, creepy creepy catching monkey, investing over streets, ending up in no mans land.  If your sat deep you have more post flop options, but these dyms are pretty shallow turbo's, with no real margin for coming in significantly behind and catching up. Each to their own tho :p
    Posted by AMYBR
    thats prob the biggest prob wiv this hand, u cnt call a utg 5x pre wiv a8 then fold a8x
  • edited May 2011
    But he cashed so it was the right fold :) (joke crunchy, it is a very odd line tho)
  • edited May 2011
    i guess its all about opinions and peoples style of playing dyms, guess we all have a successful way of playing them or we wont be on this site for long.

    i do appreciate the help and tips etc..even if i was criticizing people. shan was saying i played it all completely wrong where as i thought i played it ok.

    plus i seen shan fold n shove their way to the money before (last night £11 dym, bit of a monster got to level 9).

    hopefully if i see u on the tables agen, u think im loose when im sitting with aces :p

    ps. ye i no i sed i bet full pot, even tho i did half pot my mistake.
  • edited May 2011
    I would fold pre - I would prefer to play 98 here rather than A8 - If u hit your Ace are you gonna snap fold the c-bet?

    You hit a dream flop & still had to lay this down later

    Later on in a tourney maybe ok but i think 1st hand there will be better spots
  • edited May 2011
    In Response to Re: does he have kings?:
    i guess its all about opinions and peoples style of playing dyms, guess we all have a successful way of playing them or we wont be on this site for long. i do appreciate the help and tips etc..even if i was criticizing people. shan was saying i played it all completely wrong where as i thought i played it ok. plus i seen shan fold n shove their way to the money before (last night £11 dym, bit of a monster got to level 9). hopefully if i see u on the tables agen, u think im loose when im sitting with aces :p ps. ye i no i sed i bet full pot, even tho i did half pot my mistake.
    Posted by Crunchybob
    had a feelin u'd bring this up

    1st of all yes i won a flip 2 stay in the game but my ship with KT was correct, alot of the time it gets thru, this time i got looked up by nines, and won the flip.

    i think ur failin 2 understand a massive part of the game thou, after that i continued 2 increase my chip count without showing a hand, pressuring the other 3 stacks, inc u, on the bubble as it becomes diff 4 people 2 call unless they wake up with a monster. In this case, by the time i walked my A3 in2 ur JJ u only had 1.2k left, and my stack could afford to take that hit, so i'm ~30% to end the dym there, failin that, i try 2 carry on as before.

    u need to learn to play the dynamics of a dym, u can't just rely on ur cards
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