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THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.

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  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    It's brought another dimenstion to low stakes DYMs, players from higher stakes dropping down and trying to lengthen the duration of each tourney so more hands are played (giving short stacks "walks" on the bubble etc.). In other circumstances it would be noted as possible collusion, but this is not the case here.
    Posted by FCHD
    I am sorry but that is just ridiculous 
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    It's brought another dimenstion to low stakes DYMs, players from higher stakes dropping down and trying to lengthen the duration of each tourney so more hands are played (giving short stacks "walks" on the bubble etc.). In other circumstances it would be noted as possible collusion, but this is not the case here.
    Posted by FCHD
    Just to make it clear as I have been vocal in the thread, I have not done this once.  Doing this, IMO, would be wrong.

    I did see a micro stakes reg ask in the chatbox to fold round as we were 4 handed with a disco'd who had been away for the entire game.  I didn't reply in chat and I didn't follow his instruction.
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread. : First up when I said I thought you were being disrespectful, what I meant by this was the first post I replied to in my opinion had quite a passive aggressive tone which intimated that Regs such as myself were scraping around for a few extra pennies in an unseemly manner.  To be honest what you said wasn't the most offensive thing I have read on the matter, you were just the one at the point I had had enough.  The post I am replying to is a much better and reasoned reply and as such I withdraw my earlier comments about you being disrespectful. However I do feel it's unfair to say that a certain amount of money is or isn't a lot to someone.  None of us have an idea who is under it, what rolls people are playing, what debts they have etc.  I was taught by D the Elder long ago that a pound is a ton of money for someone who doesn't have it. You said that if I wanted a challenge just do a higher tier.  To be frank I felt that wasn't tricky enough.  It's become clear that I won't win both tiers now but I'm much happier trying to have a go at both than just going for one. Finally for now I don't think it's fair that people such as myself and many others who have supported STTs and pushed for more promotions in this area be excluded from areas of said promotion due to a perceived moral boundary which in my opinion doesn't exist. That all being said you raise valid points and argument in this post and I respect your opinion which differs from mine. That'll probably be my last word on this subject.  This isn't aimed at Larson but I am very disappointed with some of the comments made in this thread and elsewhere.  I don't want to lose friends over this so I'm drawing a line under it and walking away. Good luck everyone.
    Posted by TommyD
    I understand where you are coming from, I hope you do well in both tiers.  The lower limit is set at £5, i see a lot of the games you are playing go through out the levels, the minimum i seen you playing was £3 DYMs. Tbf i wasn't really referring to this i was talking about people playing 30p games and 50p games just to achieve as many hands as possible, and pretty much folding every hand. To me that is not poker.

    I don't think you should be excluded either. It might have been an idea, as someone else mentioned, to have had 3 or 4 different tiers to this promo.

    Good luck Tommy
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread. : Just to make it clear as I have been vocal in the thread, I have not done this once
    Posted by TommyD

    Yes, I was not meaning to implicate you in this thread, in fact I don't know if I've ever played a single hand at the same table as you.
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread. : Yes, I was not meaning to implicate you in this thread, in fact I don't know if I've ever played a single hand at the same table as you.
    Posted by FCHD
    You must be one of the only players on skypoker then!

    I don't understand the logic of trying to drag out tournaments. The money at stake is such that you are best to keep winning then register another tournament. Either people have flawed logic or people are multi tabling and making stack size issues. Either way this is good for other players! 

    I think this promo is one of sky's better ones and actually thought everyone would be behind it but that's probably me being silly!

    So much of the stuff in this thread is a bit of a joke but given the weather outside and life being too short I cba to post in response to it all! GL to all on the tables or in the sunshine!

  • edited May 2013
    I haven't read every post here but it seems as though there have been a few lively ones to say the least.
    I wasn't sure whether to give my opinion or not,but have decided to,as I can give a constructive piece of advice,mainly aimed at the structure of this promotion,and for SKY's benefit more than anything,should anyone from SKY POKER read this,

    regarding the op firstly,yes probably a number of players will play more games than they possibly should and without a large enough b/roll to do it,and will lose money from trying this promotion,and that is a shame.
    many will play more games than usual and breakeven from their play and some will undoubtedly play more games and come out showing a profit.
    everyone has the choice as to whether to play in this promotion(and others to come) or not,and they have to 'opt in' to do so.
    if you can't multi-table,which again everyone has the choice to do,or learn to do,then don't play them,as you have zero chance of even making last place,without being able to do so, I would guess.

    the top 20 in each tier,will i'm sure be happy at winning their respective amounts,and will have earnt them.
    the top end players will be the more happier as those figures increase,but make no mistake about it,they will have earnt that money playing many hours of poker and along with that many tables too.

    I think what would make these type of promotions a little more fair,and better balanced,and therefore more realistically give far more players more of a chance of a cash,(especially at the lower tier,)would be to make it possible to  enter one tier only.

    anyway, I've had my say,
    over & out.
    :)
    dev

  • edited May 2013


    So 60+ posts proves this was a subject for discussion. That, or a good excuse for a load of regs to jump in and chuck mud around in a forum fight! I am not sure TBH.

    I will leave you with this thought. If things were never questioned, there would never be any answers.

    Off to watch the snooker and start another thread asking why it is only the top 20 paid in this promotion and not 50, as I crept into the leader board today!!! :)   Sky Poker are elitist imo!



  • edited May 2013
    lol ahhhhh so close
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    So 60+ posts proves this was a subject for discussion. That, or a good excuse for a load of regs to jump in and chuck mud around in a forum fight! I am not sure TBH. I will leave you with this thought. If things were never questioned, there would never be any answers. Off to watch the snooker and start another thread asking why it is only the top 20 paid in this promotion and not 50, as I crept into the leader board today!!! :)   Sky Poker are elitist imo!
    Posted by MAXALLY
    One of the longest running threads on =4 is about a drawing of a Frenchman.  Admittedly it's freaking awesome but still, post count does not always equate to significance or worth.

    I'm just not sure what we got out of this personally.
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread. : One of the longest running threads on =4 is about a drawing of a Frenchman.  Admittedly it's freaking awesome but still, post count does not always equate to significance or worth. I'm just not sure what we got out of this personally.
    Posted by TommyD

    A discussion.
  • edited May 2013
    Whats the big deal 

    enjoy the sun n get pi55ed id say :)
  • edited May 2013
    imho this thread has demonstrated some of the best, and some of the worst that this community has to offer.

    does that make it a good thread, I don't know


  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread. : A discussion.
    Posted by MAXALLY
    I meant what did we get out of the discussion.
  • edited May 2013
    I agree with you maxally. 
    A promotion is there to create extra revenue and crack the ethos of 'responsible gambling' amongst as many as possible. 
    Agreed its a persons own responsibility to gamble responsibly but these are unashamed attempts to get people to gamble more than they should. Luckily I don't gamble as I don't like it much. When I do , I see it as a 'ticket' to some entertainment as in the Dtd forum on a Monday night. The poker again is entertainment for me in learning a skilled game but without great financial loss. If I don't enjoy it, I don't play it as recently happened to me in the last 3 months. 
    Unfortunately a lot of people get caught up in these money chases and live to regret it. A shame really but it's a way of the business world.
  • edited May 2013
    some massive massive egos on the community still

    have a look at yourselves 

    much more important things to worry about

    the guys that are playing god knows how many hours to day to "win" this promotion probably do not though

  • edited May 2013
    interesting thread this
    can see the OPs point of view regarding that Sky should consider responsible gambling.
    Also can see the other side in that we are all over 18, adults, and should be responsible for our own actions. 
    Larson and Tommy also make good points
    not sure why it got a bit personal as all opinions are valid for a discussion
    must admit i am not doing this one this weekend. might do the cash one once i see the details.

    my thoughts are that Sky is a business and as a result it will always do promotions in order to promote its brand and useage. they will look at the majority of people who will be able to play and manage their br responsibly. they cannot be governed by the, for want of a better phrase, "lower number denominator". by that i mean that they cannot be ruled by what a few might do when i guess they have the data to see how the Sky community play. if people gamble irresponsibly then they will do so regardless of whether there is a promo or not. i have seen a few do it on here before despite people in the chat boxes telling them to stop.
    people will do what they want to do (or feel that they have to) whether it is on Sky or elsewhere
    that shouldn't stop Sky in doing what they are doing
    if it did then all promotions of any sort (including freerolls) would have to be removed as well

    just my 1p's worth.
    good luck to you all
  • edited May 2013
    Is it responible Sky sends text messages about bet deals, emails or even promotions in the post. Dont think so.

    Is it responsible that during a football match there is about 20 betting ads, dont think so.

    As someone else said we are all adults its up to you to enter the code, its up to u to put in the hours.
  • edited May 2013
    Sky is a business just like the big supermarkets.
    They are signed up to the "Drinkaware" campaign but it doesn't stop them having cheap drinks promotions.
    If you're an alcholic you will drink , if you're a gambler you will gamble.

    As many have said its about personal responsibility.
    Too much of the "nanny" state going on these days.

    Take charge of your own lives!
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    So do it for the challenge, what i am saying is all of a sudden we have players that are playing £1, 30p 50 Dyms, just to achieve this goal. Players who would otherwise never be playing this (i don't know if you have been playing these). I would think if you are going to take on this challenge you would be doing it at your own level. Posted by LARSON7
    I play DTD, from time to time, although by playing much lower stakes than my usual play it effectively costs me money to do so. why play? because of the challenge - low stakes doesn´t mean weak players - plenty of good players at those levels. and it´s such a buzz to do well against them, from time to time.

    i didn´t play this promo, but if i did then the idea of trying to nail both levels at the same time, wow that is a challenge. i am 100% for the attempt by anyone who wants to try to achieve it.

    a different question is should there be some promos restricted to only micro-players? a very sensible question, and if the answer is yes there are ways to do so. but this wasn´t one of them.

    even more contentiously, if peeps want to change their play - not knocking out small stacks for instance, because that will help them in the promo - then wtf not. that is poker after all. sure - i don´t agree with collusion, but if a modified gameplay will make more money because of the promo, then why not modify it?

  • edited May 2013
    i don't really have a problem with the promo but my problem is with the deposit limits.


    y have sky changed them to a weekly max  when before you was able to put a montly cap. 
  • edited May 2013
    Didn't play promo,just played a few games(first for a while) because I felt like playing.
    Did get a bit sick of seeing the same 3-4 names on every table and having 2-3 aways early doors but balance that against the fact I can't get a game going today I can't really moan.
  • edited May 2013
    Regarding the argument on "Some people shouldn't play the lower stakes just for the promo". Does that mean high stakes cash/MTT/DYM players are not allowed to play the DTD games just to try and win the league and get bonus tournament entries....
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    So Sky Poker devise another promotion aimed at ALL players to reward the top 20 in each group, depending on how many hands of poker they have played over the w/end.  Two words spring to mind - 'responsible gambling'!   How can this be applied in this promotion? It is basically asking you to play more MTT's/STT's regardless of your win/lose ratio or BR, as there may be a small financial reward at the end of it. 'Gamble more/spend more' philosophy will not be a good thing for most players IMHO.  Yes, there are players on the leader board who have the BR to chuck at this promotion, and it will probably be those who are rewarded in the end too. It is the ones who have not got the BR and will not get anything out of it that worries me. I have started this thread as a DISCUSSION thread, not a moan thread or a them and us thread.  I have heard so many going/gone bust stories recently, I hope some good advice/discussions comes from this thread. 
    Posted by MAXALLY
    totally agree with this post 100%,not done on a win rate success but as many games as u can play, that is not responsible gambling,but i soppose sky have to dangle a carrott to the regs every now and then and make loads of rake from it, never took part myself coz i didnt agree with it.
  • edited May 2013
    I'm going to write to Tesco, inform them i have 500 club card points but demand that i get the same rewards as somebody with 10,000 points. Wonder how far i will get with that...


    This is essentially the same thing. Sky, a private for profit company is seeking to enoucrage its customers to spend more money with them and not their competitors. They do this by rewarding people more the more they spend, which encourages brand loyalty. I'ts a pretty common practice across the industry. 
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    I'm going to write to Tesco, inform them i have 500 club card points but demand that i get the same rewards as somebody with 10,000 points. Wonder how far i will get with that... This is essentially the same thing. Sky, a private for profit company is seeking to enoucrage its customers to spend more money with them and not their competitors. They do this by rewarding people more the more they spend, which encourages brand loyalty. I'ts a pretty common practice across the industry. 
    Posted by BrownnDog

    I totally agree!

    However as a long time winning player on Sky, would you prefer to be rewarded for your skill and percentage win rate? or the volume of games you played?

    Sky could set a minimum number of games to take part so would still achieve their objective!



  • edited May 2013
    I like wining money, call me selfish - I don't care about the exploited or de generate gamblers

    If someone wants to gamble then why should we say no don't do it.

    Sky is responsible and has exclusion options.


    Should all the pubs close because there are alcholics everywhere ?
    If I was a landlord, I want you to be a alcholic
    If I ran a gamling website, I want you to be a de gen
    If I ran a live casino I may even pay for your hotel room bill so you come to my casino because your a de gen.

    There enough help out there for gamblers and alcholics, so why should we feel bad or more to the point why should Sky not promote gambling.

    I do remember when there was no restriction on smoking adversting, no there is.
    Maybe times will change to limits on what you can advertise.

    Not yet though )


    it's been a funny thread though


    To the op Max, when you have won money at poker - have you ever given a secound thought to the people who have contributed to the prize pool. How many de gens gambling with there rent money have you managed  to knock them out for them only to go and rob some old dear of her pension money.

    You can't gamble and then take the other view of "this is wroung"
    Just makes you sound like a hypercrite




  • edited May 2013


    Oh for goodness sake

    Should we ban promotions on cakes in case people get fat?
    Should we ban promotions on sun beds in case people get skin cancer?
    Should we ban promotions on alcohol in case people get liver disease?

    Just because some people cant control themselves is no reason to penalise evrybody else
  • edited May 2013
    In Response to Re: THE BIG DEAL - The bigger issue discussion thread.:
    I like wining money, call me selfish - I don't care about the exploited or de generate gamblers If someone wants to gamble then why should we say no don't do it. Sky is responsible and has exclusion options. Should all the pubs close because there are alcholics everywhere ? If I was a landlord, I want you to be a alcholic If I ran a gamling website, I want you to be a de gen If I ran a live casino I may even pay for your hotel room bill so you come to my casino because your a de gen. There enough help out there for gamblers and alcholics, so why should we feel bad or more to the point why should Sky not promote gambling. I do remember when there was no restriction on smoking adversting, no there is. Maybe times will change to limits on what you can advertise. Not yet though ) it's been a funny thread though To the op Max, when you have won money at poker - have you ever given a secound thought to the people who have contributed to the prize pool. How many de gens gambling with there rent money have you managed  to knock them out for them only to go and rob some old dear of her pension money. You can't gamble and then take the other view of "this is wroung" Just makes you sound like a hypercrite
    Posted by rancid
    It would be a pretty unscrupulous landlord/ pokersite/ casino. It's good to have ethics. A Pub/ gambling website/ casino do not need alcholics mad gamblers, indeed decent establishments would deter this. There is a balance.

    Poker, maybe part gambling but a lot of skill too, and while some poker players may be mad gamblers the vast majority are not. So i dont see anything at all hypocritical from OP in the slightest. 
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