Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**

MattBates

In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**:

There must be loads of multi accounts, wife husband, brothers, sisters, son, dad, and so on, and theres nowt wrong with that. so what happens when there are say 3 playing in same house, same torni, and all reach final table. It would be hard not to tell, wife, brother, or whoever you have a top hand, or can they not play same tornie..?.
Posted by tomo_efc

Wow, where to start!

I don't think you understand what is meant by the term multi accounting. The issue is the same player playing on multi accounts. Not different players playing on different accounts in the same house. Players shouldn't be allowed to play in a SnG as someone else in the same house, they should be allowed to play in MTTs (this is industry standard). However if these players cant resist the urge to collude then they shouldn't play in the same MTT.

FlyingDagg

In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**:

Regarding whether there was premeditation from this person, read this: Breaking The Rules?? He knew well in advance it was against the rules and had no problem with doing it when he could see an advantage. .
Posted by BorinLoner

Wow Great piece of detective work Borin. Interesting that both bigflop1 and pocket9s have posted on that thread. Personally this raises my suspicions even more now and I seriously wonder if this weeks events were the first time he has done this. I trust that Sky will look into "both " players full histories now?

FlyingDagg

In response to Dohhhhhhhh and Lamberts post I think the main reason for players multi accounting is naivety. If I can give 2 examples.

The first one I'm sat a table in a MTT and say hi to a newish player. I get the response " Hi dagg I'ts not XXXX here it's  ***** and I'm just having a quick game on their account. They were horrified when I told them it was illegal and they should read the terms and conditions. I'm a 100% certain they have never done it since.

The 2nd instance was even more bizarre. I go to a profile page to PM someone and there for all to see it says "Used to play on my girlfriends account now have my own"

My point is when you sign up for anything do you ever read all the small print ? I'll guarantee that it's a 99% no. Sky really need to make the fraud/collusion/ multi accounting problem far more prominent when players sign up.

churchy18

In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**:

Regarding whether there was premeditation from this person, read this: Breaking The Rules?? He knew well in advance it was against the rules and had no problem with doing it when he could see an advantage. For those suggesting that he was contrite when he realised he'd done wrong, read these posts from the first page of this thread: In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS** : In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS** : He was denying his wrongdoing right up to the moment he was caught out. He had every intention of stealing at least £300 from honest people. He's not an innocent man, he knew what he was doing was wrong and he kept it up for as long as he had something to gain from it. His "apology" only came when he had nothing to gain by maintaining his deception. Now he has something to gain by placating those who have uncovered the evidence of his crime, and now he's ever so sincere in his apology. Let's have some sort of perspective on this "punishment" of a lifetime ban from Sky Bet (if it can actually prevent him from opening another account). If this sort of thing is not taken further than the individual poker site, what's to stop people doing exactly the same on another site? Absolutely nothing. Incentive to cheat : A guaranteed shot at £1500 Disincentive to cheat : IF you're caught, you have to close down one online poker site and double-click on another. If this man were, say, an accountant looking after your elderly relative's finances, wouldn't you like to be aware that he has tried to do this sort of thing? He knew what he was doing was wrong, yet he saw an opportunity and took it, trying to cheat people he now wishes to refer to as "friends". Would you trust him? Would you be happy if you were cheated by him in future, in some other walk of life, and discovered that he'd been found out before and nothing had been done? The only way that poker as a whole can be protected from people cheating, as well as wider society, is if we are firm and unforgiving when we uncover this sort of thing. Much is made of the Sky Poker Community. So what kind of community is it? It can either be a community that protects wrongdoers or it can be one that robustly protects honest people from those wrongdoers. Sky Poker currently has evidence in its possession of an attempt to defraud it and its customers of thousands of pounds. Sky as a company, and you and I as individuals, are not the appropriate arbiters of whether this should result in a criminal case being brought. It may well be that the Police and CPS would not pursue this but that is not for us to decide. The only appropriate thing for Sky Poker to do is to pass their evidence on. We all have our opinions on what should happen to this chap. The right thing is for the evidence to decide and the people who should investigate that evidence are the police.
Posted by BorinLoner

very well written and a big +1  all very well admitting guilt when caught but would he have admitted it if he was not caught?

and has he done this before or even done it in normal 6 max/dym games in the past would be great 2 have 2 hands v 4 every game would it not!

Enut

Another +1 for the lifetime ban. It was a premeditated attempt at fraud, simple as that. Due to the vigilance of DTM and the actions of Sky it was detected and he didn't profit from his crime. People have had criminal records for less. The guy should think himself very lucky if all he gets is a lifetime ban from Sky.

I presume that Sky has/will be investigating ALL his history to check for further collusion. I would love to take Tikay's stance and assume it was just a one time thing but certainly now it has been detected it should be checked.

Finally, I know that the final table was sorted and quite rightly too and congratulations to all those that made it. What about those that played in STTs where the colluding took place? They ALL lost money and with it the possibility of qualifying. I assume that Sky have frozen his account until things are sorted and are also in the process of refunding ALL the players that played in those STTs, although how they compensate for anyone losing a chance at qualifying for the FT is a tough one.

Lambert180

In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**:

In response to Dohhhhhhhh and Lamberts post I think the main reason for players multi accounting is naivety. If I can give 2 examples. The first one I'm sat a table in a MTT and say hi to a newish player. I get the response " Hi dagg I'ts not XXXX here it's  ***** and I'm just having a quick game on their account. They were horrified when I told them it was illegal and they should read the terms and conditions. I'm a 100% certain they have never done it since. The 2nd instance was even more bizarre. I go to a profile page to PM someone and there for all to see it says "Used to play on my girlfriends account now have my own" My point is when you sign up for anything do you ever read all the small print ? I'll guarantee that it's a 99% no. Sky really need to make the fraud/collusion/ multi accounting problem far more prominent when players sign up.
Posted by FlyingDagg

I know Dagg, I definitely agree for most it's people being unaware that it's wrong.

My point was that if all these naive people do it and it goes unnoticed, that means that the people who deliberately do it to cheat ALSO go unnoticed.

Wizzlet

Agree with all above, my first knowledge of colluding came a couple of years ago in a pub poker tournie when 3 players were openly planning to go back to one persons house to play $50 DYMs on another site, each with a laptop and hotspot mobiles to give them different IP numbers.  It goes on and there's little the bigger sites can do about it.

unknown_username

In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS**:

Regarding whether there was premeditation from this person, read this: Breaking The Rules?? He knew well in advance it was against the rules and had no problem with doing it when he could see an advantage. For those suggesting that he was contrite when he realised he'd done wrong, read these posts from the first page of this thread: In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS** : In Response to Re: Skill & Go Final - Who will win? **WITH SKYBET ODDS** : He was denying his wrongdoing right up to the moment he was caught out. He had every intention of stealing at least £300 from honest people. He's not an innocent man, he knew what he was doing was wrong and he kept it up for as long as he had something to gain from it. His "apology" only came when he had nothing to gain by maintaining his deception. Now he has something to gain by placating those who have uncovered the evidence of his crime, and now he's ever so sincere in his apology. Let's have some sort of perspective on this "punishment" of a lifetime ban from Sky Bet (if it can actually prevent him from opening another account). If this sort of thing is not taken further than the individual poker site, what's to stop people doing exactly the same on another site? Absolutely nothing. Incentive to cheat : A guaranteed shot at £1500 Disincentive to cheat : IF you're caught, you have to close down one online poker site and double-click on another. If this man were, say, an accountant looking after your elderly relative's finances, wouldn't you like to be aware that he has tried to do this sort of thing? He knew what he was doing was wrong, yet he saw an opportunity and took it, trying to cheat people he now wishes to refer to as "friends". Would you trust him? Would you be happy if you were cheated by him in future, in some other walk of life, and discovered that he'd been found out before and nothing had been done? The only way that poker as a whole can be protected from people cheating, as well as wider society, is if we are firm and unforgiving when we uncover this sort of thing. Much is made of the Sky Poker Community. So what kind of community is it? It can either be a community that protects wrongdoers or it can be one that robustly protects honest people from those wrongdoers. Sky Poker currently has evidence in its possession of an attempt to defraud it and its customers of thousands of pounds. Sky as a company, and you and I as individuals, are not the appropriate arbiters of whether this should result in a criminal case being brought. It may well be that the Police and CPS would not pursue this but that is not for us to decide. The only appropriate thing for Sky Poker to do is to pass their evidence on. We all have our opinions on what should happen to this chap. The right thing is for the evidence to decide and the people who should investigate that evidence are the police.
Posted by BorinLoner

+ 1 

How can there be any doubt.

Tikay yes you are a softy 

WAOOGA

I think at least 1 of the bigger sites stopped doing DYM style games because of collusion.

Would a potential fix be you have say a 18 player DYM lobby, which when full randonly spawns the players at 3 x 6 seater DYM games?

Edit: Traffic could be an iusse, probably applicable for NL DYM put a £1.15 PLO DYM would probably take 2 days to get to the spawn