Get your degree ivan Online poker is an industry in decline. There are way less unique players at 200nl since you played there and the decline shows no sign of stopping. Posted by ajs4385
OK just to re-iterate I am not "not" doing my degree because I want to become a full time poker pro. If I don't finish my degree it will be because of health reasons. I'm looking to find a job atm and I'm mainly looking to get a job in a bookies, as apart from poker, a career in the betting industry is something that I am interested in. I know a degree in Mathematics will help with getting a good entry-level job as opposed to starting out just working in a bookies, but I can still start from the bottom and work up as well.
The poker will just be part time; and as a second source of income. I believe I'm good enough to make a full time living off poker, but I'm also realistic in that unless I get to the point where I'm making a substantial amount per year, then I'm going to need another job because you just can't predict where poker will be in 5/10 years time.
Would love to hear some more input on this though from anyone that is/has been in similar circumstances. Or anyone that has a career in the betting industry!
Out of interest ajs, is poker full/part time for you?
i used to work in a bookies its a great job aslong as u like sports yaself downside u cannot bet in ya bookies with the same firm
but i loved it
gd to get tips tho say ya working and some guy bets £500 on a horse if u got an account with ya phone ipad etc can earn yaself a lil extra money by betting on tips
long hours tho as theres night racing ya be working from 10 am till 9pm most nites so not alot of time for poker bud
I remember when i first signed up to sky and every other week you where crushing some other poor guys soul on tv. Alls i could do was watch in awe sometimes.
Completely understand where you're coming from with some of these things. Not the massive swings playing poker, since I've always been small-fry, but the depression preventing you from coping with studying, etc...
Anyway, I'd like to suggest you have a look at the Open University. They will give you credit for studies elsewhere so you should be able to just finish your third year and pick up your degree. You can study part time and do it across two years if that would be helpful, too. Obviously there are none of the inherent associated costs of regular student life, either.
Financial support is available and the pressure is definitely not the same as other university courses.
I think you need to enrol by September 5th to study this year, for most courses, so if it interests you there's no time to waste. You'll probably need to have a conversation with them before that about transferring credit.
I don't work for them or owt, but I did start a degree with them about five years ago before my own problems brought me to a halt after the first year. I've been looking at going back to it and I would recommend it for people with issues like my own. Have a look. If you don't fancy it, no problem. Just a possible alternative to think about.
In Response to Re: F_Ivanovic 20nl to 100nl reg by the end of 2013 (+ skypoker/lifestory) : OK just to re-iterate I am not "not" doing my degree because I want to become a full time poker pro. If I don't finish my degree it will be because of health reasons. I'm looking to find a job atm and I'm mainly looking to get a job in a bookies, as apart from poker, a career in the betting industry is something that I am interested in. I know a degree in Mathematics will help with getting a good entry-level job as opposed to starting out just working in a bookies, but I can still start from the bottom and work up as well. The poker will just be part time; and as a second source of income. I believe I'm good enough to make a full time living off poker, but I'm also realistic in that unless I get to the point where I'm making a substantial amount per year, then I'm going to need another job because you just can't predict where poker will be in 5/10 years time. Would love to hear some more input on this though from anyone that is/has been in similar circumstances. Or anyone that has a career in the betting industry! Out of interest ajs, is poker full/part time for you? Posted by F_Ivanovic
I went pro half way through 2009. So been my only income for about 4 years.
First year or two was great loved it. Printing money playing well loving the game.
Just got fed up of sitting up to stupid oclock pressing three buttons.
I probably only average 15 hours a week these days. Got no desire to play and when I do I have one eye on car forums or tv.
Most stressful job I have ever had. I have had stomach problems, sleep problems, repetitive strain injury due to it.
However, plus point is I made a fair bit over years and I am at a stage where all my basic living costs are taken care of and any poker winnings is just spending money to me. Which is a good job cos I dont make much these days.
In Response to Re: F_Ivanovic 20nl to 100nl reg by the end of 2013 (+ skypoker/lifestory) : I went pro half way through 2009. So been my only income for about 4 years. First year or two was great loved it. Printing money playing well loving the game. Just got fed up of sitting up to stupid oclock pressing three buttons. I probably only average 15 hours a week these days. Got no desire to play and when I do I have one eye on car forums or tv. Most stressful job I have ever had. I have had stomach problems, sleep problems, repetitive strain injury due to it. However, plus point is I made a fair bit over years and I am at a stage where all my basic living costs are taken care of and any poker winnings is just spending money to me. Which is a good job cos I dont make much these days. Posted by ajs4385
Really good post.
I think so many people are under the illusion that 'going pro' is the dream job.
The pressure of having no other source of income would be terrifying for me.
Full time job and a nice side income from poker suits me just fine
Terrible afternoon, down £200. Haven't played terribly I don't think apart from a few questionable plays that were somewhat costly. Might post some hand histories in a bit of my losing pots to see where I went wrong.
OK reviewed my hand history with my losses that were over £10. Apart from 2/3 hands (which I'll post below) every single one was some sort of cooler. I only had 2 hands where I won over £10 and 10 hands where I lost over £10!! The coolers included set over set, TP+FD vs set and not hitting, 2 pair against set in 3bet pot, runner runner straight, KK vs AA and KK's getting cracked by top 2 pair.
So in hand 1 I made a thin value raise on the flop and continued OTT. It looks like I have so few value combos (like only 55 as I rarely slow play AA/KK/AK pre) so I expected him to look me up lightly on flop and turn with worse Aces and Kx hands. I think he probably folds river to a half pot size with his bluff catching hands so decide to make it look as bluffy as possible; unfortunately I ran into KK! I think my play was a slight mistake though as lambert hadn't been raising that much so he probably has more strong hands than bluff catchers.
Hand 2 is an abomination. I was confident his c-bet was 2 overs so I decided to float. Then the A came on the turn and he bombs and I'm sure he has AJ-AK and I decide to float again because I reckon he'll check back the river and I had planned to shove to represent a 6. River is the best bluffing card because it also completes the 78 straight. So now I've got here I have to follow through and he time banks down and calls last second. Surpring call because I rarely have a bluff in this spot but perhaps he thought my overbet looked bluffy.
Hand 3 isn't great either. It's clear when he bets 3/4 turn and then calls a raise he probably doesn't have a hand that's going to fold to a river bet.
In hand 1 do you think your ever getting called by worse or are you turning your hand into a bluff? Posted by Donttelmum
lol, explained above. I thought I might have done. Couple of days back Lambert hero called me with TT on AKJTx (3 spades) when I made a massive overbet and shoved river (wrong that time though!) so I definitely thought him capable of hero calling Kx or worse Ax
In Response to Re: F_Ivanovic 20nl to 100nl reg by the end of 2013 (+ skypoker/lifestory) : lol, explained above. I thought I might have done. Couple of days back Lambert hero called me with TT on AKJTx (3 spades) when I made a massive overbet and shoved river (wrong that time though!) so I definitely thought him capable of hero calling Kx or worse Ax Posted by F_Ivanovic
Yo!
Yeah that was just a cooler, I did pop into the chatbox to say unlucky but you were probably grinding away.
You had been caught out bluffing a river V me earlier in this session too.
In hand 3 I think raising the turn is pretty bad imo as your only really repping 5x & possibly the flopped straight. I think you likely raise the flop with all sets, 2 pair and the flopped straight sometimes as it's really wet and a lot of turn cards could slow down further action.
I have played a bit with this villain as well recently and they're a bit of a station to say the least, but i'm sure you've got a few notes of your own now so just need to run better next session ay.
Quick question regarding your sessions, do you have a stop loss or do you just stop if you feel your not playing very well?
Yeah I saw after a bit you had said unlucky, wasn't sure what hand you were reffering too! It was definitely marginal. Normally it would be a cooler but I did think the whole table was playing tight so I shouldn't expect you too have too many worse Ax or worse Kx that would call anyway.
@foldufairy: Yeah, hand 3 I wasn't happy with at all. Probably the least well played hand. Even though hand 2 looks a bit spewy I think with the whole range of hands I have there it should be a +ev play. re. stop loss. Haven't got a specific stop loss but definitely if I feel I'm not playing very well I usually stop playing. In that session I didn't feel I was playing badly but didn't feel I was playing great either, so that's why I decided to quit once £200 down.
Only had half an hour break or so though and then decided to play omaha instead this time. Both ran and played a lot better this time and playing 2 tables I made 6BI's (@10p/20p) so now only down £60 for the day. Had 7 pots where I won more than £10, this was my favourite:
Player
Action
Cards
Amount
Pot
Balance
Small blind
£0.20
£0.20
£13.28
F_Ivanovic
Big blind
£0.20
£0.40
£53.45
Your hole cards
4
6
3
7
mwstachio
Raise
£0.80
£1.20
£35.20
pappa1949
Call
£0.80
£2.00
£14.61
lescrouper
Call
£0.80
£2.80
£17.97
Destiny33
Call
£0.80
£3.60
£19.30
Fold
F_Ivanovic
Raise
£3.20
£6.80
£50.25
mwstachio
Call
£2.60
£9.40
£32.60
pappa1949
Call
£2.60
£12.00
£12.01
lescrouper
Fold
Destiny33
Call
£2.60
£14.60
£16.70
Flop
7
3
2
F_Ivanovic
Bet
£8.20
£22.80
£42.05
mwstachio
Fold
pappa1949
Fold
Destiny33
All-in
£16.70
£39.50
£0.00
F_Ivanovic
Call
£8.50
£48.00
£33.55
F_Ivanovic
Show
4
6
3
7
Destiny33
Show
J
10
6
10
Turn
7
River
K
F_Ivanovic
Win
Full House, 7s and 3s
£46.20
£79.75
Only had 2 pots this time with losses over £10. One of them I probably made a minor mistake, the other was just a bad beat!
Player
Action
Cards
Amount
Pot
Balance
mwstachio
Small blind
£0.20
£0.20
£19.40
pappa1949
Big blind
£0.20
£0.40
£11.29
Your hole cards
J
Q
J
Q
lescrouper
Call
£0.20
£0.60
£25.69
Destiny33
Fold
Call
£0.20
£0.80
£10.69
F_Ivanovic
Raise
£1.20
£2.00
£61.70
mwstachio
Fold
pappa1949
Call
£1.00
£3.00
£10.29
lescrouper
Fold
Call
£1.00
£4.00
£9.69
Flop
6
10
9
pappa1949
Check
Bet
£1.00
£5.00
£8.69
F_Ivanovic
Raise
£4.00
£9.00
£57.70
pappa1949
Fold
Call
£3.00
£12.00
£5.69
Turn
5
Check
F_Ivanovic
Bet
£6.00
£18.00
£51.70
All-in
£5.69
£23.69
£0.00
F_Ivanovic
Unmatched bet
£0.31
£23.38
£52.01
Show
A
6
7
3
F_Ivanovic
Show
J
Q
J
Q
River
3
Win
Flush to the Ace
£22.21
£22.21
edit: weird, the name of villain in hand 2 I had to remove because it said "please edit or remove the following word(s) then resubmit your content: kr aut
Hey man.just glanced over your thread previously,but really got into it today.Really interestin read m8.Some crazy levels that I know I'll never see.Good luck in your efforts.
I started a post on this thread a couple days ago and right before I was finished skypoker came up to tell me about a tournament; I tried to click "Done" but the screen froze!! Was so annoying as I'd typed out quite a lot. Couldn't be bothered writing it out again at the time but will do so now (albeit much briefer than last time)
Anyway; as if my own problems weren't enough my parents are getting a divorce after 25 years together. Won't go into why but it was really quite shocking. My mum suffers from depression as well and so now I'm making sure she's OK whilst looking for a job as well. No idea what's happening with my uni course yet as have yet to hear from them whether I can re-do it next year.
I think with everything that was going on, I ended up playing poker completely in the wrong frame of mind and my BR took a hit down to £800. However I decided to take a shot at 25/50 PL omaha on a really weak table and knew there was profit to be made. After an unlucky start where I got into a 4bet pot with AA and flopped the nuts on an AT9 board but then got 3 outered by someone holding KQ otr (Both players called my flop shove drawing almost dead) I ended up finishing almost £300 up with my BR back to £1060. C4P took me up to £1360 but not had the best of starts to this month. Currently down £80 so my BR is at £1260. Not a major loss though and I'm going to aim to get up to £1500 by the end of this week.
I played a few tournaments last night. The premiership free-roll I had a decent run and finished just outside cashing. The turbo open I had a bad start when I called a shortie shove with AQ then didn't pick up any hands in ages and just went out meakly. The mini-event I was really annoyed about though. I had a fantastic start and after an hour and a half or so I was sitting nicely in 4th. But then I was coolered/over-valued AK. I 3bet someone who then min-4bet me. I was a tad worried but convinced myself they could easily have the same hand or QQ/JJ and decided to shove. End result gave them the chip lead and me back down to average. Not too long later though I'd gone out without cashing and only £10 in bounties to show for it. (which is unusual for me - usually I build up chip stacks in BH's without ever getting a bounty!!)
Anyway, I'm back to just playing 20nl. I have a BR now for 30nl but I'm going to take it steady and not rush anything. That being said if a juciy PL omaha game appears I don't know if I'll be able to resist. Higher variance than holdem but definitely more profitable if you know what you're doing!!
I must say, it seems strange not playing 30NL cos you're taking it steady but playing PLO50 which is higher stakes AND higher variance, but I'm sure you know what you're doing
I've had a bit of a rubbish start to the month so far, was a couple of BIs up but then just got completely destroyed yesterday. KK into AA pre 3 times... flopped a set of Js and a set of Qs and both times GII v a set of Aces lol and just incapable of holding when I GII v FDs or getting there when I GII with FDs and overs. Basically pretty much evert pot />50xBB went against me lol. I'm sure I'll turn it round though.
I've been told my blog should be uploaded tomorrow btw
haha yeah I know. Problem is at 30nl there's often too many regs at the table. I don't mind playing vs regs at all and will regularly play tables with you but when the regs there are the nitty ones I just find it too boring. Omaha on the other hand is far from boring; and if the table is nitty you can go wild and get away with it as it's profitable. eg. I 4bet some DS semi-rundown hand and run into AAxx... no big deal, the 4-bet wins outright pre-flop the majority of the time and getting it in vs AAxx is +ev. But going wild against nits (especially only 100bb) deep in holdem is just not profitable. You can't 4bet-bluff and call off cause your equity just sucks!! And you can't 4bet light for value because you always run into the nuts :P
Like I said as well I'll only jump into a omaha table though if it seems really good. And I'm not playing the above style I mentioned either - just nitting it up and only playing super premium hands. Reduces the variance somewhat but still massively profitable. You should definitely give omaha a try sometime!! (although preferably only if you know the rules, which I guess you do :P) - had someone yesterday who thought having 1 diamond on their hand and 4 on the board gave them a flush. They then asked in the chatbox "how did I lose that hand" - to which I acted dumb! (mainly because they were absolutely killing me. They were running super super hot and I was losing every pot.) Few hands later I have a straight flush and POT raise them on the river. They call with a bare Ac on a 4 flush board!!
Ouch, that sounds like how I was running the other week. Looking forward to you finally uploading the blog, tis' about time!!
Yeah I know the rules of PLO, I know how to play generally speaking but I know hardly anything when it comes to strat and I'm not even that knowledgable about basic stuff like starting hand selection other than we ideally want lots of nut making hands and multiple good NLHE type hands so I dunno like AKJT DS.
I've been thinking abuot looking into it properly though to have a game to fall back on and when, like you, I just CBA with the nits at NLHE. I also know a few players who find it far more profitable than NLHE cos it's just so much harder/people don't know how to play so solid and unexploitably like NLHE. Maybe you could gimme a few pointers if you're feeling generous
I want to be blunt so apologies if I am off the mark and not appreciative enough of the problems you have in completing it but the degree absolutely has to come first.
If you cannot finish your degree what confidence do you have that the same problems won't affect your poker at some stage
you should regard the degree as part of your brm -until you have it you should restrict the poker you will play. You need to have some strong discipline.
Running away is not a long term solution
It is as if you are deep in a big mtt
you are already in the cash with a decent stack
but you leave because there is a girl you fancy waiting for you
I know people who have had major health problems while doing their degrees. Mental and physical. But they persevered, just, and are eternally grateful for having done so.
The lone of "I've known other people who were able to achieve <such and such a thing> in similar circumstances to you" is just about the worst thing you can say to someone suffering depression. Just so you know.
The lone of "I've known other people who were able to achieve <such and such a thing /> in similar circumstances to you" is just about the worst thing you can say to someone suffering depression. Just so you know. Posted by BorinLoner
Based on my experiences I would disagree. But if some are thinking that I apologise. My point is that i am not saying this in a vacuum, I do have some direct experience of the situation. The depression aspect I cannot help with. The prioritisation of goals in that situation I think is worth mentioning.
Good interesting story F_Ivanovic, i also read it all, this story reminds me of myself but the difference wasnt poker but the arcades then later on in life at the casinos.
I first started to play poker on facebook and one night a few years ago or so i c this guy F_Ivanovic playing high stakes poker on tv, it was skypokers "top of the pots", i rem some certain situations where he would insanely jam to bluff or buy pot and im thinking this guys mad, must b loaded to do things like that and would def b hard to predict lol.
Then like 6 months or so i c him in 20nl and im thinking is this that guy i c all them years ago? well i didnt ask as i wasnt sure.
I think it was shortly after watching skypokers interactive channel did i open by account on skypoker.
Anyways hope F_Ivanovic u get your degrees and get to your target at the higher stakes, of which ill c u on tv again -_-
@ Geldy: I posted a reply to ajs in this thread wrt playing poker for a living; in short, it's not what I intend to do. I'm fully aware that playing full time poker will be stressful and could potentially trigger my depression again especially if I go on a big downswing. That's why it's not something I'll be doing in the near future. I would only consider it if:
a) It's going incredibly well AND
b) I've made a lot of progress in handling depression and don't believe it's going to affect me in case I get a poker downswing.
I also posted about the degree. I do want to be able to finish it and am going to try and be in a position next year where I can finish it. But if not, it's not going to be the end of the world.
And yeah Borin's right; I'm not mad at you though! Right now I'm feeling OK but if I was in a depressive state it wouldn't help me! I'm sure there are plenty of people with mental health/physical difficulties that have tried to persevere through it and have regretted it. If I hadn't met my girlfriend + plenty of other friends over the past 2 years I probably would have regret trying to continue with University as the 2 years "wasted" could have been used getting a job and going on in a different direction in my life.
Hi, Your last post went a bit bonkers and left a popup with the hand history all over the page - Mods can't edit posts so hopefully this repost will fix it... Mod_Machka
Decent night tonight only £70 away from my previous goal of reaching £1.5k by the end of my week. Profit all came playing omaha. Played 2 tables of 20PL and 1 of 50PL. Ran up 3 BI's on one 20PL table, broke even on the other and won almost 2.5 BI's on the 50PL. I played too long probably - the last hour or so I was just too tired and was just playing really tight because couldn't be bothered thinking too hard!!
Ah thanks. Yeah I don't know why sometimes the hand histories work fine and other times they come out all weird!! Was going to add to my post just saying that this hand can show just how sick/high variance omaha can be!! Should really have left the table when I got 200bb deep with someone but had planned on staying out of his way. Obviously can't fold pre though even though it was pretty obvious we both had AA. Sick runout!
hand one in a vacume will look very strange but against a reg (whose game you know well) makes a lot of sense, DTM wont understand because he's never took anything else but an ABC line in his life.
Good read btw, take AJS word on board though! I wasnt into poker back when sky was as soft but herd stories of it being just insane which will explain a lot of your massive upswings.
Not a day goes by where i dont spot a new guy multi tabling 50-100nl, it sickens me!
Please go bust so your not someone else making my day tougher!
In Response to Re: F_Ivanovic 20nl to 100nl reg by the end of 2013 (+ skypoker/lifestory) : I take advice from many people about my game bolly but you defo aint one of them. Keep tilting your life away at 0.50/1 you keyboard warrior. Posted by Donttelmum
Bolly would OWN your soul in a heads up session dude!
Comments
Anyway, I'd like to suggest you have a look at the Open University. They will give you credit for studies elsewhere so you should be able to just finish your third year and pick up your degree. You can study part time and do it across two years if that would be helpful, too. Obviously there are none of the inherent associated costs of regular student life, either.
Financial support is available and the pressure is definitely not the same as other university courses.
I think you need to enrol by September 5th to study this year, for most courses, so if it interests you there's no time to waste. You'll probably need to have a conversation with them before that about transferring credit.
Open University
I don't work for them or owt, but I did start a degree with them about five years ago before my own problems brought me to a halt after the first year. I've been looking at going back to it and I would recommend it for people with issues like my own. Have a look. If you don't fancy it, no problem. Just a possible alternative to think about.
First year or two was great loved it. Printing money playing well loving the game.
Just got fed up of sitting up to stupid oclock pressing three buttons.
I probably only average 15 hours a week these days. Got no desire to play and when I do I have one eye on car forums or tv.
Most stressful job I have ever had. I have had stomach problems, sleep problems, repetitive strain injury due to it.
However, plus point is I made a fair bit over years and I am at a stage where all my basic living costs are taken care of and any poker winnings is just spending money to me. Which is a good job cos I dont make much these days.
Terrible afternoon, down £200. Haven't played terribly I don't think apart from a few questionable plays that were somewhat costly. Might post some hand histories in a bit of my losing pots to see where I went wrong.
OK reviewed my hand history with my losses that were over £10. Apart from 2/3 hands (which I'll post below) every single one was some sort of cooler. I only had 2 hands where I won over £10 and 10 hands where I lost over £10!! The coolers included set over set, TP+FD vs set and not hitting, 2 pair against set in 3bet pot, runner runner straight, KK vs AA and KK's getting cracked by top 2 pair.
Hand 2 is an abomination. I was confident his c-bet was 2 overs so I decided to float. Then the A came on the turn and he bombs and I'm sure he has AJ-AK and I decide to float again because I reckon he'll check back the river and I had planned to shove to represent a 6. River is the best bluffing card because it also completes the 78 straight. So now I've got here I have to follow through and he time banks down and calls last second. Surpring call because I rarely have a bluff in this spot but perhaps he thought my overbet looked bluffy.
Hand 3 isn't great either. It's clear when he bets 3/4 turn and then calls a raise he probably doesn't have a hand that's going to fold to a river bet.
Yeah that was just a cooler, I did pop into the chatbox to say unlucky but you were probably grinding away.
You had been caught out bluffing a river V me earlier in this session too.
I think you likely raise the flop with all sets, 2 pair and the flopped straight sometimes as it's really wet and a lot of turn cards could slow down further action.
I have played a bit with this villain as well recently and they're a bit of a station to say the least, but i'm sure you've got a few notes of your own now so just need to run better next session ay.
Quick question regarding your sessions, do you have a stop loss or do you just stop if you feel your not playing very well?
Yeah I saw after a bit you had said unlucky, wasn't sure what hand you were reffering too! It was definitely marginal. Normally it would be a cooler but I did think the whole table was playing tight so I shouldn't expect you too have too many worse Ax or worse Kx that would call anyway.
@foldufairy: Yeah, hand 3 I wasn't happy with at all. Probably the least well played hand. Even though hand 2 looks a bit spewy I think with the whole range of hands I have there it should be a +ev play. re. stop loss. Haven't got a specific stop loss but definitely if I feel I'm not playing very well I usually stop playing. In that session I didn't feel I was playing badly but didn't feel I was playing great either, so that's why I decided to quit once £200 down.
Only had half an hour break or so though and then decided to play omaha instead this time. Both ran and played a lot better this time and playing 2 tables I made 6BI's (@10p/20p) so now only down £60 for the day. Had 7 pots where I won more than £10, this was my favourite:
Love a crazy poker story.
All the best with the job search !
and GL with the poker.
Sure you'll be at 25.50 in no time.
I must say, it seems strange not playing 30NL cos you're taking it steady but playing PLO50 which is higher stakes AND higher variance, but I'm sure you know what you're doing
I've had a bit of a rubbish start to the month so far, was a couple of BIs up but then just got completely destroyed yesterday. KK into AA pre 3 times... flopped a set of Js and a set of Qs and both times GII v a set of Aces lol and just incapable of holding when I GII v FDs or getting there when I GII with FDs and overs. Basically pretty much evert pot />50xBB went against me lol. I'm sure I'll turn it round though.
I've been told my blog should be uploaded tomorrow btw
I've been thinking abuot looking into it properly though to have a game to fall back on and when, like you, I just CBA with the nits at NLHE. I also know a few players who find it far more profitable than NLHE cos it's just so much harder/people don't know how to play so solid and unexploitably like NLHE. Maybe you could gimme a few pointers if you're feeling generous
Sort that degree out lol.
GL at the tables pal
First: 26/6/2009
Last: 4/9/2013
Hand History #687034939 (21:43 04/09/2013)