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A horrible experiance thats left me completey disillusioned
Last night i went up to the casino (i wont mention what one due to the circumstances) but I've literally never seem a situation like this one.
Most people know i always use a card protector. Thats so i know if theirs any hassles i have a leg to stand on. Yesterday was no different. Although the situation was.
Im drawn my table. I already know theres groups in this casino. But usually they have a little bit of banter and a laugh. There was 4 people id never met before last night, they where all drawn onto my table. From the way they spoke they where clearly regulars however it just might be tha wehn ive been there theyve had a nightoff. One of these 4 draw the K of spades as the highest card and has to deal. The guy doesnt seem to mind, and tbh i dont either as i hate dealing while im playing it effects my game badly.
Suffle up and deal is sounded and we're off, first hand im UTG and would fold 99% of hands but being delt Qc Qs was just too good to pass up i raise 4.5BB. 2 callers. I know rraises arent normally respected in this place i actually expected 3 callers minimum to this or a re-raise from a LAG guy on the button.
The flop comes 2d 7c Ts
I bet one guy folds. The other calls. Turn Qh
Again i bet and the guy calls.
River 4s
I check to get a bet which comes and before i can do anything the dealer hands the other guy the pot. Before he takes it in i say Wait i still have cards and im still in the hand. Now im not sure but im pretty sure i have the nuts here. The dealer says, you clearly have nothing and your going to fold, im not waiting around.
I say ok then im all in. Dealer says, but your cards are now dead. I replied I still have my cards right here (i point to them) and their protected see (point to the card protector). The dealer says that doesnt matter as hes declared my hand is dead. He calls over the TD. The TD wasnt the guy who i knew to be the TD he was another guy, although he looked official id spoke to the guy who booked me in before and he was the usuall TD. This guy says i should protect my cards, i ask him to come to my seat nicley (while being very rattled admitedly) and point that i still have my cards and their protected. He said the clearly wherent at all times. I said i think ull find they where and requested him to check the cameras. He refused. I lost my bet for the call and get the rest of my chips back (1/4 of starting stack.).
This sends me into some serious tilt which i never recovered from. I was angry, very angry. I try and keep focused but after this every time i raise the opponent from the 1st hand asks " who raised" the dealer would say me. After 6 times (roughly) of this i pipe up. Now at this point Ive lost a pot on the river with the nuts, ive not hit a single flop once. Ive had my 20BB 4bet called 4way and got 3 all ins on a T high flop. So im rattled for multiple reasons, and i say, "youve asked this every time ive raised since the first hand. You clearly have something personal about me and the next word out your mouth is call. So just hurry up and call an dget it over with. Oh and dont think im not stupid youve not even looked at your cards yet." My lanuage wasnt quite as clean as that in honesty but its as close as i can type here. Sure enough he calls and still hasnt looked, but ive now got him on the edge. Turnbs out his 63os flops a straight. Im left with 1700 chips from a 10K starting.
I go all in with AT. The again asks who raised. Before dealer can state anything "me im all in you clearly want my bounty, so come and get it" he calls again without looking. I exit on this hand. Rather relieved tbh.
However in a situation like this. Mostly the first hand one. Is there anything i can do in honesty? I love poker, i love live poker, but after this i'm not sure i ever want to look at a game of cards again. Its really sucked alot of life out of me. Ok you can say its only a £25 tourny onto the next one. But ive always had principles and honour and this has just made me lose faith in it all. I felt it was rigged, and if i felt a live poker game was rigged in a casino, then how can i trust anything.
Most people know i always use a card protector. Thats so i know if theirs any hassles i have a leg to stand on. Yesterday was no different. Although the situation was.
Im drawn my table. I already know theres groups in this casino. But usually they have a little bit of banter and a laugh. There was 4 people id never met before last night, they where all drawn onto my table. From the way they spoke they where clearly regulars however it just might be tha wehn ive been there theyve had a nightoff. One of these 4 draw the K of spades as the highest card and has to deal. The guy doesnt seem to mind, and tbh i dont either as i hate dealing while im playing it effects my game badly.
Suffle up and deal is sounded and we're off, first hand im UTG and would fold 99% of hands but being delt Qc Qs was just too good to pass up i raise 4.5BB. 2 callers. I know rraises arent normally respected in this place i actually expected 3 callers minimum to this or a re-raise from a LAG guy on the button.
The flop comes 2d 7c Ts
I bet one guy folds. The other calls. Turn Qh
Again i bet and the guy calls.
River 4s
I check to get a bet which comes and before i can do anything the dealer hands the other guy the pot. Before he takes it in i say Wait i still have cards and im still in the hand. Now im not sure but im pretty sure i have the nuts here. The dealer says, you clearly have nothing and your going to fold, im not waiting around.
I say ok then im all in. Dealer says, but your cards are now dead. I replied I still have my cards right here (i point to them) and their protected see (point to the card protector). The dealer says that doesnt matter as hes declared my hand is dead. He calls over the TD. The TD wasnt the guy who i knew to be the TD he was another guy, although he looked official id spoke to the guy who booked me in before and he was the usuall TD. This guy says i should protect my cards, i ask him to come to my seat nicley (while being very rattled admitedly) and point that i still have my cards and their protected. He said the clearly wherent at all times. I said i think ull find they where and requested him to check the cameras. He refused. I lost my bet for the call and get the rest of my chips back (1/4 of starting stack.).
This sends me into some serious tilt which i never recovered from. I was angry, very angry. I try and keep focused but after this every time i raise the opponent from the 1st hand asks " who raised" the dealer would say me. After 6 times (roughly) of this i pipe up. Now at this point Ive lost a pot on the river with the nuts, ive not hit a single flop once. Ive had my 20BB 4bet called 4way and got 3 all ins on a T high flop. So im rattled for multiple reasons, and i say, "youve asked this every time ive raised since the first hand. You clearly have something personal about me and the next word out your mouth is call. So just hurry up and call an dget it over with. Oh and dont think im not stupid youve not even looked at your cards yet." My lanuage wasnt quite as clean as that in honesty but its as close as i can type here. Sure enough he calls and still hasnt looked, but ive now got him on the edge. Turnbs out his 63os flops a straight. Im left with 1700 chips from a 10K starting.
I go all in with AT. The again asks who raised. Before dealer can state anything "me im all in you clearly want my bounty, so come and get it" he calls again without looking. I exit on this hand. Rather relieved tbh.
However in a situation like this. Mostly the first hand one. Is there anything i can do in honesty? I love poker, i love live poker, but after this i'm not sure i ever want to look at a game of cards again. Its really sucked alot of life out of me. Ok you can say its only a £25 tourny onto the next one. But ive always had principles and honour and this has just made me lose faith in it all. I felt it was rigged, and if i felt a live poker game was rigged in a casino, then how can i trust anything.
Comments
I wouldn't let it tilt me, but I wouldn't let them get another penny out of me in business until I get the matter cleared up with their bosses.
Disclaimer: personal viewpoint, not that of Sky, etc etc.
My heart goes out to you Don..............I've said it on here b4............live play against a crowd where I don't anyone and not sure whether the room is legit and to be less than honest is def not something I would be comfortable with................soz to hear you've been taken for a ride m8.
Sounds a bit of a threatening scenario you`ve descibed there Don, I don`t think
that I would want to return there under any circumstances.
Serious skullduggery there mate. Shifty as.
Deffo wouldnt go back to play, but I would be taking it further. Ive only been to a couple of casinos, but I dont think id ever play at a self dealt one......didnt even know you could get them to be fair.
1 :person A shuffles
2:person B cuts
3:person c deals..
ASo all in all it takes 3 people to do the whole method of dealing out the cards around the table ..can casinos not get those logistical dealing machines and implement them instaed of having 3 people to deal all the time..
I agree with op it gets very confusing and most putting off your game ...
Quick question. Each table deals for a permanent player dealer, determined by high card right? Then this horrific situation with the Q's came about because the dealer that had been determined by high card determined you werent calling on river with top set, also correct?
If this is so I think you took this lieing down to easy, I would strain to put across to official TD what actually happened, looking for a neutral ally in one of your tyable mates, then requested a new player dealer or that exhisting player dealer be reprimanded/spoken to. His actions that you state are utterly ridiculous and totally bad form. If he'd dealing, thats all he should be doing when not involved with the hand. Another player wants to call clock or any such thats fine. But he should be waiting on your action, rather than pre-emptively ruling it.
This is a disgusting setup.
One thing to mention. Many casino dont allow a permanent player designated dealer these days, simply down to collusion and cheating. Most have adopted a 2 or so orbit change. Wherever it is your playing seems to have some pretty bad practices. The only place I know that still designates a player dealer is Leeds.
YEH but its so cack that casino charges a massive rake and wants you to deal and make it look like a fruggin circus when it takes 3 people all in all around the table just to get dealt one hand of cards....
I know at victori a in london casino they implement card shuffling machines why can they not implement these around the country in all the casinos?...
take it from me that would elimininate any forthcoming confusion about fair dealing principles and cheating etc.
The job of the casino floorman /or woman is adament here to oversee any such complaints or errors the the dealing or general nature /wellbeing of the tourney..It is thier job to ensure the tournament is run smoothly and proficiently and it is in thier best interests to maintain good relationships and standings with thier players etc.
Each casino can be run /dealt differently ,you obviously picked a bad one..with some oviously bad unskilled players who totally went against the rules.
I would of gave them something to chuck me out for if that happened to me
Ill doupt ill be back.
btw i have never played live...so can anyone tell me what a card protector is please
you need to go into the casino and ask if they are really going to ignore an allegation of collusion by not even looking into your complaint and then go to the next level to whoever regulates the casino
Waller a card protector is something you put on your cards that protects them, the dealer cant touch these.
http://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/
Self deal games are the worst.
Also I thought it was anyones right in the card room to have camera footage looked at?
Sounds like a comedy run casino tbh.
+1 AND SOME
spread the word of what a joke the place is.
You should of grabbed the dealers chips and put them in your stack and said "Well you were going to do that anyway" lol.
Couple of questions.
1 What did other players at table say when this was going on? Did you ask them to verify action? If they all just kept their mouths shut they are lowlife imo
2 Did you ask TD why he believed dealer over you, especially when the evidence available to him was clearly that your cards were not mucked? If you didnt (and I understand you were upset and might not have) make sure you get an answer to this question . If they are having self deal tourneys they cant just accept dealers word on everything
As for the dealer and his mate, the less said the better
obviously never go back but name and shame the scumbag casino.
the casino and the other players at your table sound like idiots so the best thing you can do is turn away as many people as possible from playing there. dont let it happen to someone else. try your best not to let them get away with it