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Responsible gambling aspect of the thread
For brevity I will be blunt. If people are going to blow their rolls and their living money, they're going to do it while gambling is accessible and legal. It's going to have to be a much bigger incentive than this or any promotion I've seen on Sky to be the primary cause of someone going bust. Of course someone could and might well blame this for doing their monthly food budget, it doesn't make it so. People either go into a mental place or have that psychological make up where they are susceptible to this. Maybe they are in dire financial circumstances and are gambling to get out of a hole, maybe they are addicted to gambling or maybe they are self destructive. Since the day one caveman bet another caveman one shiny rock on a clubbing contest, gambling and gambling addiction has been a part of society. Now legalised gambling, such as online poker on SkyPoker, is part of the legal vice side of business. As such, and much like tobacco and alcohol manufacturers who serve this country, have legal requirements which they must meet (such as the Responsible Gambling rules for self exclusion etc). Every opportunity is given for someone who has a problem with gambling to be helped (as I have stated in my Diary, I used to do a chunk on Blackjack online, I was very happy that Sky allowed me to self exclude just from the online casino, and it was one of the first I came across to let you exclude from one product of a multi gaming wallet).
Now it's very easy for me to transfer my roll and open another account on another online casino and do everything I have on Blackjack. The fact is I recognised I had a problem. If that didn't happen, no responsible gambling in the world would have stopped me. There is a burden of responsibility for any Adult to look at themselves.
Does this promotion encourage irresponsible gaming? Not a jot IMO. Yes some people might have a spin at it and might lose some more money than they normally do, but they are just as likely to play higher because they fancy it, play more because they are in the mood etc etc.
The Harshness Of Poker
Sometimes when I do the weekly shop I'm spending money which was formerly for another family to spend on their weekly shop. It's not pleasant but I don't fel an ounce of guilt. I'm yet to play a game of poker when one of the opponents have a gun next to their head. People need to take responsibility for their actions and not scrabble for an outside source to blame when everything goes belly up.
The Promotion and SkyPoker Specifically
Yes the majority of promotions on Skypoker and any online poker site revolve around increased volume. Obviously, it's a business and to pay out the extras they need extras coming in. It's business sense. SkyPoker IMO do much more giveaways than any other site I have played on. The DTD has had added value for years, hundreds of free seats have been given out on the TV channel and on the forum, plenty of freerolls and some micro sats for big events which they know are likely to have overlay.
This promotion is neither big enough or attractive enough to encourage anyone to gamble irresponsibly to any level grater than an argument with the missus or a night on the ale will encourage you to play more. What this promo is doing is offering a spin for some semi-regs, some added value for recs who will take up many of the lower ladder money spots and give regs a bonus to shoot for.
Now recently C4P changed to rewards. More money goes to recreational and small stakes players. Look at my posts, I said it was 100% the right thing to do. I personally lose out if I continue to grind at the same level as before. I said I was fine with that because it was the right move for the liquidity of the site and for the poker economy. I lose out on the 3 month Priority club bonus, I take it on the chin, it's the right thing to do. So when a promo comes along which not only gives the STT playerpool the start of a shot in the arm it needs and will reward a grinder such as myself if they put in the time and not insignificant effort, yes I'm going to jump at it as not only is it a challenge (I love challenges) it counter balances some of the changes for those willing to work at them.
And I see people saying this is wrong. I see people saying I'm being greedy. I see people say I have no life.
Have a wild guess what my reaction to that is. I have earned my stripes in poker. It's been a long and bumpy road. I'm not sorry for one bit of added value I get because of it.
as no-one else has mentioed it.
"LADS, party round mine!!..........
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I know guys I couldn't believe it either, I had to double take and everthing too, I mean.......
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Well maybe he's turned a new leaf guys. That or he's just high? idfk.........
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Well that's not very nice, I think RyRy is an adorable little nickname. ^^"
Anywhoooooo, yeah. Promos doing what they said on the tin. If you have an ethical problem with one based on the premise of 'wanting people to but in more volume to generate more rake', you essentially have a problem with them all, and as such, I see no problem with the promotion from that standpoint.
In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.: "Oh it was just banter man" - Said every *insert crude name here*, ever.
'True' banter is between friends, often with SOME indication that the needle was sarcastic, or at the very least non threatening, and usually well within the comfort levels of both parties. And I thought banter had to be funny too? Or just me? Never met Gregg, and I don't care much for keeping it that way.
Note the fact that he SNAP-deleted his comment within 5mins of posting it.
The guilty don't flee. Just sayin'.
And it went well enough to subsequently get refused action for another round, sir. I offered up the same prop, to the same individuals. The fact that 2 out of the 3 declined (and 1 meh), along with the fact that no-one else wants to step-in and take me up on it, speaks volumes, imo.
As for your challenge, you are being vague did you or didnt you complete it.
Needles - Soft playful little digs (like my RyRy comment, up top)
Banter - Similar thing between friends, as well as it being obvious that the parties are messing around.
This was just an insult, or what seemed like a crude attempt at one. I know I'm overweight, and I even pointed to my belly in my vlogs! :P What I do have a problem with, is your intent with the post, and if that's what you genuinely consider 'banter', essentially just insulting a stranger, I cringe at what your 'mate-banter' is like. Anywho, gg sir, I'll leave my comments there and I look forward to sitting at your table in the upcoming SPTs.
EDIT: P.S. Scotty's a luckbox. [jelly]
Super EDIT: Water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned man. Your solid rep proceeds you, prolly wasn't malicious. See you at the tables sir. Oh and Ace, if you count 6 months on from August, that would make it.... Yep, yes the prop is finished. Ops scooped due to unforeseen circumstances
I offered them a rematch, to which they declined (OI OI!) Why arn't you just PM'ing me about this? :P Poor attempt at making me look like a donk bro, D+, Must try harder.
Peace and love, folks. Peace and love.
It would be brilliant if someone like you could "win" this, if you "cash" in this i will be delighted for you and hope you do. The people that are 12 plus tabling don't deserve extra money, for a mind numbing hours folding lots of hands to have played the "most" hands.
It is a misguided promotion, which clearly was going to be lacthed onto by certain players.
I have said in this thread, my diary and in the chatbox that I fancied doing this for the challenge. Take that as truth or garbage, up to you.
Where's the cut off? What roll should you have to play? What is too much? What is too little and you shouldn't be encouraged to play these games with the potential to go bust as per the OP? What are the rules? While people free fine to tell me I shouldn't be going for this, no one is telling me who should be?
This is a completely inclusive promotion. Look at the tiers. A hand at a 60p DYM counts the same as a hand in the mini primo. 60p DYMs run much more often than the £5.50 ones. Yes if you have a very low bankroll (I'm talking sub £25) then maybe you won't have the opportunity at either tier. But it's the most level playing field for a promotion as it could possibly be. Unlike the cash rake races we've had in the past or the old cash leaderboard, the vast majority of players can get a slice of this. It'll take hard work and a lot of grinding obviously, however that would always be the case whether it was a hand count or a leaderboard with points. It's not like some of the old ones which would look purely at the rake spent and calculate from there. This promo is as fair as a tournament promo can be.
You say I'm trying to justify this promotion. Offer me a counter point then. Bring anything I have stated under scrutiny but offer a reasoned argument against it other than such disrespectful dismissive without any sort of counter point. Find anything I have put on this thread and do that. Gees, it's not like I haven't given you plenty of material to fish in.
Pretend sky poker is a pub,you can enjoy youself with a couple of pints or you can get really drunk every day and end up ill,its all a matter of choice and controll
Well the bold part is obviously aimed at me, feel free in future to be more direct and call me out if that's how you feel.
The post was aimed to people who would not normally play at the lower levels, which does indeed inlcude you Tommy.
I have said in this thread, my diary and in the chatbox that I fancied doing this for the challenge. Take that as truth or garbage, up to you.
So do it for the challenge, what i am saying is all of a sudden we have players that are playing £1, 30p 50 Dyms, just to achieve this goal. Players who would otherwise never be playing this (i don't know if you have been playing these). I would think if you are going to take on this challenge you would be doing it at your own level. I know you play a lot of DYM's £5 - plus, normally the highest level DYMs there are.
Where's the cut off? What roll should you have to play? What is too much? What is too little and you shouldn't be encouraged to play these games with the potential to go bust as per the OP? What are the rules? While people free fine to tell me I shouldn't be going for this, no one is telling me who should be?
To be honest, as per my original post, i don't see why certain players are playing at such micro stakes for what is effictively not a lot of money for them. Ok, it is a "challenge" for you, so keep the "challenge" within your "bankroll", as when a lot of the "top" players are playing at this "lower" level it precludes lower stake players from actually gaining.
This is a completely inclusive promotion. Look at the tiers. A hand at a 60p DYM counts the same as a hand in the mini primo. 60p DYMs run much more often than the £5.50 ones. Yes if you have a very low bankroll (I'm talking sub £25) then maybe you won't have the opportunity at either tier. But it's the most level playing field for a promotion as it could possibly be. Unlike the cash rake races we've had in the past or the old cash leaderboard, the vast majority of players can get a slice of this. It'll take hard work and a lot of grinding obviously, however that would always be the case whether it was a hand count or a leaderboard with points. It's not like some of the old ones which would look purely at the rake spent and calculate from there. This promo is as fair as a tournament promo can be.
Tell me, how is it "inclusive" when certian players can play 8 plus tables at the same time? This could consist of 4 30p Turbo DYMs and 4 50p DYMs, sometimes more than 8 tables of these types of games. If you need me to elaborate on this, i post you the names of players that never play at this level, yet are for this promo, and are within the top 20. Indeed the vast majority are regulars from the higher levels.
You say I'm trying to justify this promotion. Offer me a counter point then. Bring anything I have stated under scrutiny but offer a reasoned argument against it other than such disrespectful dismissive without any sort of counter point. Find anything I have put on this thread and do that. Gees, it's not like I haven't given you plenty of material to fish in.
Quite simply this promo is to increase rake. 10k is offered as prizes, so sky needs to make in excess of the 10k in rake the meet there costs. I've not done the sums, so don't know if they are making a profit from this or not, I take it they will. "offer me a counter point"But, let's not call it a promotion open to all, you and i both know well there was only ever going to certain players would gain from this for the reasons mentioned above.
"Bring anything I have stated under scrutiny but offer a reasoned argument against it other than such disrespectful dismissive without any sort of counter point."
I am pretty sure i have done this, i have not been disrespectful or dissmissive and i apologise if youfeel that.
Everyone has opinions, i have included mines herein.
You are an intelligent, free thinking person Tommy, you have put up your case, as i have mine. No disrespect is meant, however i feel it was something worth saying.
I also feel it was a very worthwhile post by the OP the highlight the issues of this current promotion,
You were talking about the "left" and "socialism" which is no where mentioned in this forum until you brought it up.
I agree with the person above in relation to your posts.
However I do feel it's unfair to say that a certain amount of money is or isn't a lot to someone. None of us have an idea who is under it, what rolls people are playing, what debts they have etc. I was taught by D the Elder long ago that a pound is a ton of money for someone who doesn't have it.
You said that if I wanted a challenge just do a higher tier. To be frank I felt that wasn't tricky enough. It's become clear that I won't win both tiers now but I'm much happier trying to have a go at both than just going for one.
Finally for now I don't think it's fair that people such as myself and many others who have supported STTs and pushed for more promotions in this area be excluded from areas of said promotion due to a perceived moral boundary which in my opinion doesn't exist.
That all being said you raise valid points and argument in this post and I respect your opinion which differs from mine.
That'll probably be my last word on this subject. This isn't aimed at Larson but I am very disappointed with some of the comments made in this thread and elsewhere. I don't want to lose friends over this so I'm drawing a line under it and walking away.
Good luck everyone.