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Against, say, Alexis74, or Pompeynic, & most others "Team Solid Crew" I NEVER make that play.
I'm a little distrustful of all that GTO stuff, I think individual opponents need to be treated differently.
Much appreciate the advice, by the way, thank you.
This is not in any way dissing Geldy, it's just something that was relevant to the play. He has widened his range, so I can widen mine.
It was too good a spot to turn down. Or so I thought.
LOVE this "learning together" stuff.
Heads up in an MTT though, the options do change significantly, as we need to widen our range considerably.
If I should ALWAYS fold there, then you (or anyone else, with ANY holding) would ALWAYS reraise a big stack there & force them to fold. That can't be right, can it?
The equation is a basket of things to consider.
ICM
The Opponent's likely holding
The % chances of winning or losing.
The % chance of forcing villain to fold.
They all need taking into consideration.
Don't think we MUST fold just because ICM says so, it feels more "informal" & position specific to me.
Forget last night's hand, I'm talking generally.
There's a road to that 65%, but my sat-nav keeps sending me the wrong way.
That picture of Twiglets is for a multipack.
They are a snap-fold.
£2.30 for 6 x 24 grams, which is 1.6p per gram.
The big 150 gram bags are currently £1. which is 0.7p per gram.
Proper ICM that.
Anyway, enough talk, it's time to play some pokerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
See you in a bit.
if a large open is made and almost certainly wont fold to a RR, what can the larger (RR AI ) stack do about it.
my initial assessment was that 2 large stacks collide and posses probably undominated ranges, that gives a flip and all the equity goes to the other players.
I guess the point is how long should a big stack go before fighting back-which is a situational thing base on opponents and stack sizes.
I know I fold my blinds too much and the others know, but then again I steal and don't expect calls much, I've said too much...
Better news tonight Won three @£5.50 Lost one. Won one at £11.00
The £11 game was wierd. I am sitting 5th out of 5 with 1000 chips thinking it is going to be tough to cash here, when, out of knowhere ,all I can here in my head is the base line from Frankie Goes to Hollywood's Two Tribes. The two big stacks decide to go to war and one of them busts........ YIPPEE.
Sometimes you just have to find a fold. (says the guy who could not win a bean on monday evening)
I have that tune in my head and fully expect to hum it to myself every time I see this happen from now on.
See you all tomorrow if I can get away from work.....URGH
Mr TK is away in Leeds and the PL08 chat box turns to - Golf and Trains.
Obviously saving all the cake chat for his return.
Just got home, after a truly challenging day, but now it is time to play some pokerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Honestly, can't wait. All my woes melt away when I'm playing our lovely game, it's like a break from real life reality.
Come on then lads, I'm waiting, tonight I am going to.....
Get the lot
Do my conkers
Play for 4 hours & end up where I started.
It'll be fun though.
Well that's the key thing. Sure, if there are 2 shorties, the two biggies really ought to avoid each other. But what happens if Biggie One keep raising against Biggie 2? Eventually, something has to give, Biggie 2 has to protect his stack eventually, especially if they think Biggie 1 is exploiting the dynamic.
You fold your blinds too much? I disagree. You are a very good, & I imagine, profitable, player, so if it works, it's fine, never mind "conventional wisdom".
I know lots of the regulars read this thread, but I don't mind them knowing, I rarely, almost never defend my blinds unless I have something. And if I do, they'll soon know about it.
The odd spot for me is in the SB with a good hand, & it has been folded round. I very rarely rauise there, I want to see what Mr BB does first. If he thinks he can raise me off because I limped, he has a surprise in store. I ONLY limp in the SB with hands that I am going to defend a raise with, or even re-raise. Very rare actually, but if I "make up", then the red warning flags ought to go up.
There was a really curious dynamic in one game last night.
I'm sure those involved will not mind me mentioning names, none of what I am saying is negative or critical, but it was all a bit odd & I'm trying to better understand the correct line here. I could try & explain it using "anon" names, but real-life works better.
We were playing a standard PLO8 DYM. "trevil" had doubled up early, but then disconnected. I had plenty of chips, so did gelders.
Soon, we were 4 handed. Gelders, "plywood", me, & the now long "AWAY" "trevil".
In these spots, ASSUMING poor Trevil remains "AWAY", we are all guaranteed to win, & we all had more chips than Trevil now.
The "etiquette" here is NOT to mention anything in the chat box, (& nothing was mentioned) but generally, everyone either folds, or if in the SB to the "AWAY" BB, they raise, so every pot is uncontested, & we await the poor absentee to blind away.
However, in the game last night, whilst I was merrily clicking "FOLD" every hand, Gelders & plywood were going at it hammer & tongs, contesting every pot. It's possible one or both had not realised trevil was AWAY, but unlikely I 'd have thought.
I was folding every hand because I was pretty much guaranteed to win if Trevil failed to return, & he'd been absent 20 minutes. I had more chips than trevil, simple. We all did.
I did sort of "expect" Geldy to give me a free ride in my BB (he was button, trevil SB, me BB) but he raised 80% of the hands. I was not in the least bothered, not at all, I can't lose this, so I just kept folding.
I find these "AWAY" situations quite morally confusing, but I go with the flow.
Anyway, we all cashed, as trevil eventually bled dry, so it all ended well, but it seemed a curious spot to me. For the record, I am NOT dissing Geldy at all, I just found it all interesting, & I'm curious as to his logic here. He is perfectly entitled to keep potting it, make no mistake there.
You could also argue that using my logic (just fold) we are not being fair to the away man, as we are, implicitly, sort of "colluding". We do it all the time though, if there are 3 biggies & one shortie, the biggies DO gang up on the shortie, nothing improper about that.
Interesting, I thought.
It tweaks my conscience to take advantage of the AWAY player, it really does, but when everone else is doing it, I sort of can't help myself, & I join in. Path of least resistance these days, me.
Bully for you for sticking to your principles.
It is quite a controversial/awkward situation really, I bet views will be polarised one way or the other.
I knew you would not mind being named, and yes, I do think is it great to discuss these things like grown-ups, instead of all the "joke", "lol" & "sort it out" nonsense.
It's good to talk.
interesting...however you give mr BB a free ride with whatever garbabe he has. I knocked someone out the other day with TTT3, flopped a T and bye bye limped A's. you could argue that raising in SB with med-good hands is better because they fold poor and some med hands. if its Sb med/good hand vs BB good hands so be it, by your method the moneys going in anyway.
away players are part of he game, If I get disconnected I expect the players to take advantage, and if you forgot you regged and are having tea-tough! IMO players who tangle during the bubble with an away player should be shot.
as for profitability I do ok. I think the £11s are the most profitable as long as theres 1-2 poorer players. at the 3.3 level, its actually harder, cos PF its 3/4 way to the flop=less stealing, at the bubble, people call more hence more variance
anyway, I lost a 5.5 last night RR AI AKQ2s over btn max PFR with BB only having 2.8BB-Doh (I lost)
Incidentally, if the AWAY player had MORE chips than me & I had lost the game, I might just have been a bit peeved.
Which, in reality, does not change a thing, not one iota, as the "dilemma" thing remains exactly what it is.
So yes, I'd have been peeved, but I'd not have thought any less of you, it is your perfect right to play any way you wish within the rules.
Tangling with AWAY players on the bubble? There you go, that's the thing, we all see that different. I tend to dislike it, & sort of think "sigh", but they do have the perfect right to do it.
Very interesting topic!
Whilst on the topic of "odd spots".....
In one £11 DYM last night, there were FIVE of us left at 400-800.
So, with 12,000 chips in play, the average stack was 2,400, which equates to THREE Bigs each!
Think that's called "shallow stacks". One chap - the chippie with 5 Bigs (!) actually LIMPED in twice.
The four handed situation, with one player away, and two players still going at it, is about 78 thousand times more a common thing in NLH DYMs than in PLO8.
Funny old world and all that, to each their own. You pays your money and all that malarkey.
I don't understand what you meant tho Gelders, by saying this..
"Guess that'll have to be another group of ploppers that i upset with my play"
I'm either blind or daft, but who on earth is upset?! I wish we had a hundred more Gelders come play the game and I'm sure everyone who plays it a bit, feels exactly the same.
PS. Tikay, top marks with your spite-raise chat-box comment! Loved it.
Fist up, the honour (?) of the 2,000th Post on the 100th page of this thread goes to Twiglet, congrats.
What Gelders meant, I believe, by "upset some more ploppers", is that some players were getting a bit hot under the collar with Geldy's aggressive style earlier this week, all that "really" nonsense. There is no evidence that Geldy has lost any sleep over it though....
Lol @ my "SPITE CALL". I don't recall the exact hands, but I had a great hand, & you had a (much) greater hand (Aces I think) & Spite-Busted me. BOOM! That'll teach me.....
Love this game, we do our conkers & still lol about it.
Excuse me !!!
Also a couple of days ago Nick (pompeynic) was 'away' and got blinded down to less than 1 BB, he then won that one (while still away) and I think another hand while away. Then he came back and I busted a couple of hands later.
I could play against 5 players who are 'away' at the moment and I suspect I would go out in 4th.
On the other side of variance was a small £5.50 PLO8 MTT last night when I won it !!!!! Must have run good then!