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Bad hands winning on too regular a basis

2

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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    oh and just for completeness 5 2 vs qq (using the same suits) wins 14% of the time - that's more than 1 in 10!
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  • JimRiddle7JimRiddle7
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : doesn't help your argument too much really but I know what you mean that it would be difficult to find. I have another question for you though if the rng's of poker sites are dodgy why has there never been any concrete proof of discrepancy ever found? surely it wouldn't be too difficult with the right software. 2nd question - why would a poker site want to have a dodgy rng? what's in it for them? The collect the rake regardless and the game of poker itself creates enough action all by itself - reason its popular in the first place!
    Posted by jdsallstar
    I appreciate all of your comments and as a low stakes player, I have been able to overcome the bad-beats and remain with a small profit.

    Nobody can prove or dis-prove how the rng works, but I can recognise when a hand is miraculous.

    With all of the hands that you guys have played, I would guess that you have seen a few yourselves.

    Agreed that it is most likely random luck, but some.. like the one I described just seem unbelievable!

    Kind regards everyone,  Jim.
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  • somersomer
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    can I see this hand jim?? i'd also like to see somers too?
    Posted by jdsallstar

    can I see this hand jim?? i'd also like to see somers too?

    Why would you ask to see the hands? I assume we are all adults and not schoolchildren - there is no profit in my telling you a lie. I was under the impression the forum was for (in part) an exchange of views not childish games.
    I lost to the hand described - you believing/disbelieving that fact is of no consequence to me whatsoever.

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  • JimRiddle7JimRiddle7
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : The odds of flopping a full house on the flop with an unpaired hand is 1 in a 1000. he then has 3 outs for the turn or 6% roughly and then 4% to hit one of his remaining two outs. which works out if you multiply that out as 0.000002 or 1 in 500,000. Big odds yes but not impossible. when you consider Sky poker has not had over 700 millions hands then it should happen every so often. Of course we haven't seen him post the hand yet so it's hard to know if it actually happened to him or not
    Posted by jdsallstar
    Thanks for the calculation Allstar.  1 in 500,000, wow that is quite rare. He was very lucky.

    Would have no idea how to do the calculation myself,  lol.
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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : c an I see this hand jim?? i'd also like to see somers too? Why would you ask to see the hands? I assume we are all adults and not schoolchildren - there is no profit in my telling you a lie. I was under the impression the forum was for (in part) an exchange of views not childish games. I lost to the hand described - you believing/disbelieving that fact is of no consequence to me whatsoever.
    Posted by somer
    there is profit in you telling a lie - its what your using to back up your claim that the rng is fixed.

    Is it really that childish of me to ask you to show the proof of what you're claiming happened?

    Accuser: Judge this man stole my car
    Judge: is there any evidence of this?
    Accuser: I assume we are all adults and not schoolchildren - there is no profit in my telling you a lie
    Judge: good point. case closed lock him up!
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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    some live examples:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQDodik0ubw

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMZrdFUX-Cs

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xqaxWQO79g

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua8J9NKcjr0
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  • oynutteroynutter
    edited November 2013
    aces being cracked is'nt one of the kind of hands there are too many of
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  • somersomer
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : there is profit in you telling a lie - its what your using to back up your claim that the rng is fixed. Is it really that childish of me to ask you to show the proof of what you're claiming happened? Accuser: Judge this man stole my car Judge: is there any evidence of this? Accuser: I assume we are all adults and not schoolchildren - there is no profit in my telling you a lie Judge: good point. case closed lock him up!
    Posted by jdsallstar

    “there is profit in you telling a lie - its what your using to back up your claim that the rng is fixed”

    If you read my post you will not find the word “Fixed” and yet you imply that it is my claim.
    Sadly, one of the problems with posting on this forum is that some are unable to understand the comments.

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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2013
    They showed the EPT Monte Carlo on channel 4 the other night and there was a proper sick hand.

    About 12 left in the tourney and it all goes in pre 99 v AQ v A5 so A5 has to make 2pr and AQ has to hit one of their 5 outs. Flop comes something like 925 so 9s have flopped a set and is about 99% favourite to win... Jason Mercier runs over to the feature table to tell other people they've got 2 bust outs.... turn 3, river 4 lol, so both Ax's chop.


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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : “there is profit in you telling a lie - its what your using to back up your claim that the rng is fixed” If you read my post you will not find the word “Fixed” and yet you imply that it is my claim. Sadly, one of the problems with posting on this forum is that some are unable to understand the comments.
    Posted by somer
    Some quotes from yourself regarding the rng from your posting history:

    "the site is a straight as a corkscrew. no odds apply when its fixed."
    "Something is rotten in the state of Denmark....... "
    "Can these cards be truly described as random?"
    "    Sadly, its just another example of the inability of the so called random number generator to produce random cards/hands.
    The site experts will analyse the players actions advising on the play etc - whereas  we should all be asking: WTF is going on with this sites RNG! "
    "If its “lady luck” then the poor woman is being overworked"
    "Rigged is a little strong"

    So you may have not used the word "fixed" on this thread but you have used it in the past and implied it on many occasions. Whether you think the rng is fixed, bias, not random etc etc or whatever way you want to describe it is a little irrelevant - you have questioned it's reliability.

    To try and defend the reliability of the rng i have posted:

    -stats to show hands are far from impossible
    -asked questions that would support it's randomness, none of which has anyone attempted to answer I might add - i.e. what would sky get out of it? how do players make incredibly consistent profits? why has there never been any concrete proof of dodgy rngs?
    -gave live examples of equally horrendous beats

     

    What have you done to back up your arguement that the software is not reliable?

    Thats right - nothing, zero, zilch! The pantomine argument of "oh yes it is" doesnt really get you very far. You wont even post up the hand you describe in your post earlier.

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  • igimcigimc
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : there is profit in you telling a lie - its what your using to back up your claim that the rng is fixed. Is it really that childish of me to ask you to show the proof of what you're claiming happened? Accuser: Judge this man stole my car Judge: is there any evidence of this? Accuser: I assume we are all adults and not schoolchildren - there is no profit in my telling you a lie Judge: good point. case closed lock him up!
    Posted by jdsallstar
    Lol...so who appointed you judge???

    So if they show the hands will you say its fixed???

    so whats the point???

    I personally don't know why they would feel they have to
    justify themselves to you anyway,but hayho :)


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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : Lol...so who appointed you judge??? So if they show the hands will you say its fixed??? so whats the point??? I personally don't know why they would feel they have to justify themselves to you anyway,but hayho :)
    Posted by igimc
    Me.
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  • igimcigimc
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : Me.
    Posted by hhyftrftdr
    yeah,thats what i thought...nobody
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : yeah,thats what i thought...nobody
    Posted by igimc
    Ouch. Really hurts that. Hurts more than any bad beat Sky can throw at me :(
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  • mac24mac24
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : The odds of flopping a full house on the flop with an unpaired hand is 1 in a 1000. he then has 3 outs for the turn or 6% roughly and then 4% to hit one of his remaining two outs. which works out if you multiply that out as 0.000002 or 1 in 500,000. Big odds yes but not impossible. when you consider Sky poker has not had over 700 millions hands then it should happen every so often. Of course we haven't seen him post the hand yet so it's hard to know if it actually happened to him or not
    Posted by jdsallstar
    jd - yes the odds of this are high, but ya gotta admit, its nice when it happens :)
     
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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : Lol...so who appointed you judge??? So if they show the hands will you say its fixed??? so whats the point??? I personally don't know why they would feel they have to justify themselves to you anyway,but hayho :)
    Posted by igimc
    it's not often you get to see a 1 in 500,000 hand lol

    to be honest I asked because I don't believe him. That's not to say that it didn't happen but often in those type of posts people tend to exaggerate somewhat. i.e. my AA has been cracked 20 times in a row etc etc. You're right he has absolutely no need to justify himself to me but he came on a public forum and I challenged him on his opinion, gave my side of the argument and asked him to back up what he was saying. Is it not expected that people will challenge strong opinions? is that not what forums are for? Was I wrong to ask him to back up his opinion? Should I have just agreed with him?

    Confused why you have a problem


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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : Me.
    Posted by hhyftrftdr
    Do I get paid?! :)
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  • craigcu12craigcu12
    edited November 2013
    we might all hate getting these bad beats but how else can chips be built up when you get cowards who can only jam hands.
     Small blind  15.00 15.00 2985.00
     Big blind  30.00 45.00 2970.00
      Your hole cards
    • A
    • 10
    		     
    xAll-in  3000.00 3045.00 0.00
     Fold     
    craigcu12 Fold     
    Fold     
     Fold     
     Fold     
    xMuck     
    xWin  75.00  75.00
    xReturn  2970.00 0.00 3045.00
     Small blind  100.00 100.00 8949.06
     Big blind  200.00 300.00 3275.00
      Your hole cards
    • 9
    • 9
    		     
    craigcu12 Raise  400.00 700.00 6664.69
    jammAll-in  6477.50 7177.50 0.00
     Fold     
    Fold     
     Fold     
     Fold     
    craigcu12 Fold     
    jammMuck     
    jammWin  1100.00  1100.00
    jammReturn  6077.50 0.00 7177.50
     Small blind  100.00 100.00 3175.00
    craigcu12 Big blind  200.00 300.00 6464.69
      Your hole cards
    • Q
    • K
    		     
    jammAll-in  7177.50 7477.50 0.00
     Fold     
     Fold     
    Fold     
     Fold     
     All-in  6464.69 13942.19 0.00
    jammUnmatched bet  512.81 13429.38 512.81
     Show
    • Q
    • K
    		   
    jammShow
    • 8
    • 8
    		   
    Flop
       
    • 7
    • 8
    • 5
    		     
    Turn
       
    • 2
    		     
    River
       
    • J
    		     
    jammWin Three 8s 13429.38  13942.19
    if you don't want bad beats to happen then tell these donkey cowards to learn about a thing called betting and raising
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited November 2013
    Craig, if you're gonna call them names then you should remove their alias'.

    That call with KQ is pretty heroic btw. Not good heroic!
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  • Jac35Jac35
    edited November 2013
    Not your best post Craig. I defended you very strongly a while ago when someone left your name in and did some name calling.
    Now you're doing it. 'Delete post' would be a wise option here in my opinion.





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  • craigcu12craigcu12
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    Craig, if you're gonna call them names then you should remove their alias'. That call with KQ is pretty heroic btw. Not good heroic!
    Posted by hhyftrftdr
    the stack size, having just did a jam with the previous hand (99), being UTG and the MTT was a BH and the sharkscope of her is like a fish.  so i just went with the flip as Although AK and AQ would weaken me i could see lots of raggy aces and any pair part of the range too.

    but the main reason for the call was i might as well give up, MTT will never have much strategy when they are packed with calling stations and maniacs.
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  • Jac35Jac35
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : the stack size, having just did a jam with the previous hand (99), being UTG and the MTT was a BH and the sharkscope of her is like a fish.  so i just went with the flip as Although AK and AQ would weaken me i could see lots of raggy aces and any pair part of the range too. but the main reason for the call was i might as well give up, MTT will never have much strategy when they are packed with calling stations and maniacs.
    Posted by craigcu12
    Sigh
    See my above post
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  • craigcu12craigcu12
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis : Sigh See my above post
    Posted by Jac35
    i have deleted the name of both them the second one was not called jamm.

    edit: also i'm not just referring to them i mean the same with most MTTs.

    all the time people say micro cash should never be bluffed but all it takes is 1 MTT and the difference with the danger of bluffing is huge.
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr
    edited November 2013
    You have over 30bb and you don't know you're flipping.

    It's only K high. Just let it go and look for better spots.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2013
    ^^^ This

    First of all, generally maniacs and calling stations are the complete opposite so what type of player are they?

    If someone is making stupid overbet jams preflop then tighten up and pick them off. I'd pick a range in my head and think 'right I'll snap him off when I have 99+ and AK/AQ' or whatever, the range is up to you, depending on how high variance of a line u wanna take and how wide you think he's jamming. A big part of poker is patience, sometimes on certain tables that involves just sitting there and waiting for a hand you can go to war with.

    As for stations, you just value bet a lot wider, against some people you can get 3 streets of value with 2nd pr, if u can then do. Sometimes they'll call 2 streets and get there with a gutshot but thats poker innit and you're winning longterm.
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  • F1N63RSF1N63RS
    edited November 2013
    I've never posted on here before and having played on sky poker for years accept bad beats are part of the game, but this is the worst i've ever seen 

    £5.75 Bounty Hunter

    PS sorry i had to amend the cards but when posting it was adding pages and pages of text but you still get the drift (AQ & 86 were suited btw)


    mumattSmall blind 100.00100.004410.00FishmoneyBig blind 200.00300.003125.00 Your hole cardsKK   checkleyFold    CuffscCall 200.00500.0016005.00F1N63RSRaise 800.001300.008725.00mumattAll-in 4410.005710.000.00FishmoneyAll-in 3125.008835.000.00CuffscAll-in 16005.0024840.000.00F1N63RSAll-in 8725.0033565.000.00CuffscUnmatched bet 6680.0026885.006680.00mumattShowJJ   FishmoneyShow86   CuffscShowAQ   F1N63RSShowKK   Flop  523   Turn  5   River  4   FishmoneyWinStraight to the 613300.00 13300.00CuffscWinStraight to the 513585.00 20265.00
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  • Jac35Jac35
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    I've never posted on here before and having played on sky poker for years accept bad beats are part of the game, but this is the worst i've ever seen  £5.75 Bounty Hunter PS sorry i had to amend the cards but when posting it was adding pages and pages of text but you still get the drift (AQ & 86 were suited btw) mumatt Small blind   100.00 100.00 4410.00 Fishmoney Big blind   200.00 300.00 3125.00   Your hole cards KK       checkley Fold         Cuffsc Call   200.00 500.00 16005.00 F1N63RS Raise   800.00 1300.00 8725.00 mumatt All-in   4410.00 5710.00 0.00 Fishmoney All-in   3125.00 8835.00 0.00 Cuffsc All-in   16005.00 24840.00 0.00 F1N63RS All-in   8725.00 33565.00 0.00 Cuffsc Unmatched bet   6680.00 26885.00 6680.00 mumatt Show JJ       Fishmoney Show 86       Cuffsc Show AQ       F1N63RS Show KK       Flop     523       Turn     5       River     4       Fishmoney Win Straight to the 6 13300.00   13300.00 Cuffsc Win Straight to the 5 13585.00   20265.00
    Posted by F1N63RS
    That's the worst you've seen and you've been playing on here for years?
    You must run seriously well normally!
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  • F1N63RSF1N63RS
    edited November 2013
    OK worst pre flop all-in and miracle win when he's no need to be in hand and has 15 BB's left
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  • Jac35Jac35
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    OK worst pre flop all-in and miracle win when he's no need to be in hand and has 15 BB's left
    Posted by F1N63RS
    I know it's frustrating but these kind of things do happen on a regular basis
    Unlucky in the hand sir
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  • MikeycbMikeycb
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Bad hands winning on too regular a basis:
    some live examples: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQDodik0ubw
    Posted by jdsallstar
    sick!
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