each to there own i dnt think it is big look at the dea money out there u pick up 3.5k if they fold and if some 1 calls ya crushing or a 50/50
i hate playing flops with 30 bigs or less coz if we miss the flop what do we do bet n get called then waht ya in a tricky situation for me 30 bigs or less when 2 limpers just jam u dnt really wanna see a flop as alot of time u just miss
each to there own i dnt think it is big look at the dea money out there u pick up 3.5k if they fold and if some 1 calls ya crushing or a 50/50 i hate playing flops with 30 bigs or less coz if we miss the flop what do we do bet n get called then waht ya in a tricky situation for me 30 bigs or less when 2 limpers just jam u dnt really wanna see a flop as alot of time u just miss Posted by IDONKCALLU
+1 depending on table dynamic
& building an image that you like to squeeze can be useful in getting called light later on
I think 28 bigs is way too big to shove over 2 limpers. I'd say it's even a bit too big to shove over a raise, probably even more so live. I don't expect them to have a big hand anyway, so what I want is for them to limp/call OOP and then get owned postflop Posted by Lambert180
Not sure about this. The prefailing feature of live tournament poker imo is people hate to call for their torunament life. So if you're 3bet shoving AK with 28bb, as long as you're doing it with all sorts, I think it can be super profitable. Uncontested chips ftw!
Think oppo's behind will 3 bet call it off with worse than call a raise jam More likely going to see hands that have you in bad shape the majority when you just jam Posted by rancid
+1
They've only committed 1xBB so far, they aint gonna stick in another 27xBB without a very strong hand.
I know we miss the flop a lot Donk, but they miss the flop just as often too, and we almost certainly have the best hand V a l/c range and have position on both limpers.
From what I've read, just shoving AK over the limpers when playing 28BB is losing a lot of value. You should have a raise/get it in range here as well as a raise/fold range. The one thing I don't think we're deep enough to do is raise/call to a small bet, which means we can't really flat the top of our get it in range for deception some of the time.
AK is firmly in my raise/get it in range, even if one of the limpers rejams (I saw people doing the old limp/raise from early position with things other than Aces or Kings).
From what I've read, just shoving AK over the limpers when playing 28BB is losing a lot of value. You should have a raise/get it in range here as well as a raise/fold range. The one thing I don't think we're deep enough to do is raise/call to a small bet, which means we can't really flat the top of our get it in range for deception some of the time. AK is firmly in my raise/get it in range, even if one of the limpers rejams (I saw people doing the old limp/raise from early position with things other than Aces or Kings). Posted by TommyD
Losing a lot of value to say the least, part of the strength of AK is getting hands we dominate involved. So we jam and cause AQ/AJ/KQ etc out of the pot and only get called by big pocket pairs. Just seems a terrible way to play AK that deep in a £1k event.
Out of interest, what hands would be in the jam range?
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 20NL to 50NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 50NL by the end of 2013 ----- : Losing a lot of value to say the least, part of the strength of AK is getting hands we dominate involved. So we jam and cause AQ/AJ/KQ etc out of the pot and only get called by big pocket pairs. Just seems a terrible way to play AK that deep in a £1k event. Out of interest, what hands would be in the jam range? Posted by MattBates
AA/KK only in your jam range if you think oppo is limp.calling 99+AQ+ ) maybe not !!
Surely we should have nothing in our jam range the first time the action is on us.
Our raise/get it in range would be interesting. I think it changes between the person who did put us in (and others yet to act obviously) and both limpers, and we can probably split ranges for open limp and limper as well.
Against the former I like AQ+ TT+ against a thinking aggressive player, with 99 maybe in there. That might be a too tight calling range actually, would like to hear comments.
Now against the limpers, well I saw one fellow in this comp limp/3bet a few times, but that was earlier on. He had QQ and AKo the times he showed. Against the first one I might be as tight as QQ+ AK+. Against the second limper I probably revert back to the earlier range. Stack sizes really matter here as well.
with a jam range i think u can fold out flips tho i like the jam coz u get 88 99 even 10 10 to fold and pick up the extra 3.5k added to ya stack id much rather shove then raise 3 x etc and then if u miss the flop hoping opponent folds think thats just gambling
with a jam range i think u can fold out flips tho i like the jam coz u get 88 99 even 10 10 to fold and pick up the extra 3.5k added to ya stack id much rather shove then raise 3 x etc and then if u miss the flop hoping opponent folds think thats just gambling Posted by IDONKCALLU
That is the problem with the jam, you fold out the hands where you are dominating/in a flip and get called when you are crushed. Also by raising an aggro player might jam behind with AQ/KQ suited if he thinks we are at it trying to bully the limpers whereas he isn't likely to hero it off with AQ/KQ etc.
By raising you need to play the streets and evaluate but thats just poker
Surely we should have nothing in our jam range the first time the action is on us. Our raise/get it in range would be interesting. I think it changes between the person who did put us in (and others yet to act obviously) and both limpers, and we can probably split ranges for open limp and limper as well. Against the former I like AQ+ TT+ against a thinking aggressive player, with 99 maybe in there. That might be a too tight calling range actually, would like to hear comments. Now against the limpers, well I saw one fellow in this comp limp/3bet a few times, but that was earlier on. He had QQ and AKo the times he showed. Against the first one I might be as tight as QQ+ AK+. Against the second limper I probably revert back to the earlier range. Stack sizes really matter here as well. Posted by TommyD
Kinda prefer GII range - this was 9 handed though with antes
V open limp QQ+AK
V over limp JJ’s+AQ+
Cold 4 bet JJ+AK+ v thinking aggro
KK/AA versus old man who never played a hand
Deffo agree that you need very specific conditions to jam AA/KK against open limp UTG
FWIW, if anyone didn't read the full MC update, the person that shipped was the open limper, which probably was worst case scenario but I'd already decided before I acted that there was no1 behind that I wouldn't snap a ship from.
Dunno how I've managed to keep forgetting to put this in my diary but we got tickets around Christmas time to see Derren Brown's latest live show in Oxford so me and Emma will be going to see him tomorrow night
On a poker topic, night off the cash for me I think, I'll be playing the ME and Mini and see if there's any other MTTs that take my fancy.
you would not jam 28bbs wae jj+ so jamming 28bbs just looks like you are not comfortable playing the flop and your range hands would be like 66-10s,ak,aq,aj and also when you get called most of these hands will be in bad shape imo.
think me personally raise to around 5k+ and call it off if shipped like others have said.
Standard Lambo, was supposed to be a night off cash but I bust my MTTs so early, I decided to play some.
Played the £2.20 rebuy £400 GTD - It got 92 runners, and I was doing great the whole way, was down to 18 and I was chip leader (stacks are shallow in this though), 12 get paid, £120 FTW, I lose 2 flips within 3 mins and end up finishing in 14th. Hate them kinda finishes, rather go out first than runbad near the bubble and bust. On the upside, I went outside for a smoke on the break, and I'd forgot it was the add-on break too lol, so saved £2.20 there
Played the ME and mini, doubled up fairly early in the ME, not all in one go, just a collection of picking off small pots. Then managed to bust just before 9pm, was feeling pretty sigh and wasn't doing great in the Mini anyway so ended up doing a questionable (lol) 3bet ship with 96s BB v a BTN open, called by 7s and lost.
So that's £20.90 down on MTTs.
Loaded up 6 cash tables and ran pretty sick, just constant sets, smashing flops, getting paid, loads of premium pairs. The only time I can recall losing with a premium pair was when someone flopped a set V my AA. I did also lay a pretty sick cooler on someone, how disgusting is this river for the villian....
Player
Action
Cards
Amount
Pot
Balance
Lambert180
Small blind
£0.15
£0.15
£58.61
moomin13
Big blind
£0.30
£0.45
£29.15
Your hole cards
9
7
X
Call
£0.30
£0.75
£28.40
stacker59
Fold
argo
Call
£0.30
£1.05
£38.12
Lambert180
Call
£0.15
£1.20
£58.46
moomin13
Check
Flop
K
10
9
Lambert180
Check
moomin13
Check
X
Check
argo
Check
Turn
9
Lambert180
Bet
£0.75
£1.95
£57.71
moomin13
Fold
X
Call
£0.75
£2.70
£27.65
argo
Fold
River
7
Lambert180
Bet
£6.80
£9.50
£50.91
X
All-in
£27.65
£37.15
£0.00
Lambert180
Raise
£41.70
£78.85
£9.21
Lambert180
Unmatched bet
£20.85
£58.00
£30.06
Lambert180
Show
9
7
X
Show
7
7
Lambert180
Win
Full House, 9s and 7s
£56.20
£86.26
Finished with a profit of £149.19 which is pretty decent for abuot 2hr 30 mins play.
how disgusting is this river for the villian.... Posted by Lambert180
Pretty disgusting!
Obviously nice to be accommodated but what is the thinking with the open on the river, £6.80 into £2.70? I guess a flush calls off maybe, and you should really only be getting raised by worse if he has exactly what he did have, a smaller FH or they think your bet is way too bluffy. Would like to understand it, as my cash game is not great.
Well it was opponent dependent and I'm pretty confident with a lot of their made hands if they'll call a 'standard' value bet, they'll call an overbet too. This move will work less often than say a £1.80 value bet, but then it only has to work about 30% of the time compared to the smaller bet to be good.
Also think oppo is passive and there are so many hands he will just flat call with (trip 9s, flushes, 2prs) that he would be willing to call a much bigger bet with. Obv got super lucky here by taking him to coolerville.
Something someone said to me ages ago is 'stop thinking people all make perfect decisions'. I agree it's a real push for anyone good to raise me here with worse, but
1) that doesn't mean they're good and won't raise with worse.
2) I want the max value when they just call (I wasn't expecting a raise)
I love the huge overbets with nut hands in random live cash games. We don't need to worry about being balanced in these and so many live players convince themselves it must be a bluff and call or even stack off.
I'll never forget a hand where i completed in the sb with ace rag suited and backdoored a flush after it had been checked round on flop and turn I led out into the £5 or £6 pot for £60 and got shoved on by UTG who had checked every street with... AA
So me and Emma went to see Derren Brown's new show 'Infamous's last night. We went to KFC before it kicked off (cue JJ asking what I ordered...) which is always a good start to any outing
He's asked for no spoilers to be given as it will ruin parts of the show so I'll adhere to that, but I can say that it was a fantastic show. At one point he did want a poker player up on stage so asked any poker players to put their hands up, there was only about 10 of us but sadly I didn't get picked.
Due to the 'no spoilers' thing I can't say too much but yet again Derren Brown doesn't fail to impress. I understand at a very general level how he does a lot of what he does, but some of the 'events' just left me speechless. Definitely worth going to see if you can still get a ticket!
So me and Emma went to see Derren Brown's new show 'Infamous's last night. We went to KFC before it kicked off (cue JJ asking what I ordered...) which is always a good start to any outing He's asked for no spoilers to be given as it will ruin parts of the show so I'll adhere to that, but I can say that it was a fantastic show. At one point he did want a poker player up on stage so asked any poker players to put their hands up, there was only about 10 of us but sadly I didn't get picked. Due to the 'no spoilers' thing I can't say too much but yet again Derren Brown doesn't fail to impress. I understand at a very general level how he does a lot of what he does, but some of the 'events' just left me speechless. Definitely worth going to see if you can still get a ticket! Posted by Lambert180
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 20NL to 50NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 50NL by the end of 2013 ----- : Go on then....... and Go on then....... Posted by DOHHHHHHH
It's not my usual, but I thought I'd go 'lite' and just get a boneless banquet box thing.
Well I did say a very general level lol... but a lot of his stuff relies on the power of suggestion, and implanting ideas into people's heads. Like obv he's not a mind reader, he's just getting people to think what he wants them to. Obviously that only applies to some of his 'tricks', some of them I have no idea.
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 20NL to 50NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 50NL by the end of 2013 ----- : It's not my usual, but I thought I'd go 'lite' and just get a boneless banquet box thing. Well I did say a very general level lol... but a lot of his stuff relies on the power of suggestion, and implanting ideas into people's heads. Like obv he's not a mind reader, he's just getting people to think what he wants them to. Obviously that only applies to some of his 'tricks', some of them I have no idea. Posted by Lambert180
He is totally amazing
A lot of it is based on suggestion, do you find yourself being taken in by things on the way in to the event etc.. Did you notice signs, colours, music etc..
I thought I'd steal an idea for a diary topic that I saw an excellent player do must be at least 12+ months ago now. I'm sure he'll know who I mean if he sees this.
People often say that poker books are outdated these days and while I do agree to an extent, they are still a great way of establishing some solid fundamentals in your game.
So here is my very small collection of poker books...
In order of when I got them...
Winner's Guide To Texas Hold 'Em - This was the first poker book I ever got and I got it from my brother for Xmas when I was about 17. This is one book I can definitely say has slightly outdated parts to it, and does largely reference Limit Hold 'Em, probably because it was published so long ago that it was the game of choice at the time. Still has some very useful information though.
The Theory of Poker - Very tough going in parts but I'd say it's a must-read for anyone that wants to take the game seriously. On my first read, there was just so much that I didn't take in and probably wasn't ready for at the time but a 2nd read through years later has made me appreciate it a lot more. Winning Poker Tournaments... Vol 1 & 2 - Great books imo. They are essentially just a collection of HHs from 3 very successful online MTT grinders, explaining their thought processes throughout every hand. The 2 books combined deal with everything from the first hand of a tournament to playing HU ftw.
Every Hand Revealed - Not a strategy book as such, and probably isn't going to improve your game a huge amount but it's very interested to get an insight into Gus Hansen's mind. 10/10 for entertainment value.
Kill Everyone - The latest book to my collection, bought for me on my last birthday by Emma. Another really good book, again in parts it can be tough going and sometimes feels like there's a bit too much to take in when it comes to things like trying to work out basic ICM calcs in your head, but it's well worth putting in the work to take in the information.
=========================================
Next on my list to buy... Vol 3 of Winning Poker Tournaments: One Hand at a Time. Also The Mental Game of Poker 2 which will no doubt be worth it's weight in gold to anyone who has a penchant for playing their C game way too often.
kill everyone is a must imo so is the pearljammer apestyles colab. read the 1st page of the post not the rest, just wondering how your progressing with the heads up sngs as i used to play hypers and break even point was about 53% due to rake which is dueable but teadiace. + why have you gone for the 50bi rule 2 be honest its player dependant as 50bi rule would help if you where a lag but tite nit can push 20-25 buyins. i personally stick to 25 buyins and if i lose 5 i step down but yeah hope you get there if your not all ready there.
Yeah Kill Everyone and Winning Poker Tournaments... are both great books.
I don't play HU SnGs anymore, I've chopped and changed the format I play ALOT since the 1st page of this diary, and have pretty much been through every game you can play.
For the last probably 7-8 months I've been playing mostly cash, with the odd few MTTs chucked in. I dunno if you're talking about a BI rule for Hypers or cash...
To be honest, I think with regards to BRM, it's mostly down to the individual to an extent, although if you wanna take the game seriously and stay in the game to consistently make money, then you need to be nitty with BRM. If you don't care about going bust, then within reason, really you can do whatever you want,
FWIW, I aint a tight nit but even tight nits still experience downswings where AA never holds etc. Just in April alone at 30NL I've had a few sessions +£200 and a few -£200 (give or take). If I only had 20 BIs (£600), then losing £200 in one session would feel pretty brutal. I could always step down at that point, but if I can beat 30NL to the same standard I can beat 20NL then obviously we don't wanna put ourselves in a situation where we have to move down.
Does also kinda depend on your mental abililty, some people will have £200, lose £50 in one night and can sit down the next night, completetly refreshed ready to play their A game again, whereas some will sit down the next night thinking 'I lost 25% of my BR last night, I HAVE to win tonight' and play badly. I'm somewhere in the middle of them 2 examples, and having a bigger BR means I find it easier to shrug off losses.
As I move up to 50NL and 100NL, I'm gonna need to be even nittier with my BRM, and when/if I am consistently grinding 100NL and withdrawing regularly, then I'd want at least 150 BIs for the level.
Comments
I don't expect them to have a big hand anyway, so what I want is for them to limp/call OOP and then get owned postflop
FWIW raise a little more pre and hopefully someone raises u with worse
ul next race please )
More likely going to see hands that have you in bad shape the majority when you just jam
But, yeah, I wouldn't open shove after 2 limpers.
They've only committed 1xBB so far, they aint gonna stick in another 27xBB without a very strong hand.
I know we miss the flop a lot Donk, but they miss the flop just as often too, and we almost certainly have the best hand V a l/c range and have position on both limpers.
AK is firmly in my raise/get it in range, even if one of the limpers rejams (I saw people doing the old limp/raise from early position with things other than Aces or Kings).
Out of interest, what hands would be in the jam range?
everything else is either call or raise/fold
Our raise/get it in range would be interesting. I think it changes between the person who did put us in (and others yet to act obviously) and both limpers, and we can probably split ranges for open limp and limper as well.
Against the former I like AQ+ TT+ against a thinking aggressive player, with 99 maybe in there. That might be a too tight calling range actually, would like to hear comments.
Now against the limpers, well I saw one fellow in this comp limp/3bet a few times, but that was earlier on. He had QQ and AKo the times he showed. Against the first one I might be as tight as QQ+ AK+. Against the second limper I probably revert back to the earlier range. Stack sizes really matter here as well.
By raising you need to play the streets and evaluate but thats just poker
Kinda prefer GII range - this was 9 handed though with antes
V open limp QQ+AK
V over limp JJ’s+AQ+
Cold 4 bet JJ+AK+ v thinking aggro
KK/AA versus old man who never played a hand
Deffo agree that you need very specific conditions to jam AA/KK against open limp UTG
=============================================================================
Dunno how I've managed to keep forgetting to put this in my diary but we got tickets around Christmas time to see Derren Brown's latest live show in Oxford so me and Emma will be going to see him tomorrow night
On a poker topic, night off the cash for me I think, I'll be playing the ME and Mini and see if there's any other MTTs that take my fancy.
Seems very standard to me raise get in, just win flip next time think u played it fine
Sounds like could have gone either way but good run still, better luck next time cheers for the report
Played the £2.20 rebuy £400 GTD - It got 92 runners, and I was doing great the whole way, was down to 18 and I was chip leader (stacks are shallow in this though), 12 get paid, £120 FTW, I lose 2 flips within 3 mins and end up finishing in 14th. Hate them kinda finishes, rather go out first than runbad near the bubble and bust. On the upside, I went outside for a smoke on the break, and I'd forgot it was the add-on break too lol, so saved £2.20 there
Played the ME and mini, doubled up fairly early in the ME, not all in one go, just a collection of picking off small pots. Then managed to bust just before 9pm, was feeling pretty sigh and wasn't doing great in the Mini anyway so ended up doing a questionable (lol) 3bet ship with 96s BB v a BTN open, called by 7s and lost.
So that's £20.90 down on MTTs.
Loaded up 6 cash tables and ran pretty sick, just constant sets, smashing flops, getting paid, loads of premium pairs. The only time I can recall losing with a premium pair was when someone flopped a set V my AA. I did also lay a pretty sick cooler on someone, how disgusting is this river for the villian....
Bankroll: £1,741.30
Poker Points: 5273 (£94.91)
Also think oppo is passive and there are so many hands he will just flat call with (trip 9s, flushes, 2prs) that he would be willing to call a much bigger bet with. Obv got super lucky here by taking him to coolerville.
Something someone said to me ages ago is 'stop thinking people all make perfect decisions'. I agree it's a real push for anyone good to raise me here with worse, but
1) that doesn't mean they're good and won't raise with worse.
2) I want the max value when they just call (I wasn't expecting a raise)
We don't need to worry about being balanced in these and so many live players convince themselves it must be a bluff and call or even stack off.
I'll never forget a hand where i completed in the sb with ace rag suited and backdoored a flush after it had been checked round on flop and turn
I led out into the £5 or £6 pot for £60 and got shoved on by UTG who had checked every street with... AA
I miss that game
@Rancid -Nah, no blocks, I'll reply to your PM in a sec.
He's asked for no spoilers to be given as it will ruin parts of the show so I'll adhere to that, but I can say that it was a fantastic show. At one point he did want a poker player up on stage so asked any poker players to put their hands up, there was only about 10 of us but sadly I didn't get picked.
Due to the 'no spoilers' thing I can't say too much but yet again Derren Brown doesn't fail to impress. I understand at a very general level how he does a lot of what he does, but some of the 'events' just left me speechless. Definitely worth going to see if you can still get a ticket!
Well I did say a very general level lol... but a lot of his stuff relies on the power of suggestion, and implanting ideas into people's heads. Like obv he's not a mind reader, he's just getting people to think what he wants them to. Obviously that only applies to some of his 'tricks', some of them I have no idea.
A lot of it is based on suggestion, do you find yourself being taken in by things on the way in to the event etc..
Did you notice signs, colours, music etc..
Brown is a freak !
People often say that poker books are outdated these days and while I do agree to an extent, they are still a great way of establishing some solid fundamentals in your game.
So here is my very small collection of poker books...
In order of when I got them...
Winner's Guide To Texas Hold 'Em - This was the first poker book I ever got and I got it from my brother for Xmas when I was about 17. This is one book I can definitely say has slightly outdated parts to it, and does largely reference Limit Hold 'Em, probably because it was published so long ago that it was the game of choice at the time. Still has some very useful information though.
The Theory of Poker - Very tough going in parts but I'd say it's a must-read for anyone that wants to take the game seriously. On my first read, there was just so much that I didn't take in and probably wasn't ready for at the time but a 2nd read through years later has made me appreciate it a lot more.
Winning Poker Tournaments... Vol 1 & 2 - Great books imo. They are essentially just a collection of HHs from 3 very successful online MTT grinders, explaining their thought processes throughout every hand. The 2 books combined deal with everything from the first hand of a tournament to playing HU ftw.
Every Hand Revealed - Not a strategy book as such, and probably isn't going to improve your game a huge amount but it's very interested to get an insight into Gus Hansen's mind. 10/10 for entertainment value.
Kill Everyone - The latest book to my collection, bought for me on my last birthday by Emma. Another really good book, again in parts it can be tough going and sometimes feels like there's a bit too much to take in when it comes to things like trying to work out basic ICM calcs in your head, but it's well worth putting in the work to take in the information.
=========================================
Next on my list to buy... Vol 3 of Winning Poker Tournaments: One Hand at a Time. Also The Mental Game of Poker 2 which will no doubt be worth it's weight in gold to anyone who has a penchant for playing their C game way too often.
read the 1st page of the post not the rest, just wondering how your progressing with the heads up sngs
as i used to play hypers and break even point was about 53% due to rake which is dueable but teadiace.
+ why have you gone for the 50bi rule
2 be honest its player dependant as 50bi rule would help if you where a lag but tite nit can push 20-25 buyins.
i personally stick to 25 buyins and if i lose 5 i step down but yeah hope you get there if your not all ready there.
Yeah Kill Everyone and Winning Poker Tournaments... are both great books.
I don't play HU SnGs anymore, I've chopped and changed the format I play ALOT since the 1st page of this diary, and have pretty much been through every game you can play.
For the last probably 7-8 months I've been playing mostly cash, with the odd few MTTs chucked in. I dunno if you're talking about a BI rule for Hypers or cash...
To be honest, I think with regards to BRM, it's mostly down to the individual to an extent, although if you wanna take the game seriously and stay in the game to consistently make money, then you need to be nitty with BRM. If you don't care about going bust, then within reason, really you can do whatever you want,
FWIW, I aint a tight nit but even tight nits still experience downswings where AA never holds etc. Just in April alone at 30NL I've had a few sessions +£200 and a few -£200 (give or take). If I only had 20 BIs (£600), then losing £200 in one session would feel pretty brutal. I could always step down at that point, but if I can beat 30NL to the same standard I can beat 20NL then obviously we don't wanna put ourselves in a situation where we have to move down.
Does also kinda depend on your mental abililty, some people will have £200, lose £50 in one night and can sit down the next night, completetly refreshed ready to play their A game again, whereas some will sit down the next night thinking 'I lost 25% of my BR last night, I HAVE to win tonight' and play badly. I'm somewhere in the middle of them 2 examples, and having a bigger BR means I find it easier to shrug off losses.
As I move up to 50NL and 100NL, I'm gonna need to be even nittier with my BRM, and when/if I am consistently grinding 100NL and withdrawing regularly, then I'd want at least 150 BIs for the level.