Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal

david666

Depressing to see so many naysayers feeling compelled to give their opinion, shouldn't we be trying to encourge new players to take up the game.

All the best with your challenge pokernoon, and hopefully you enjoy yourself along the way.

GaryQQQ

Clearly this is a very ambitious target for a newcomer. Three ingredients are required to have a chance of success; natural ability, many hours of hard work, the dedication to maintain a high volume through the festive season.

I'd say that the sports betting background is a good indicator of natural ability. Whether or not the other two requirements are in place will soon become apparent.

Good luck PokerNoon!

waller02

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : Sorry, cc: carbon copy, copy me in, send it on!
Posted by bbMike

+1 lol

PokerNoon

Thanks to all for your comments so far - even the negative posters. I still appreciate you taking the time to contribute.

Lambert nailed it really. Yes I accept that it's a big goal to set, probably even unrealistic. However in general I like to set myself goals that are a real stretch. Not impossible, but the goals require a lot of work, focus and dedication. Then I make myself as publicly accountable as possible (this thread, telling as many people as I can) in order to keep me on track when I'm tempted to get lazy.

At no point did I say 'I've cashed in 2 DYMs in a row so I'm a professional poker player'. It was just a comment that 2 losses into 2 wins is something I see as a positive. Could just be luck. But I'd rather see it as progress. Seeing progress keeps me fired up and motivated, so I try to make the most of every small win that I can.

Before I get on with today's update, first of all I want to say thanks to all the people on here who have gone out of their way to really take time out to help me with this challenge. I was half expecting to get flamed to death when I posted this, so it's nice to see a generally positive response. 

Special thanks go to:

DoubleAAA: Spent a good 2 hours on Skype with this helpful chap this morning. Watched me play in a DYM and talked me through some leaks in my game. Also let me watch him play and destroy the competition. Inspiring. Admittedly it wasn't a totally selfless act on his part - in return I gave him the nuts and bolts of my trading routine. But still all round extremely useful stuff.

Jac35: Took the time to send a long PM last night with some helpful DYM stuff. Most useful was simply the advice to take notes on players, which I've been doing today. When hands get to showdown I've gotten value from going into the hand history and taking notes on what players open with, what they will call/raise with etc. Particularly the number of people who are willing to open limp UTG with utter garbage. 

Lambert180: No specific one on one advice but he keeps on posting really helpful, in depth, value-add insights on my threads. I could tell straight away that this guy knows his stuff.

Sorry to anyone I've missed out here - all the help I've received so far is genuinely much appreciated.

Anyway, today's update:

Mixed day. Played 6 £5.50 DYMs, only cashed in 2. Didn't have the best luck in places (3Ks vs flush on river, 7 high straight vs 8 high straight etc). That said I don't know if I played those situations as well as I could. Yes I had made hands but on both occasions it was against opponents who were fairly passive then suddenly put in fairly chunky bets when their hands became made. On both times I thought 'he's got the flush here'/'he might have the higher straight here' but still allowed myself to either call an all-in bet or raise-all in myself.

Also I had 3K's by the flop. I was tempted to raise all in here, but wanted to squeeze as much value as possible out of the guy. I was aware there was a flush draw there but I thought the chances of him actually being on that draw and then hitting were unlikely. However calling him down then going all in by the river allowed him to catch up. 

Interested to know what you think about my plays here. Currently I'm unsure of two things:

- You have a made hand by the flop. If you go all in he will very likely fold. You want to squeeze more chips out of him but you don't want him to catch up. What do you do?

- You have the 7 high straight by the river but you know he could have a 8+high straight and he's acting strong with a pot sized bet. Do you allow yourself to go all in or do you play super tight and let him have the pot if he goes all in first?

BR went down a bit so dropped to £3.30 and cashed. Thought I'd try a standard SnG so played a £0.55 one and won that. 

Tomorrow I'll continue working the DYMs but also investigate standard SnGs a little more. I enjoy these games more than DYMs and it may well be that my ROI ends up being better. Not sure right now. What I do know is that sometimes playing DYMs is about as much fun as a chilli enema when you get around the bubble...they just will not end! 

cgoldie

Hi,

First off i'm going to say this target is going to be difficult purely due to volume. While you can get decent ish volume playing 3.30-5.50, 11+ the volume just isn't there even on bigger sites. The site with the biggest volume of DYM's closed them down due to widespread collusion.

£50 a day is certainly acheivable but you would have to put in a lot of volume at the 5-11 stakes that would require you probably playing atleast 8 hours a day with 9+ tables. Even then you would require a very solid winrate, 10%+ is really hard to acheive for even seasoned players these days.

That said if you want to start getting towards that goal you need to first master ICM, get some software and set it up for a DYM payout structure and master your push fold ranges. Once your really good with ICM (not the easiest task) your going to have to learn when to and when not to rely on ICM late game due to other gameplay factors. You need to definetly learn to play atleast 6 tables at a time, probably more to achieve your goal.

I think DYM's are a good place to start and learn solid tight agressive play and late game push/fold situations. However if your serious about making a living from poker DYM's probably isn't the best area long term. I'd reccomend spending a month playing and grind out 500+ games and then move to MTT's, turbo SNG's or cash where you can find good volume at the higher levels to make a living.

spinky6108

Good luck with this been trying to do something similar myself but with no success so far but i will get there but its going to take longer than i hoped. The rake in the DYMS is high  and eats into your profits. Watch out if you play in the afternoons ive found some really good players on then who do make money consitantly playing £5 and £11 DYMs.

Ive also read your blog fasinating reading would love to get into this im trying to get my head round the Jargon. It may be odvious to most of you but when you say close out the trade what does this actually mean?

PokerNoon

Cgoldie - thanks for your advice. The plan was to nail £5.50 tables then move up. If I can't do the volume on higher tables then this challenge will likely fail, as I wanted to get up to playing higher stakes tables rather than grinding 10000 tables at once and making 1p on each one. So based on that I may need to look at revising this challenge a little. The goal is to make £50 a day from poker, so any suggestions about where else to look? SnGs are possibly the best option right now. I'm not remotely consistent with MTTs yet, so that's out of the question.

Spinky - thanks for the kind words about my blog. I'm glad people seem to like it and take value from it. Simply put, when you close out a trade, there is a button you can click in the software to close out which gives you a guaranteed profit or loss regardless of the result of the race, based on the current odds. Exactly the same as the stock market - you buy shares in a company. The share price then goes up or down and you can close out your trade at any time for a profit or loss based on the current price.

Today's Action

Bit disappointed with myself today. After getting up at 7 or earlier the previous 2 days to play poker all day, today I slept in until midday and got up super groggy, despite drinking zero alcohol last night and going to bed before midnight.

Welcome to the world of having no job. 2 early mornings is equivalent to one hangover now. Very poor form, and probably 90% of this forum that work 12 hours a day in offices all over the country are raging as they read this right now.

However I did play in a few DYMs today. So far it seems that regardless of the level I play (highest so far being £5.50) I cash in 50% of games. That wouldn't be too bad given my experience level if it wasn't for the evil rake that as a result has destroyed my bankroll. Will have to deposit more cash tomorrow and wash, rinse, repeat.

A mate of mine went out in Southport last night and ended up at the Genting casino. Apparently on Saturday nights they run cash games. He didn't know what the limit was, but thought it was either 50/1 or 1/2 nl.

He watched the game for a while and noticed a bunch of drunk people going all in with absolutely nothing on a regular basis. He also said the casino was packed with attractive girls too...in other words my 2 favourite things. Drunk fools throwing money in my direction (potentially) and rather nice ladies - all in one room.

I never believed such a place could exist except in my dreams, until today.

So next Saturday I'll be driving down there, buying in with 100 quid and seeing how I get on. The plan is to play tight and lie in wait for that monster hand to double up. Do that 2 or 3 times and you have a very profitable evening. Sounds much easier than trying to make money in the cash games online where everyone knows what they are doing. That said I'll still be playing here all day, every day as well.

Plus on the two times I've played live, I've really enjoyed it. That said, I did find it tricky first time without a computer telling me what's going on. Once I folded in the BB when I could have checked because I allowed my attention to drift away from the action. I was fuming with myself for about an hour after that.

Things I need to improve

When I'm watching hands being analysed on skypoker, 9 times out of 10 I can see what's going on, and I see the mistakes that people make and what they should have done. However in a game where you have the super fast time bar zooming down at breakneck speed, I don't always assess everything as well as I should.

My sloppiest error is missing when potential straights appear on the turn/river. Then my set/two pair gets outdrawn and I didn't see it coming. Instead of thinking 'why is this guy betting so big', I tend to assume they probably have top pair and I'll be fine.

I think this is because postflop, you often have several people in the pot and you have time to look and assess. Turn/river, you are usually heads up, and as soon as the card appears the time bar is ticking down and you're forced to make a decision. So I decide quickly and later on I realise 'hang on...they could have a straight!'

This is something I need to cut out of my game, because it's costing me money.

Lambert180

One thing I would say about the above issue you noticed in your game...

You should always be thinking ahead, like if you cbet on QJ3 then straight away before you even bet you should be thinking to yourself 'which cards do I want to see on the turn/which cards do I really not wanna see on the turn', that way you've got WAY more time than just the 10 seconds and then when the K or T comes you'll know it's a potential danger cos you were already thinking about it.

MP33

Hi 

Seems like you understnd the risks and have picked a good time to give it a go

I,m another one who,s intrigued by the sports betting. I,ve had dabbles at this myself and subscribed to betangel for a while. Maybe i wasn,t committed enough but it just looked to complicated.

I,d be interested to hear how you find this challenge compared with the horse trading. How much do you need to know about horses in the first place and can you transfer these skills to other sports betting such as football, golf cricket etc or even specials like reality shows

I did getmy bets restricted on one site as i was betting with them and laying off on the exchanges when the prices were right. They said i was hedging although i didn,t even know what that meant at the time

GL with the poker in the meantime

Paul

EDIT : Will be interesting to see how you get on in the casino . In my limited experience of playing cash games in casinos they are so much softer than the online games at the same level, especially on friday and saturday nights when you get the pub and club goers coming in for a gamble. I,d go myself more often but we don,t have a casino on our doorstep and have to travel nearly 30 miles to Blackpool where they have 3.

Ps - any businessmen out there?  Preston needs a casino 

PokerNoon

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

Hi  Seems like you understnd the risks and have picked a good time to give it a go I,m another one who,s intrigued by the sports betting. I,ve had dabbles at this myself and subscribed to betangel for a while. Maybe i wasn,t committed enough but it just looked to complicated. I,d be interested to hear how you find this challenge compared with the horse trading. How much do you need to know about horses in the first place and can you transfer these skills to other sports betting such as football, golf cricket etc or even specials like reality shows I did getmy bets restricted on one site as i was betting with them and laying off on the exchanges when the prices were right. They said i was hedging although i didn,t even know what that meant at the time GL with the poker in the meantime Paul EDIT : Will be interesting to see how you get on in the casino . In my limited experience of playing cash games in casinos they are so much softer than the online games at the same level, especially on friday and saturday nights when you get the pub and club goers coming in for a gamble. I,d go myself more often but we don,t have a casino on our doorstep and have to travel nearly 30 miles to Blackpool where they have 3. Ps - any businessmen out there?  Preston needs a casino 
Posted by MP33

Whereabouts in Preston are you? Ashton here.

Guessing you haven't seen this story from last week then. Interesting news if it goes anywhere: http://www.lep.co.uk/news/licence-bid-for-first-preston-casino-1-6316112

You don't need to know anything about horses or racing in general to trade. I know pretty much nothing even now. You're just analysing how the markets move and acting accordingly. You're not interested in form, whether a horse will win or lose, just whether the odds on a particular horse will go up or down right now. Then you bet accordingly, the price moves in the right direction, you close out the trade and profit is guaranteed regardless of what happens in the race.

It's not really comparable with normal sports betting. I bet on cricket tests because I understand how to find value at points in a test match. For example there has been extraordinary value on Australia in this Ashes series at points when they have been pretty much nailed on to win. 

Back in February (I think), SA were playing Pakistan at home. They had already won the first two tests and were playing in the 3rd and final test at Centurian, a venue where they typically crush sub continental teams inside 3 days. Yet before the first ball was bowled you could back SA at 1.5 which I thought was insane...so I backed them with £5k...and they crushed Pakistan inside 3 days. To me, that was just an opportunity for free money.

You don't see value like that in football (certainly not in the EPL).

Trading wise you have to distinguish between pre-off and in-play trading. Pre-off has many factors that can affect it, whereas in-play odds only change by what happens in the game itself. Obviously in cricket you also have the weather forecast to consider.

Anyway...back to poker, which is what this journal was meant to be about ....

Lambert, cheers for that. I know I can certainly improve my thinking early on in terms of 'what cards could he have?' How did you get on in the Primo last night btw? You seemed to be doing ok last time I looked.

ACEGOONER

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : Whereabouts in Preston are you? Ashton here. Guessing you haven't seen this story from last week then. Interesting news if it goes anywhere:  http://www.lep.co.uk/news/licence-bid-for-first-preston-casino-1-6316112 You don't need to know anything about horses or racing in general to trade. I know pretty much nothing even now. You're just analysing how the markets move and acting accordingly. You're not interested in form, whether a horse will win or lose, just whether the odds on a particular horse will go up or down right now. Then you bet accordingly, the price moves in the right direction, you close out the trade and profit is guaranteed regardless of what happens in the race. It's not really comparable with normal sports betting. I bet on cricket tests because I understand how to find value at points in a test match. For example there has been extraordinary value on Australia in this Ashes series at points when they have been pretty much nailed on to win.  Back in February (I think), SA were playing Pakistan at home. They had already won the first two tests and were playing in the 3rd and final test at Centurian, a venue where they typically crush sub continental teams inside 3 days. Yet before the first ball was bowled you could back SA at 1.5 which I thought was insane...so I backed them with £5k...and they crushed Pakistan inside 3 days. To me, that was just an opportunity for free money. You don't see value like that in football (certainly not in the EPL). Trading wise you have to distinguish between pre-off and in-play trading. Pre-off has many factors that can affect it, whereas in-play odds only change by what happens in the game itself. Obviously in cricket you also have the weather forecast to consider. Anyway...back to poker, which is what this journal was meant to be about .... Lambert, cheers for that. I know I can certainly improve my thinking early on in terms of 'what cards could he have?' How did you get on in the Primo last night btw? You seemed to be doing ok last time I looked.
Posted by PokerNoon

It sounds like your sports trading is very similar to trading on the markets where you make a predicition on whether a share for example will fall or rise and go long or short accordingly, in a similar way to not actually betting on outcomes you do not physically own the stock. 

There are a few regs on sky who as far as I am aware do a lot of similar trading to you on cricket. 

Do you have any good links to read up on sports trading, initially from the basics? From what you say, you seem to make a decent income from sports trading and to match this on the poker front would require you to play higher stakes than you have done soo far. You probably will need to learn how to play cash to make decent money. Easier said than done though, GL! 

  

Tikay10

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

Hi, First off i'm going to say this target is going to be difficult purely due to volume. While you can get decent ish volume playing 3.30-5.50, 11+ the volume just isn't there even on bigger sites. The site with the biggest volume of DYM's closed them down due to widespread collusion. £50 a day is certainly acheivable but you would have to put in a lot of volume at the 5-11 stakes that would require you probably playing atleast 8 hours a day with 9+ tables. Even then you would require a very solid winrate, 10%+ is really hard to acheive for even seasoned players these days. That said if you want to start getting towards that goal you need to first master ICM, get some software and set it up for a DYM payout structure and master your push fold ranges. Once your really good with ICM (not the easiest task) your going to have to learn when to and when not to rely on ICM late game due to other gameplay factors. You need to definetly learn to play atleast 6 tables at a time, probably more to achieve your goal. I think DYM's are a good place to start and learn solid tight agressive play and late game push/fold situations. However if your serious about making a living from poker DYM's probably isn't the best area long term. I'd reccomend spending a month playing and grind out 500+ games and then move to MTT's, turbo SNG's or cash where you can find good volume at the higher levels to make a living.
Posted by cgoldie

For what it's worth - not much I guess - I think this Post by cgoldie is absolutely spot on, best all-round advice I've seen in this thread so far.
 
The only slight disagreement I have with it is the suggestion that once you've done 500 DYTM's & got to grips with the basics, that you move on to MTT's. Making a steady income from MTT's is incredibly tough, & very few manage it. Cash is the way forward for you, imo, once you move on from DYM's.
 
One other point - DYM's are ideal for you right now, low variance, & perfect for learning the basics. I would not recommend that you play more than 500 or so though, as it ingrains habits in your game, & some of these habits do not work in other formats.

Tikay10

Incidentally, you asked me on another thread if I use Betfair Exchange for Sports Betting.
 
I do, yes, but not to a great extent, as I don't do much "trading" as such, mainly regular betting, & I have accounts with all the major Firms, though many of them are now severely restricted or even closed.    

deadeyed

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

Incidentally, you asked me on another thread if I use Betfair Exchange for Sports Betting.   I do, yes, but not to a great extent, as I don't do much "trading" as such, mainly regular betting, & I have accounts with all the major Firms, though many of them are now severely restricted or even closed.     
Posted by Tikay10

how can anyone be tired of taking your money Tikay? :-)

Tikay10

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : how can anyone be tired of taking your money Tikay? :-)
Posted by deadeyed

Ha!

No need for that, no need at all.

It's strange but true though.

Incidentally, I give a Sports Betting tip every week with my UKPC Video Update, & this week's one won nicely @ 2/1. Last week's won @ Evens, the week before, which was a horse EW, was 2nd @ 8/1. Variance is a wonderful thing, eh? 

goldnballz

Reeeeeeeeally hope that Preston casino plan gets the go ahead! It's a bit of a pain having to travel to Bolton, Blackpool or Manchester to get a decent game.

PokerNoon

So I tried a little experiment today involving aggression.

The call button was pretty much redundant except on select occasions. I didn't get involved much, but when I did, I went in hard. It worked a treat! I played 6 $11 DYMs and cashed in all 6.

We all know that one swallow does not a summer make, but nevertheless I am still delighted with my play today. 

I also signed up to Sharkscope today and before every DYM I scoped out all of my opponents. As well as aggression, today's focus was on 'what will it take for me to win this pot?', rather than 'do my cards beat everyone else's?'

That change of thinking has opened my mind slightly to new plays that I wouldn't have thought about before. Also was conscious of trying to put my opposition in as many tight spots as possible. 

It's also the first day of the challenge that I have achieved my goal - £9 profit from 6 DYMs = £54.

I only played one DYM at once today. I wanted to really try and understand my opponents in detail and take notes as I went. Try to figure out 'why are they betting/calling/checking now?' and then making a play based on that, rather than the cards I was holding. I must say that this more psychological profiling style of playing is more interesting and enjoyable to me than simply playing the right cards at the right time. ABC if you will.

Anyway, I'm not getting carried away yet, but I am 100% sure I am progressing very quickly here. Thanks again to all for the advice and help you've given - I couldn't have gotten here this fast without you.

Since I hit my target today, I'm taking some time now away from the screen before I play in a large freeroll on another network later on tonight. I take every opportunity I can with these freerolls to work on my MTT game without spending a fortune. I'd love to play in the big Primos more, but my BR just doesn't allow it.

PokerNoon

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : It sounds like your sports trading is very similar to trading on the markets where you make a predicition on whether a share for example will fall or rise and go long or short accordingly, in a similar way to not actually betting on outcomes you do not physically own the stock.  There are a few regs on sky who as far as I am aware do a lot of similar trading to you on cricket.  Do you have any good links to read up on sports trading, initially from the basics? From what you say, you seem to make a decent income from sports trading and to match this on the poker front would require you to play higher stakes than you have done soo far. You probably will need to learn how to play cash to make decent money. Easier said than done though, GL!    
Posted by ACEGOONER

Search for Peter Webb's Bet Angel blog. He's not the best writer in the world, but he is a great trader. He's my inspiration for the trading I do now. Of course I think my blog is pretty awesome too

Agree with you about the higher stakes. I might start tinkering around with some cash games again soon (thanks to Tikay for that idea). Problem with cash is that it never ends. DYM, STT or MTT has an end point in sight, whereas with cash you can play for ever. For me, that means 'play until you lose your entire stack', which is not exactly the most profitable strategy in the world.

I checked my records and I signed up here on 12th November - just over a month ago. I've come a long way since then. Makes me wonder where I can get to in another month, 6 months, 1 year?

Question for the more experienced players...in the early stages of a DYM, is there ever a situation which warrants calling UTG? I see players doing this all the time and I look on SS and they have played 1000s of games (usually not profitably)...in my head this is a ridiculously basic error which is asking to be exploited with a big raise. Am I missing something here? 

Lambert180

If by calling UTG you mean limping into the pot UTG then no there's pretty much never an excuse to do this in any game. It's also not surprising that the people you see doing it and usually not profitable players on SS.

Tikay10

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : Search for Peter Webb's Bet Angel blog. He's not the best writer in the world, but he is a great trader. He's my inspiration for the trading I do now. Of course I think my blog is pretty awesome too Agree with you about the higher stakes. I might start tinkering around with some cash games again soon (thanks to Tikay for that idea). Problem with cash is that it never ends. DYM, STT or MTT has an end point in sight, whereas with cash you can play for ever. For me, that means 'play until you lose your entire stack', which is not exactly the most profitable strategy in the world. I checked my records and I signed up here on 12th November - just over a month ago. I've come a long way since then. Makes me wonder where I can get to in another month, 6 months, 1 year? Question for the more experienced players ...in the early stages of a DYM, is there ever a situation which warrants calling UTG? I see players doing this all the time and I look on SS and they have played 1000s of games (usually not profitably)...in my head this is a ridiculously basic error which is asking to be exploited with a big raise. Am I missing something here? 
Posted by PokerNoon

In NLH, almost never, no.

Winning players MAKE things happen (raise), others LET things happen (limp, & hope to hit the flop).

You don't need the best hand, you need the best DYM strategy.
 
Playing from UTG, our hands needs to be MUCH stronger than from the Button.  

ctbn

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : In NLH, almost never, no. Winning players MAKE things happen (raise), others LET things happen (limp, & hope to hit the flop). You don't need the best hand, you need the best DYM strategy.   Playing from UTG, our hands needs to be MUCH stronger than from the Button.  
Posted by Tikay10

your dont

ctbn

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal : your dont
Posted by ctbn

forgot the  S

Phantom66

Cant believe I have only just noticed this thread

Good luck on the diary and challenge.

I'm learning a bit about DYMs myself - mostly just reinforcing they are mind numbing to play - but agree ideal place to start and fairly easy to learn to win. Really would help to have a bankroll to start at £3.30 and save some rake because the margins aren't great and it makes a big difference.

I'm grinding up from nothing (well <£1) and up over £50 now playing £1 DYMs and 6max [edit:balance includes £25 from ToP entry for those observant enough to spot profit doesn't match in other thread]

Much prefer 6max as a format - lower rake -slower structure and you get rewarded for playing to win.

To earn a living though you need to follow the volume and that means cash IMO. For fun and the chance for a decent ROI without too much of a learning curve I would go for 6max - the volume isn't there to grind though.

Most importantly though as a fellow Prestonian - bring on the casino - hope to see you there one day!

Mayhem357

Good luck with this, I am aregular on five and ten dyms and my roi is about 7 percent. My advice keep a tight aggressive game and you will make a profit, avoid the regs if you can (Jac35, patwalsh, john connor, and myself - apologies for those i missed). Also know your opponents and chnage your game to fit, avoid bluffing the fish unless you know they call fold a lot and dont be afraid to float a cbet agaisnt better players.

PokerNoon

I had no idea there were so many fellow Preston folk around here! Maybe because there's not much else to do in this town

Anyway, another solid day.

Second day in a row I've hit my £50 target.

Played 1 £11 DYM this morning and cashed in that, so I thought I'd try my luck at the £22 level. Cashed in that, and just stayed at that level all day. Ended up cashing in 5/7 at that level for a total of £55 profit for the day.

Gonna play in a freeroll bounty hunter qualifier this evening and back onto DYMs again tomorrow. 

What I'm most pleased about is that I don't think I was lucky today. I didn't get amazing cards all day, or win a bunch of coin flip all-in situations. In fact one thing I'm trying to do is not get involved in those 50/50 situations unless I have a massive stack and we're on the bubble, because it's just not a profitable long term tactic.

Pretty happy with my progress at the moment.

PokerNoon

Wow, what a terrible evening after my last post.

Freeroll - busted out early.

Then decided to play in the £5k turbo that started at 8pm. Busted out at exactly 8.06pm.

Later on thought I'd give the cash tables a go again. Been a while since the last time.

Playing 10nl with £10 stack, built it up to £26. Decided 'I'll close this down and go to bed when I get to £30'. 

Then got AA cracked by QQ and lost it all in one hand. Yet again, I never leave the cash tables with more than £0.

Bit frustrated, but never mind. Back to DYM in the morning.

bbMike

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

Wow, what a terrible evening after my last post. Freeroll - busted out early. Then decided to play in the £5k turbo that started at 8pm. Busted out at exactly 8.06pm. Later on thought I'd give the cash tables a go again. Been a while since the last time. Playing 10nl with £10 stack, built it up to £26. Decided 'I'll close this down and go to bed when I get to £30'.  Then got AA cracked by QQ and lost it all in one hand. Yet again, I never leave the cash tables with more than £0. Bit frustrated, but never mind. Back to DYM in the morning.
Posted by PokerNoon

Unlucky. But it's not a terrible evening if we've done the right things and been unlucky. It's a frustrating one yes, but not terrible. More important is why we've bust at 8.06pm, if 80% of the time we'd have doubled that's great, but if we reflect and see that we didn't need to be in a hand, or missed something that meant we could get off a hand, then that's something to learn from. If there's been nothing to learn from, it's been a cracking night, despite being a few bob out of pocket.

Your report on your DYM game coming along is very encouraging. Keep up the good work.

Tikay10

Noony,

Please take this in the intended spirit, which is constructive, I'm am NOT knocking you, but......

You seem to be trying to be all things to all men, almost a jack-of-all-trades.
 
You are new to poker, & are going along nicely, but in one day, you are playing THREE different formats - DYM's, Tourneys, & Cash.
 
I've yet to meet a poker player on earth who was equally good at all three formats.
 
If I were your poker Mentor or coach (God forbid, lol!), I would insist you stuck to ONE Format for a minimum of 3 months, until you have found your feet. And, given that you are taking this seriously, it would NOT include MTT's - the variance in those things is massive. Even the very best MTT players can go months without a decent cash.
 
It hurts me to see your hard-earned DYM profits going down the MTT route.
 
The Thread Title is "Making a Full Time Wage from Poker". If that remains the plan, I'd cut out the MTT's, & decide between Cash & DYM's. Logically, cash games would be the best route. I'd estimate that over 90% of Poker Pros earn their wages in Cash Games. Very very few do so in MTT's.
 
Anyway, I'm not your mentor or Coach, so it's as you were.....

Good luck.       

PokerNoon

Thanks guys.

Tikay - Wise words as ever. I agree with everything you said. I took on the MTT as a bit of a punt, but these punts do all add up over time. I'll steer clear for the time being unless I sneak in through freerolls. If I choose to play cash it will be using a tenner after I've already made £60 or more for the day. That way if I lose, I'm still hitting my £50 target.

bbMike - Solid advice. Perhaps you can help with a situation in the £5k turbo? 

Very first hand. I'm in SB and dealt JJ.

UTG limps, and 2 more follow before it gets to me. I raise from 20 to 100 (I think the opening blinds are 20, might have been 30). 2 of the 3 call.

Flop comes down and the highest card is a 9, but there are 2 spades there. So my only concern is the flush draw or a set. I don't believe anyone can have a higher pair than me, because I'm assuming they would have raised preflop if they did.

I bet about 80% of the pot, thinking it will make anyone with a flush draw fold. UTG limper calls, other guy folds. 

So now we're heads up and the turn card is a low spade. 

Still no overcards, the question in my head is 'what to do now?'

If I assume he's hit his flush, I can check, But in my mind that's equivalent to waving a white flag and saying 'come and take the pot'. And suppose he isn't on a flush draw but just a low pocket pair and he's one of these guys that will keep on calling (especially early on when the blinds are low), I don't want to give up my pot to him in this scenario.

So I bet about 80% of the pot again and he calls again.

River card is another low spade. So we're in the odd situation of there being 4 spades on the board and the highest card is a 9. At this point I give up and check. He goes all in and I fold, so I never knew what he had.

My guess is that he had something like A6 of spades and he was willing to call the big flop bet because he knew he was drawing to the nuts.

How would you have played this one? I lost over half my stack in the first hand!

Tikay10

In Response to Re: Making a Full Time Wage From Poker - PokerNoon's Journal:

Thanks guys. Tikay - Wise words as ever. I agree with everything you said. I took on the MTT as a bit of a punt, but these punts do all add up over time. I'll steer clear for the time being unless I sneak in through freerolls. If I choose to play cash it will be using a tenner after I've already made £60 or more for the day. That way if I lose, I'm still hitting my £50 target. bbMike - Solid advice. Perhaps you can help with a situation in the £5k turbo?  Very first hand. I'm in SB and dealt JJ. UTG limps, and 2 more follow before it gets to me. I raise from 20 to 100 (I think the opening blinds are 20, might have been 30). 2 of the 3 call. Flop comes down and the highest card is a 9, but there are 2 spades there. So my only concern is the flush draw or a set. I don't believe anyone can have a higher pair than me, because I'm assuming they would have raised preflop if they did. I bet about 80% of the pot, thinking it will make anyone with a flush draw fold. UTG limper calls, other guy folds.  So now we're heads up and the turn card is a low spade.  Still no overcards, the question in my head is 'what to do now?' If I assume he's hit his flush, I can check, But in my mind that's equivalent to waving a white flag and saying 'come and take the pot'. And suppose he isn't on a flush draw but just a low pocket pair and he's one of these guys that will keep on calling (especially early on when the blinds are low), I don't want to give up my pot to him in this scenario. So I bet about 80% of the pot again and he calls again. River card is another low spade. So we're in the odd situation of there being 4 spades on the board and the highest card is a 9. At this point I give up and check. He goes all in and I fold, so I never knew what he had. My guess is that he had something like A6 of spades and he was willing to call the big flop bet because he knew he was drawing to the nuts. How would you have played this one? I lost over half my stack in the first hand!
Posted by PokerNoon

In the early Levels, these hands are an absolute nightmare to play, as you get some really weird calls, & it's so hard to define their holding.

Only one stage of a DYM matters to me - 4 handed. I'm totally disintereted in going to war any sooner, except in VERY rare spots. I need to preserve my stack for when it matters. If I can get my Aces Heads Up, fine, if not, I'll bin them no prob.

J-J in Level 1 is the nightmare scenario, unless we have position. The lags will shout at me, but I'm not persevering with them in Level One, I want to preserve my stack until there are 4 players left & the Blinds are big, because I can push folks around then, & I only need to steal the Blinds once or twice & I'm home & hosed.
 
Think I might even just limp with J-J here, & set-mine, if I miss, fine, in the bin, & it's cost me 20 chips, which is only 1% of my stack.