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Regs killing cash games?

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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    trust an arsenal fan to give an idiot answer......... ill just ignore you For the others my point isnt what they do and beating them and how they play etc!!!!!! its the fac they have like 14 tables open and are not playing hands there ust earning the cash for points and thats the money there earning.....surely you cant agree thats fair? Plus when you have your monster hands you no your never get paided cause there fold, there just there for the points
    Posted by robbie1992
    1) You're playing what I've been told is by far the nittiest level on the whole site.

    2) There are plenty of people (Scotty77 comes to mind) who play anything between 10-20 tables and aren't just playing AA/KK/QQ/AK and just playing for points. Yes they're playing a tight range as you'd have to on so many tables, but not like top 5% or anything.

    3) If they really are that tight, then just flat their raises pre, and check/raise them on a ton of flops that miss their very narrow range. Find a way round their style cos there is one.

    4) IMO adjusting in poker is all about finding a strategy that makes lots of profit, and this is what they've done. Everyone has their own reasons for playing, some just like a gamble and you can't moan for them playing like idiots, some wanna be a nit, leave them to it, but if you get VERY good at the game, you can develop a game that is far more profitable than being a massive nit.
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  • TPTP123TPTP123
    edited November 2012
    what lambert said, Rake system is fine the way it is... leave it be please.   The "Regs" at 50nl are not crushing and its easy to get some simple reads on them and win a good few buyins off them per session just be carefully seat selecting. They make a good table a perfect one if you understand position and table cash flow properly. 

    Just because they play all day doesn't mean that they win for ridic high winrate.  If they were then they would be playing more tables at another site where the highest loyalty level would give RB in the region of >60%. 
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  • ACEGOONERACEGOONER
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    trust an arsenal fan to give an idiot answer......... ill just ignore you For the others my point isnt what they do and beating them and how they play etc!!!!!! its the fac they have like 14 tables open and are not playing hands there ust earning the cash for points and thats the money there earning.....surely you cant agree thats fair? Plus when you have your monster hands you no your never get paided cause there fold, there just there for the points
    Posted by robbie1992
    Your an idiot for not getting that its their money and they can do what they want with it. Plank is an understatement. Its up to you to figure how to overcome it but from what ive seen you havent got a clue.
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  • bearlytherbearlyther
    edited November 2012
    Robbie makes a lot of sense in this post as i have played 50 nl all of last month. 

     It is full of reg nits. There is a couple imo who have some moves but other than that the rest are waiting for premiums or making money from fish in a few hands. They are essential making money from the rakeback imo. I can easily fold qq to a 4 bet allin against some people and there 3 bet range is really narrow aswell which makes it easy to play against. I can 3 bet like crazy at 50nl and get away with it as there is only 2 people on there who will come back over the top of me with a light 4 bet. I enjoy playing against these 2 players as we can make moves against each other. Im not saying theres anything wrong with them playing to make money from the rakeback but its not proper poker and is very exploitable.  I made £1700 from this level last month and £1000 from rakeback so it is still very beatable imo but imo 100nl is more profitable than 50nl as there is more recreational players who like to take a shot here.  But 50 nl is a lot different on sky compared to other sites and can definately get boring at times because of the style of play.

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  • beanehbeaneh
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    what lambert said, Rake system is fine the way it is... leave it be please.   The "Regs" at 50nl are not crushing and its easy to get some simple reads on them and win a good few buyins off them per session just be carefully seat selecting. They make a good table a perfect one if you understand position and table cash flow properly.  Just because they play all day doesn't mean that they win for ridic high winrate.  If they were then they would be playing more tables at another site where the highest loyalty level would give RB in the region of />60%. 
    Posted by TPTP123


    the rake system is the opposite of fine. 

    everything else you've said is true, just the first line is wrong.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    Robbie makes a lot of sense in this post as i have played 50 nl all of last month.   It is full of reg nits. There is a couple imo who have some moves but other than that the rest are waiting for premiums or making money from fish in a few hands. They are essential making money from the rakeback imo. I can easily fold qq to a 4 bet allin against some people and there 3 bet range is really narrow aswell which makes it easy to play against. I can 3 bet like crazy at 50nl and get away with it as there is only 2 people on there who will come back over the top of me with a light 4 bet. I enjoy playing against these 2 players as we can make moves against each other. Im not saying theres anything wrong with them playing to make money from the rakeback but its not proper poker and is very exploitable.  I made £1700 from this level last month and £1000 from rakeback so it is still very beatable imo but imo 100nl is more profitable than 50nl as there is more recreational players who like to take a shot here.  But 50 nl is a lot different on sky compared to other sites and can definately get boring at times because of the style of play.
    Posted by bearlyther
    But you've summed it up here by saying that they are very exploitable and easy to play against. If you can't adjust to beat them, you shuoldn't be having a go at their style of play, you should be figuring out why they keep beating you.

    If they don't keep beating you, then don't post complaining about them cos that's what's winning you money.

    (That doesn't apply to you Bearly, I know you wouldn't moan about people being nitty cos you're a good player).

    P.S. You got set up with your stable yet?
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  • robbie1992robbie1992
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    Robbie makes a lot of sense in this post as i have played 50 nl all of last month.   It is full of reg nits. There is a couple imo who have some moves but other than that the rest are waiting for premiums or making money from fish in a few hands. They are essential making money from the rakeback imo. I can easily fold qq to a 4 bet allin against some people and there 3 bet range is really narrow aswell which makes it easy to play against. I can 3 bet like crazy at 50nl and get away with it as there is only 2 people on there who will come back over the top of me with a light 4 bet. I enjoy playing against these 2 players as we can make moves against each other. Im not saying theres anything wrong with them playing to make money from the rakeback but its not proper poker and is very exploitable.  I made £1700 from this level last month and £1000 from rakeback so it is still very beatable imo but imo 100nl is more profitable than 50nl as there is more recreational players who like to take a shot here.  But 50 nl is a lot different on sky compared to other sites and can definately get boring at times because of the style of play.
    Posted by bearlyther
    Yeah tbh you was the player i was talking about that mentioned ho bad 50 nl was.  Im not saying they cant do what they want with there money of course im not but im saying the way they play and there idea of getting money just from rake isnt fair on the people that have come to play poker, its like watching the same film every day playing on some 50nl tables, thats all im saying.  

    BTW BEARLYTHER, good luck at the stable your joining hope it goes well :)never hesistate to pm and let me no how its going !
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  • beanehbeaneh
    edited November 2012
    ldo people can improve or look to beat each other.


    this thread was started because there are so many people playing 12 tables and not giving any action other than AA pre(godam 30 tablers). it is exascerbated by the fact that the rake is split dealt not contriubuted. if you reduced the amount of rakeback people got for sitting and folding for a month, they would have to reasses whether playing 12 tables is best for them. if it dropped them down to 6 tables and they played half as many hands again as they normally do on these tables then that would benefit the games both in terms of people playing for fun and having people to actually play against and in terms of dem suits getting more of dem rakes.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2012
    But that's the point, it isn't unfair at all, would you rather they play a very strong loose aggresive game and give you a real hard time OR do you want them to be easily exploitable? Or do you just want them to be massive fish, cos obv we'd all love that but it aint gonna happen.

    Forget about how you WANT to play, if you're not willing to say 'I wanna play like this but it doesn't work against these nit grinders so I'm going to do X', then you need to go play another game where your style will work.
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  • TPTP123TPTP123
    edited November 2012
    There could be worse things in life here imo

    - When they double up the money stays on the table. They are not ratholing
    - Most of them autopilot soo badly that the money they make from rakeback they plough back into the 50nl economy
    - They are creating profit for sky the poker
    - They also do not utilise seat selection as they're playing every table
    - There's less than 4 super solid 50nl regs.. the rest moved up already
    - If you want to play higher stakes you need to learn how to adjust against regs, 
    - if you want to pick up money off the floor play lower. 

    So in summary the regs are not killing the games.. and theres much worse regs out there on the big sites then the sky poker regs (and these are the ones killing the games) not our good folk!! now lock thread please. thanks

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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop
    edited November 2012
    Just play late at night theres less regs and drunk nutters who like to go crazy.
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  • GELDYGELDY
    edited November 2012
    and deunk regs like me - hic
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  • beanehbeaneh
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    There could be worse things in life here imo - When they double up the money stays on the table. They are not ratholing - Most of them autopilot soo badly that the money they make from rakeback they plough back into the 50nl economy - They are creating profit for sky the poker - They also do not utilise seat selection as they're playing every table - There's less than 4 super solid 50nl regs.. the rest moved up already - If you want to play higher stakes you need to learn how to adjust against regs,  - if you want to pick up money off the floor play lower.  So in summary the regs are not killing the games.. and theres much worse regs out there on the big sites then the sky poker regs (and these are the ones killing the games) not our good folk!! now lock thread please. thanks
    Posted by TPTP123

    why does there being worse things mean we should suck it up with a stupid system?


    the bulk of your discussion deserves to be in the clinic, not in a thread talking about the unfair and ignorant (yes those are the two applicable words) rakeback distribution system.

    then again there are worse things, we could just get rid of C4P .....


    Nl50 is not the only level to struggle from people who just sit and fold, look at the list of names that join all nl200+ waiting lists and then sit out when they get the option of a seat, all of these people are the sort of people sucking dry the rakeback whilst providing horrible game atmospheres for those who just want to play. 


    It's not just the rake back system, this just has a large influence on the play style all these people use.


    There are many others issues, lots of which i've addressed before, 

    such as HU bumhunting (main problem being morons who sit at 25 tables on sky headsup and never play) 

    disgusting etiquette, I don't need to name the people who try and break 6 max games begging the 'fish' to play them hu so the other regs at the 6 max table cant get their money

    disgusting etiquette, where the regs tell the other players what they think of them, how bad they think they are etc etc

    refusal to start tables with any one who can tie their shoes

    disgusting etiquette (oh hi there again), 6 player game, player a is providing the action player B-F are sitting folding, going all in pre with AA and focusing exclusively on player A. Player A loses a stack, players B-F tick sitout straight away and refuse to play unless Player A reloads........

    disgusting etiquette (oh really there is more, shock), the idiots who sit at a new 1 man 6 max table with a reg, then sit on their direct left, tick sit out and wait for a 'fish' to sit in.


    I could go on but the most important thing to be taken from this thread IS THAT THE RAKE SYSTEM MUST CHANGE. 


    ABSOLUTELY MUST. Unless ofcourse sky are trying to foster an evironment where the games can just wither away.
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  • bearlytherbearlyther
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games? : But you've summed it up here by saying that they are very exploitable and easy to play against. If you can't adjust to beat them, you shuoldn't be having a go at their style of play, you should be figuring out why they keep beating you. If they don't keep beating you, then don't post complaining about them cos that's what's winning you money. (That doesn't apply to you Bearly, I know you wouldn't moan about people being nitty cos you're a good player). P.S. You got set up with your stable yet?
    Posted by Lambert180
    Yes all set up with the stable now Lambert enjoying it playing on here and also ps France only played a few games on there so far considering playing a few tourneys on the new site fult aswell.  Reviewing my hands after my tournaments is a great way for me to improve.  At the moment im allowed to play any tournament i want up to £55 or euro and im allowed to play 50nl and below in cash games on sky. No hyperturbos is allowed in the contract.
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  • TPTP123TPTP123
    edited November 2012
    There could be worse things in life here imo then Regs playing 50nl all day on every table. That's all i have to say; at no point was that post referring to sky rake. The points you make are points that plague all the sites... good luck getting the system changed. 
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  • beanehbeaneh
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    There could be worse things in life here imo then Regs playing 50nl all day on every table. That's all i have to say. The points you make are points that plague all the sites... good luck getting the system changed. 
    Posted by TPTP123
    no say more lol

    you clearly have a good idea of the poker ecosystem and the problems it faces.


    dealt distribution is moronic and so inhibitive. 


    Ofc there are a tonne of problems to fix both with poker sites in general and sky specifically. but this is one of the utmost importance and should be addressed before nearly anything else. especially before just having another rake race promotion where the idea is to get as many regs as possible playing as many tables as possible and folding as much as possible all month.


    those who play regularly will have noticed how appaling the games were in January and in October when the big rake races were run.
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  • TPTP123TPTP123
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games? : no say more lol you clearly have a good idea of the poker ecosystem and the problems it faces. dealt distribution is moronic and so inhibitive.  Ofc there are a tonne of problems to fix both with poker sites in general and sky specifically. but this is one of the utmost importance and should be addressed before nearly anything else. especially before just having another rake race promotion where the idea is to get as many regs as possible playing as many tables as possible and folding as much as possible all month. those who play regularly will have noticed how appaling the games were in January and in October when the big rake races were run.

    Okay i will... I didn't play any cash poker on sky in October. That worked well for me. 

    ;p)

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  • D_LegendD_Legend
    edited November 2012

    big +1 i think i shamefull the way the less skilled play leaves and the game breaks shows a real lack of respect.

    and broadline collusion  


    but i think the main reason from this is the fact that sky is such a gated sited with poorish rakesystem. but who can blame the reg they found a gap and exploting it but isn't that what beening a pro is attacking on weakness ??????  

    but one thing u have to remmber is when competition or money is evoled some people will do any thing to win. there is none or little space for sentiment, they will do the cheapest thing to win or get a egde

    famous angles shoot from Ivan Freitez Angle shows that. 

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  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG
    edited November 2012
    Gotta say, i have seen exactly what Beaneh describes when railing 200nl +

    Its soooooo blatant. The same nit regs just sit out as soon as the recreational player leaves (usually broke). There is always a huge waiting list ready to pounce too,. I have always felt a bit uncomfortable watching this, time and time again!





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  • DeuceAK_47DeuceAK_47
    edited November 2012
    IMO getting rid of cash for point's and HU tables completely would be the best thing for the site in the long term. (rake races and happy hours defiantly don't help the situation.)
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  • beanehbeaneh
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    Gotta say, i have seen exactly what Beaneh describes when railing 200nl + Its soooooo blatant. The same nit regs just sit out as soon as the recreational player leaves (usually broke). There is always a huge waiting list ready to pounce too,. I have always felt a bit uncomfortable watching this, time and time again!
    Posted by GREGHOGG

    people say 'oh but game selection is part of poker' yes yes it is, but if there are to be any games running in future you cant keep not only shearing the sheep, but chopping its head off and chat abusing it's family at the same time!
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  • pomfrittespomfrittes
    edited November 2012


       Beaneh for Prime Minister. Absolutely spot on re contributed rake.

       What happened to the debate/vote organised by Sky a few months ago?
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  • Lambert180Lambert180
    edited November 2012
    Beaneh is the nuts on this forum.
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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games? : why does there being worse things mean we should suck it up with a stupid system? the bulk of your discussion deserves to be in the clinic, not in a thread talking about the unfair and ignorant (yes those are the two applicable words) rakeback distribution system. then again there are worse things, we could just get rid of C4P ..... Nl50 is not the only level to struggle from people who just sit and fold, look at the list of names that join all nl200+ waiting lists and then sit out when they get the option of a seat, all of these people are the sort of people sucking dry the rakeback whilst providing horrible game atmospheres for those who just want to play.  It's not just the rake back system, this just has a large influence on the play style all these people use. There are many others issues, lots of which i've addressed before,  such as HU bumhunting (main problem being morons who sit at 25 tables on sky headsup and never play)  disgusting etiquette, I don't need to name the people who try and break 6 max games begging the 'fish' to play them hu so the other regs at the 6 max table cant get their money disgusting etiquette, where the regs tell the other players what they think of them, how bad they think they are etc etc refusal to start tables with any one who can tie their shoes disgusting etiquette (oh hi there again), 6 player game, player a is providing the action player B-F are sitting folding, going all in pre with AA and focusing exclusively on player A. Player A loses a stack, players B-F tick sitout straight away and refuse to play unless Player A reloads........ disgusting etiquette (oh really there is more, shock), the idiots who sit at a new 1 man 6 max table with a reg, then sit on their direct left, tick sit out and wait for a 'fish' to sit in. I could go on but the most important thing to be taken from this thread IS THAT THE RAKE SYSTEM MUST CHANGE.  ABSOLUTELY MUST. Unless ofcourse sky are trying to foster an evironment where the games can just wither away.
    Posted by beaneh
    I really wish you would stop sitting on the fence ;)


    Love your rants always make me smile.
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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    IMO getting rid of cash for point's and HU tables completely would be the best thing for the site in the long term. (rake races and happy hours defiantly don't help the situation.)
    Posted by DeuceAK_47
    You play most happy hours though don't you??

    You are always sat at my tables.
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  • DeuceAK_47DeuceAK_47
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games? : You play most happy hours though don't you?? You are always sat at my tables.
    Posted by donkeyplop

    Lol I dont particularly try and play happy hours, i just play randomly really :-), I can't really complain as i will probably get to 15000 c4p's this month but the games in Novemeber are defiantly alot worse than in September and i think the Kings of Cash are partly to blame.

    I think if any recreational players played for 2+ hours in October they would of probably of lost money every day, even on fruit machines you win some of the time so i don't know why they would return.
    If sky spent more money on advertising and giving loosing players free money/free tourny's occasionally instead of c4p's i think the site would be a more fun place to play. 

    I also agree with Beaneh that the regs that always move seat to get position on the bad player is terrible etiquette.


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  • IDONKCALLUIDONKCALLU
    edited November 2012
    think u should go on the show beaneh :)
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  • shakinacesshakinaces
    edited November 2012
    Only realised in the last couple of days that the C4P was earned pretty much just for sitting there - Beaneh's argument makes good sense and hopefully Sky are having or will have a look at implementing this.

    Going back to the OP, I moved to Sky after getting fed up of playing on another site that suffers the same thing - sure, I was picking up a small profit by constantly picking up undefended blinds or calling and getting an aces-beating flop, but as a casual player it just gets really dull playing such a robotic game.

    Yeah the super-nits are probably better players than me and will take my money, but at least give me lots of complicated decisions along the way to give me some value for my losses :)
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  • OCD_manOCD_man
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games? : hmmm yeah proberly, but sky has less people then other sites so its constantly the same people.  Others says have thousands so there loads of regs but its unlucky your play the same regs everysignle day
    Posted by robbie1992
    Robbie, some would say that by playing the same "regs" day in and day out you would be better off as you'd have your notes typed up on certian individuals and therefore would have an advantage over them.
    Playing randomes, you dont get this advantage, unitl after youve done your money............
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  • OCD_manOCD_man
    edited November 2012
    In Response to Re: Regs killing cash games?:
    trust an arsenal fan to give an idiot answer......... ill just ignore you For the others my point isnt what they do and beating them and how they play etc!!!!!! its the fac they have like 14 tables open and are not playing hands there ust earning the cash for points and thats the money there earning.....surely you cant agree thats fair? Plus when you have your monster hands you no your never get paided cause there fold, there just there for the points
    Posted by robbie1992
    Are you saying that you think its a given that because your dealt a monster you think you should be getting paid?
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