Phantom's Practice Perms

Phantom66

TY G.

Doubled up every leg of the quadpot. Need Rahmah or St Dunstan to place to get some money back but I expect I will need them both to place to get a profit and would be good if the fav doesnt place.

Phantom66

Clinging on in the virtual placepot but I'll take that as 3/4 lines were wiped out in the opening leg.

Phantom66

£1.16 back on the Quadpot so it's a £2.44 loss in real money

£15.68 returns on the virtual Placepot so it's a £41.92 loss in play money

Think I will separate virtual jackpot from virtual placepot and add a real quadpot total to OP.

MISTY4ME

In Response to Re: Phantom's Practice Perms:

£1.16 back on the Quadpot so it's a £2.44 loss in real money £15.68 returns on the virtual Placepot so it's a £41.92 loss in play money Think I will separate virtual jackpot from virtual placepot and add a real quadpot total to OP.
Posted by Phantom66

I haven't followed how you have all been doing thoroughly, but it doesn't seem that the results have been favourable. Are you all applying JACKPOT style perms (where you have to get the winner of the race) to the PLACEPOT.

I think this is why WYNNE has had more success with smaller single perms IMO.

StayOrGo

In Response to Re: Phantom's Practice Perms:

In Response to Re: Phantom's Practice Perms : I haven't followed how you have all been doing thoroughly, but it doesn't seem that the results have been favourable. Are you all applying JACKPOT style perms (where you have to get the winner of the race) to the PLACEPOT. I think this is why WYNNE has had more success with smaller single perms IMO.
Posted by MISTY4ME

To be fair to Phantom (And me as I am following a similar strategy), there hasn't really been enough sample size to make any judgements yet, and it's a work in progress.

Wynne has had some amazing big wins with his Placepot perms which is awesome! It would be virtually impossible to try and compete against his amazing results in the short term.

However, I wouldn't call his perms small. I believe his two biggest wins were on perms that had over 400 lines (correct me if I am wrong), so in fact very much advocating the potential of wider perms. I also believe that he puts two or three on per meeting sometimes.

Wynne certainly has had some great selections along with a perm strategy that is a good balance of favourites, mid-priced horses and the occasional outsider. This has allowed him good statistical coverage in each leg meaning he could win a small dividend for lots of lines or indeed a big dividend with albeit slightly less winning lines. What he appears to be doing is something similar to what Phantom and I are attempting to do, albeit with slightly less perms and more success. 

I agree with your point that Placepot perms should be smaller than Jackpot perms, but we are picking meetings where we wouldn't attempt the Jackpot because the perms would need to be too big, so they are in fact smaller than what a Jackpot perm would be.

Personally, I think there are several statistical benefits of multi-perms, however, you may prove to be right, but more data is needed before writing it off imo.

The fact that every result is being recorded, means that over time, we will know if there is an edge or not, but I for one am not giving up just yet. :=)

Also, we quite enjoy trying to combine the statistics and the horse form reading, so win or lose, we like the challenge of it, of course as we put EVERY result out there for all to see, we are indeed, there to be shot at. Hopefully as time goes by, we will get an idea of what works and what doesn't, but a lot more data is required.

Cheers for the feedback,

G

Phantom66

Hi Misty.

I am not generally trying to pick winners and use a jackpot perm as a placepot, allthough some races e.g eves fav, 3 horses 3/1 to 6/1 and 14/1 bar it's hard to justify putting any other than the top 4 in. Even if you find a lively outsider the chances are a high % of the entrants are going to get placed.

As I think we all realise the aim is try and win big the days that a couple of the favs do not place, must be impossible to consistently win small at these. 

I probably could be more selective with meetings where there are a few opposable favourites but generally I am trying stuff out and seeing what I can learn.

So far I have a strike rate of 50% getting paid but making losses on all bar one attempt at placepots so not good reading. 

It just adds a bit of a fun to a race meeting without laying cash on it, although not quite sure how I would feel with a full unit winning on a day that noone wins and payout would have been high 5 figures.

Phantom66

I think there are a few open races at Beverley this evening so going for a virtual placepot as follows.

	7 July Beverley
£0.10	per line PLACEPOT		ENTRIES
TIME	Sel A	Sel B	Sel C	Sel D
Leg 1	01 CHI	06 IBE	04 FAI	08 ITA
Leg 2	5-ELL	13 WIR	3-CE D
Leg 3	9 DAN	3 FLO	6 PROU	2 MON
Leg 4	6 VAU	4 BRO	1 HAJ
Leg 5	11 ANEE	4 DIAM	12 CHAU	8 PER
Leg 6	15 LAD	SP FAV	14 JOR	7 NUAL

	PERM
	1	2	3	4
Leg 1	AB	ABC	AC	BCD
Leg 2	ABC	AC	ABC	AB
Leg 3	BCD	AB	AC	AD
Leg 4	AB	ABC	AB	AC
Leg 5	AC	AB	BCD	AB
Leg 6	AB	BC	AD	ABC
Lines	144	144	144	144
			Lines	576
			COST	£57.60

I have placed a real Quadpot on a subset of these selections in Legs 3 to 6 as well.

Phantom66

Getting interesting a favourite didn't place and I am still in 3 perms

EQUITY	PERM 1	PERM 2	PERM 3	PERM 4	TOTAL	POOL/UNITS LEFT
COST	£14.40	£14.40	£14.40	£14.40	£57.60	£52,476.87
Start EV	£10.51	£10.51	£10.51	£10.51	£42.05	£38,308.12
Leg 1	£12.20	£12.20	£6.10	£6.10	£36.61	£30,135.79
Leg 2	£13.69	£0.00	£6.84	£6.84	£27.38	£13,432.65
Leg 3	£9.33	£0.00	£4.67	£9.33	£23.33	£9,854.03
Leg 4	£16.70	£0.00	£12.52	£16.70	£45.92	£1,835.27
Leg 5	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00
Leg 6	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00	£0.00

StayOrGo

Awesome pick C in LEG5, just piped mine for 3rd place.

Great equity leg that one for you even though you bust one, looking good. :=)

PERM 1 looking hopeful!

Phantom66

Thanks G. Yes I bust a perm but equity went up to £125. Fingers crossed for leg 6.

Still live in the quadpot too with all 4 selections as per placepot in Leg 6.

StayOrGo

In Response to Re: Phantom's Practice Perms:

Thanks G. Yes I bust a perm but equity went up to £125. Fingers crossed for leg 6. Still live in the quadpot too with all 4 selections as per placepot in Leg 6.
Posted by Phantom66

Very UL LEG6 mate.

Phantom66

OUCH.

Thought Nuala Tagula was home and dry a furlong out

unknown_username

great effort P and very unlucky.

Naps table checking still on ?

StayOrGo

In Response to Re: Phantom's Practice Perms:

OUCH. Thought Nuala Tagula was home and dry a furlong out
Posted by Phantom66

Very frustrating day for us all today.

Still we shall fight on.

Phantom66

Oh well if you are going to bust a last leg by a nose then I suppose best to do it with play money.

Also not quite sure how Young Tiger went of as favourite, certainly didn't run like one anyway.

RE: Naps tables, I'll have a go at them now.