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Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.

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  • edited June 2012
    PEOPLE OF BLACKPOOL!!!

    I NEED YOUR HELP!!!!

    Ahem, sorry for the shouting but on the back of my Vegas advice I'd now like some Blackpool advice.  I can't make it to your fine town until the Saturday of the SPT, but I love theme park rides, especially the Coasters.

    1)  I may have limited time to ride, what's the best theme park like ride on the pier/beach?  Is there a decent coaster?

    2)  Are they open Sundays?

    I'm already planning some Vegas rides, including as suggested by my brother, a freefall-like dive off of a very tall building, I think it's the Stratosphere.  Cheers bruv, that won't scare the life out of me or anything.
  • edited June 2012
    Hi mate.

    The Pepsi Max roller Coaster (now called 'The Big One' I think is well worth a try.

    I would also recommend Valhalla BUT you need to be prepared to get very wet!!!!!!!!!!

    Hope ur enjoying ur hols :)
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    Hi mate. The Pepsi Max roller Coaster (now called 'The Big One' I think is well worth a try. I would also recommend Valhalla BUT you need to be prepared to get very wet!!!!!!!!!! Hope ur enjoying ur hols :)
    Posted by phil12uk
    I think my Sunday morning is sorted now, cheers Phil!!!
  • edited June 2012
    Football news

    As long time readers of this diary will know, I do a bit of footy commentary.  As we have one of the most interesting Euro champs ever (The first time the old Eastern Block have hosted the comp as far as I know, England have very little expectation etc) I will be doing a daily review for the first week here (I'm moving after that and no no to internet, sadface.jpeg).  It's a major interest of mine and will hopefully be interesting to you.  If not, hopefully I'll have my normal waffle in here as well.
  • edited June 2012
    Well I was going to post this much earlier but the Friday night Open kept me a little busy.

    [ ] Thin

    So let's look at the Euro Champs through the eyes of a Sunday League Slogger.

    First up was one of the hosts Poland taking on former champs from the land of financial hiccups, Greece.  I'm going to brush over the opening ceremony.  There were flags, someone doing kick ups and some kind of dancers.  The real plus point was it was short.  Still not the worst I've ever seen though, who can forget two grown men in bargain hunt Halloween costumes enacting George Versus the Dragon.  A jubilee flotilla it was not.

    The opening game is normally a boring affair, this was no where near boring.  Poland came to play and should have gone in at half time many more than their one goal ahead.  The Greek defence suddenly became the second most flimsy thing associated with that country.  It was also in that first half that I assume the referee, Mr Carballo, decided to announce to the world that he is the new owner of Clinton cards.  Yellows popping out all over the place followed by a Red that's the harshest I've seen for some time.

    Sadly for Poland it was a game of two halves.  The Greeks level after Szczesny decided to attempt to out do the other keeper on the pitch by flailing at a ball to allow the equaliser and then to level the men on the field plus give away a peno at the same time.  Penalty saved and the game ended in a draw but never petered out.  Excited all the way through and honours even.  Great start to the championships.

    We switch to the other game in the group.  Czech Republic V Russia.  I thought this would be tight, pundit fail.  Russia came out like men possessed.  Inspired by a video of President Putin chopping down Redwoods with his bare hands, probably, they crushed the Czechs.  They did it the old Nottingham Forest glory days way.  Let the other team play for 15 minutes, realise they're not all that and score some goals.  Despite some wasteful finishing for the first hour Russia finished running out 4-1 winners in an exciting game.

    And just as the game finished I got a call for a BBQ football night at a mate's tomorrow.  Suddenly everyone is really into this event, myself included.  And it's not about England, it's the fact that there are some very good match ups out there and quite a few decent teams.  Spain will probably still win but by golly it'll be fun getting there.

    Happy BBQ all
  • edited June 2012
    Congrats Mr D. Sir,
     Nice little boost before your Vegas jolly, I trust you will be giving your winnings from the 6K Rebuy to your good lady by way of compensation/retail therapy allowance for your upcoming absence.
     Loving the match reports, I don't need to bother with the BBC website (at least for the 1st week) now if I miss a game. As a former goalkeeper myself, the 1st game highlighted how easily in that position you can either be the villain or in the case of the sub keeper the hero. 
     I will look forward to your take on Englands game v France probably more than I look forward to the game itself.

    Mike  

  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    Congrats Mr D. Sir,  Nice little boost before your Vegas jolly, I trust you will be giving your winnings from the 6K Rebuy to your good lady by way of compensation/retail therapy allowance for your upcoming absence.  Loving the match reports, I don't need to bother with the BBC website (at least for the 1st week) now if I miss a game. As a former goalkeeper myself, the 1st game highlighted how easily in that position you can either be the villain or in the case of the sub keeper the hero.   I will look forward to your take on Englands game v France probably more than I look forward to the game itself. Mike  
    Posted by Woogie8688
    Cheers Woogie

    Jolly?  A jolly?!?!?!?  It'll be strictly business, I shall be wearing a suit on tie for the duration.  Funny you should mention the missus.  I've decided to gift a friend 1% of my WSOP action mainly because he's a real good dude, it's part of a total of 5% I am mentally allocating for fun swaps etc when we get there, the only pieces of my action I intend to give up as I'm not selling any.  I mentioned this to her this morning.  That was a mistake.  She immediately asked me if I realised what 5% of six million is, not a hint of irony in her voice.  I don't think she realises how unlikely it is that I will cash let alone run deep.  I must look at her credit card bill to see how much of the first prize she's already spent, I might be dancing for pennies on the strip if it's bad.

    Thanks for you kind words about the reports, I'm just trying to get into my sports writing again, did stuff like that on the internet an age ago and I kind of miss it.  I'm the sub keeper for my Sunday League team and due to our main keeper having a two year knee injury I've spent many a wet morning in the net.  I know more than most how hard that position is and I also know that it's much less about being an amazing shot stopper and much more about decision making.  On that topic I loved how the BBC commentary were in innuendo overdrive, my fave being Mark Bright's audition to be the voice of Durex.

    'It's your responsibility if you come.'  It's a motto we should all live by.
  • edited June 2012



    Nice result last night for ya....I suppose....ish :)

    Can you add the scorers to your footy reports please?, as it will make it easier for me to check my fantasy teams TYVM.
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    Nice result last night for ya....I suppose....ish :) Can you add the scorers to your footy reports please?, as it will make it easier for me to check my fantasy teams TYVM.
    Posted by MAXALLY
    The Russians score four and you want their names?  FML  ;)

    Of course Maxy, anything for you.

    Day 1

    Poland 1              Greece 1
    R.Lewandowski      D.Salpingidis

    Russia 4              Czech Rep 1
    A.Dzagoev(2)       V.Pilar
    R.Shirokov
    R.Pavlyuchenko
  • edited June 2012
    And so with a song in our heart and rejuvenated love of international football in our veins we move onto Day 2 and Group B.

    We start with the first match in the Ukraine and the group of death.  Perennial missed potential versus the only team to win this competition after failing to qualify for the finals, two former Euro champs and teams with a great wealth of football history, albeit from two ends of football philosophy.  Denmark take on the Netherlands.  Or Holland.  Denmark take on both The Netherlands and Holland, doesn't seem fair somehow.

    The standard of excitement continued at a surprising high for this game.  The Danes buoyed with confidence came into it believing they could get a draw and thinking they could get out of this nightmare group.  The Dutch were tipped by all but their own fans as a decent shout for a deep run in the tournament.  Holland dominated, creating chance after chance.  Club talisman RVP saw many a ball fall to him which would have been dispatched with ease if he was wearing a red top  Sadly he was wearing Orange, as Van Gogh called it - the colour of madness.  And if you were a Dutch fan who wasn't a little dolally before, then the glut of wasted opportunities that came and went might well tip you over the edge and into Bedlam.  RVP couldn't find his form.  Robben looked allergic to the goal.  Even when the much touted Huntelaar and Van De Vart were sent in from the bench the almost constant wave after wave of Orange attack crashed onto the rocks of a stoic Danish defense.  Agger and his fellow backliners were immense without the ball.  They looked like an under 7s team with it and should never try total football again, but in defending they were superb.  A first half strike by one man sandwich shop advert, Krohn-Dehli, gave them something to protect.  And protect it they did, like a medieval maiden choosing to wear two chastity belts to secure her virtue, you know, just in case.

    So with our first shock of the tournament in an exciting game, Denmark thinking they are half way out of the group and the Dutch staring first round exit square in the face, we move to the first big match of the tournament.

    Germany v Portugal.  Two great teams with such attacking flair.  Or so you would think on paper.  In reality Germany are seasoned campaigners who know you can't win a cup in the group stages, but you can lose it.  And Portugal's attacking players disguise a team mentality they have had for some time, to be tight, hard to beat and let's not get too excited going forward please.  And suddenly we have our first dry affair of the competition.  A game of few chances, neither keeper following the lead of their contemporaries from Day 1, no one really going for it.  Germany looked comfortable yet rarely stretched Portugal, who tried to hit on the counter and put their faith in the superstars they have to pull off a magic moment rather than attack as a team.  Hogwarts was absent, no magic to be found.  We did have the Portuguese hit the bar, have the ball bounce on the line and prepared ourselves for the first action of a 'Behind Goal-line Person' since the idea began.  No action occurred, I screamed at the TV that it was over the line.  It was not.  I should have gone to Specsavers.  Still no reason to bark at those statues in this comp yet.  Give me time.

    With the game drifting to a scoreless draw, veteran German striker Klosse was about to replace the rather lackluster Gomez.  Then Gomez produced one bit of quality, expertly steering a header into the corner.  And that was that.  A drab, dull affair won by a single goal.  Germans gonna German.

    On to Sunday now, and that distant elephant of England v France charges just a little closer.

    Demark 1 - Holland 0
    Krohn-Dehli

    Germany 1 - Portugal 0
    Gomez
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    Baffles me people playing Ferdinand !  Have u watched any football this season ? Personally i'd go : Hart Walker/richards     terry(c)   jones   cole johnson/walcott    wilshere  parker   cleverley   young               Bent  . Then stick rooney in when back from susp.  Gerrard n lamps super subs !  
    Posted by 1267
    I called it in febuary that Rio wouldn't go .   Brag.

    Seems like i can pick a good injury prone player tho ...    sigh
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary. : I called it in febuary that Rio wouldn't go .   Brag. Seems like i can pick a good injury prone player tho ...    sigh
    Posted by 1267
    Clean forgot about that early part of the diary mate, great shout.  Here's mine from then:

    Hart
    Walker
    Richards
    Ferdinand
    Cole
    Parker
    Carrick
    Young
    Downing
    Gerrard
    Welbeck

    Looks like I picked Downing way back then.  I think I was using the 'he's left footed, we need someone left footed' rule.  He might well play.  I still like mine, even with Downing. 
  • edited June 2012


    After Gary's thread, this is the one I read with my cup of coffee and first ciggy of the day! Cheers for the full reports on the footy......saves me going out for a paper. One point though....orange is not the colour of madness, it is the colour of TKP.......mmmmmm, actually Van the man could of had a valid point there! :)
  • edited June 2012
    I think 9 starters are pretty much nailed on for England.

    It's now just about wheather Downing will play left wing and milner right.  Or will he play Walcott and stick Milner left wing.
    then, who will play up front with Young.  Carrol or Welbeck.  I'd start Welbeck after his finish v Belgium and the fact hes got pace v 3 slow defenses in our group.
  • edited June 2012

    "One man sandwich shop advert" - absolutely hilarious Tommy great stuff along with the rest of it!

  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    After Gary's thread, this is the one I read with my cup of coffee and first ciggy of the day! Cheers for the full reports on the footy......saves me going out for a paper. One point though....orange is not the colour of madness, it is the colour of TKP.......mmmmmm, actually Van the man could of had a valid point there! :)
    Posted by MAXALLY
    Cheers mate!

    Yes when I made the orange reference I did think of a certain Sky Poker team.  Which reminds me, are you doing the man-kini prop bet at Blackpool.  I hear Don is really up for that, as is Greg.
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    I think 9 starters are pretty much nailed on for England. It's now just about wheather Downing will play left wing and milner right.  Or will he play Walcott and stick Milner left wing. then, who will play up front with Young.  Carrol or Welbeck.  I'd start Welbeck after his finish v Belgium and the fact hes got pace v 3 slow defenses in our group.
    Posted by 1267
    Roy seems to be all over Milner, a man who seems to be marmite for the pundits.  Some are saying no way he should start, others are saying he must start, doesn't seem to be much middle ground.  The wings reminds me of Euro 96 where it was McManaman and Anderton if we wanted to attack and Anderton with Stone if we wanted to stay compact.  Milner is the safe option if we're trying to be hard to beat, Young and Walcott if we want to attack.  A big problem for me is with the exception of Young and maybe the inexperienced but exciting Ox, the wide players are not in a great vein of form.  This kind of pushes me towards playing Milner on the right.

    Yes I'm going for Welbeck over Carrol as well, as long as we remember we don't have a target man and start lumping it forward.  Sadly we have form for doing this and the striker normally get the blame for it unfairly.
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    "One man sandwich shop advert" - absolutely hilarious Tommy great stuff along with the rest of it!
    Posted by elldixon18
    Appreciate that mate, I hope people are enjoying reading them as much as I'm enjoying writing them.
  • edited June 2012

    If this thread is gonna degenerate into a England Euro lovefest I MAY stop reading! ;-) Rumour has it they've booked flights home afer last group game so I might not be away long!

  • edited June 2012
    Moving home news.

    So I'm relocating this week.  I'm going to miss the flat.  We are going onto better things but I do love this place.  Mainly for the below, these are the views from my balcony.  Sorry for the picture quality, took these with an Ipad rather than a camera.











    What you are seeing through those bad pics is most of London.  From my window I can see the whole of the City of London (Shard, NatWest Tower etc), the Eye, BT Tower, Wembley Stadium when they turn the lights on, Alexandra Palace, White Hart Lane (heart) and a multitude of other landmarks.  Many a time mid grind I've gone on the balcony to take a moment to chill.  I just let in the view and it puts the silly things like getting two outered into great perceptive.

    I'm really going to miss it.
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary. : Cheers mate! Yes when I made the orange reference I did think of a certain Sky Poker team.  Which reminds me, are you doing the man-kini prop bet at Blackpool.  I hear Don is really up for that, as is Greg.
    Posted by TommyD
    I AM NOT GETTIN IN THAT THING
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary. : I AM NOT GETTIN IN THAT THING
    Posted by GREGHOGG
    Greg

    You'll do what Irene tells you to do.

    ;)
  • edited June 2012

    Great diary Tommy, loving the diversion into Euro 2012.

    Please don't compare this Eng squad to '96 though, we're gonna stink the place out. That's the most depressing thing about the Hodgson appointment - complete lack of ambition. Harry would have given us the closest thing to El Tel we could have - whatever happened, it would have been fun to watch.

    Now we're gonna be dull, drab, suffocating and die a slow & painful death.

    A potential Eng vs Ire quarter final is an enticing prospect though (until we get outplayed & lose). I really hope I'm proved wrong and if we win, no-one will care how we played - just can't see it though.

    Also, not being funny - but I can't see a single London landmark in any of those pics!
  • edited June 2012
    Cheers Jingle

    Believe me, I'm not comparing the two squads, just noting the similarity between the midfield options.  I'd love the Irish to do well, going to be watching their game today while with rampant interest.

    Regarding the pics, they're really bad.  Does anyone (Machka) know how to zoom the camera function on the IPad2?  I'm looking out of my kitchen window now and the Shard is just over an inch tall as I see it, which while may not sound like much is pretty big, those photos are coming out smaller than my natural view.  My digi camera is in the boxes for the move, along with the rest of my life.
  • edited June 2012
    A wet Sunday in the United Kingdom.  What better to do than play poker and watch some football.  The poker side of today?  I sucked worse than a Dyson unemtpied for a decade.  Splutter, splutter, smell a little bit.  So to the football and Group C's opening matches.

    We begin with the reigning champs and favourites for the tournament taking on the only team in world football who get more media pressure than England.  Spain versus Italy.  Goliath taking on a slightly smaller Goliath.  Both are fancied to advance from the group stages and given the history of both teams, especially Italy, you could be forgiven for thinking this would be a dour affair.  Spain not picking a recognised striker didn't help expectations.

    The game started cagey.  La Roja showed their excellence in fits and starts, hiccup fast passing, lightning movement and Anton Du Beke level dancing through the middle of the Azzuri defence.  Without a traditional centre forward the play of Silva, Inesta and Fabegas among others dotted the ball around the deck at blink and you miss it speed.  However without a real goalscorer on the end of the moves all of their play amounted to frustration with Buffon rarely tested.  It was great to witness but so is Schubert's Eighth Symphony, and that doesn't finish either.  For their part, the Italians grew into the first half and were arguably the better team when the first half drew to a close.  Casillas was the much busier keeper and the Italians clearly felt they could grind out one of their trademark single goal wins.

    The second half started quicker, with Italy still the stronger team.  A great chance fell to that splitter of opinions in the Premier league, Mario Balotelli.  The camera person obviously quite liked Mario, he was focussed on more than any other player.  The irony being the look in Mario's eyes seemed to say 'How can I get on TV today?'  You know, if he wasn't a supreme athlete I'm pretty sure you'd see him on Big Brother.  He had a great chance around the hour mark.  Sergio Ramos made an uncharacteristic error and allowed Balotelli through on goal.  At this point 'Super Mario' was hit by a time and space wormhole which slowed his running pace down to a crawl.  Either that or he thought the Spanish fullback's mentality after losing the ball was similar to his own.  Just before the Man City striker finally decided to pull the trigger on the shot, Ramos was back in play with a goal saving tackle.  Soon after Balotelli was subbed for Di Natale, the man hounded by the italian press for missing his spot kick in a shootout against the Spainish in a previous tournament.  Today was his day for redemption.  Igniting the pitch with some much missed pace Di Natale was through on goal, opened up the body marvelously and glided the ball into the corner.  Spurred into action Spain found a higher gear and almost immediately equalised, another break neck passing move this time with the finish courtesy of a lively looking Fabregas.  And so, in accordance with the prophecy, this game ended with honours even.

    We turn to the evening match in Poznan.  Ireland and Croatia.  Both teams knew that to have a realistic chance of progressing from the group, they had to win this game in the Polish rain.  This game is the closed I've seen so far to a Premier League game.  Physical challenges conducted with honour, giving and getting in the proper spirit, playing like men rather than children on roller-skates, it was a sweat and spit of a game.  Croatia shot out early with a quick headed goal only to be pulled back quite quickly by a classic Irish set piece.  But as the game went on the class of the Croatian cavaliers shone bright in the drizzled night.  Modric pulled more strings than a master puppeteer and looked so good I've decided to drive him to Manchester just to show him where he'd have to live if he signed for Man U.  Yes, lovely Moss Side.  Hands off Fergie.

    Croatia went on to tear apart the Irish defence both sides of the break, first with a delightful dink over Given off of a failed Irish clearance.  The player would have been offside in old money rules as the clearance was just after a Modric shot with Jelavic well off.  But apparently he was in phase two.  I, like anyone who hasn't digested every fiddle with the regulations of the game, have no idea what this means.  Just after the second half started the game was effectively over as a contest, a strong header rico-Shay-ing (sorry about that) into the net off of post and then a helpless Given forehead.  Keane was felled later on in the box and a clear penalty wasn't given, which just added to the frustration for the men in green.  Despite this, the right team won.  So Croatia looked classy and confident, but with sterner tests ahead.  And Ireland need to bond together and climb a footballing Everest to advance.

    Another day down and only one Group left to play.  I wonder who's in that one.

    Spain 1 -     Italy 1
    Fabregas     Di Natale

    Croatia 3     -   Republic of Ireland 1
    Mandzukic(2*)       St. Ledger
    Jelavic

    *For Fantasy Football people, some people are marking one of Mandzukic's goals as a Given OG.  I think they are wrong as the ball was heading into the net off of the post anyway but check your Fantasy Football listings for that ruling.
  • edited June 2012


    Cheers TD. Really enjoying your reports.

    Good luck with the house move BTW....hope it all goes to plan without any hitches. Actually, house moving is in the top 3 most stressful things you do in your life, apparently. The other two are getting hitched and watching Engerrrrrrr...land in major footy tournaments :) 
  • edited June 2012
    *For Fantasy Football people, some people are marking one of Mandzukic's goals as a Given OG.  I think they are wrong as the ball was heading into the net off of the post anyway but check your Fantasy Football listings for that ruling.
    Posted by TommyD

    Still lurking and enjoying the blogs Tommy, nice work.

    As for Euro2012, I've found this first round of games very entertaining, it's got the makings of the best international tournament in years, putting aside whatever England might do.

    I fancy we could actually have a good run, though to watch, maybe not as pleasing on the eye as most other teams, a bit like my beloved Stoke City!

    As for your Mandzukic / Given opinion, I have the opposite view, where I was thinking how could anyone consider giving a goal to Mandzukic for a an attempt that was not on target?

    Without the intervention of Given the ball was obviously destined to roll along the goal line, hit the other post and be cleared to safety by an Irish defender ;)

  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    Cheers TD. Really enjoying your reports. Good luck with the house move BTW....hope it all goes to plan without any hitches. Actually, house moving is in the top 3 most stressful things you do in your life, apparently. The other two are getting hitched and watching Engerrrrrrr...land in major footy tournaments :) 
    Posted by MAXALLY
    Is that watching England on the BBC or on ITV?  I have my own opinions on that matter, and I have a feeling they will appear in a report very soon.  Both have their plus points.  Both, in my opinion, have huge minus points to their coverage.

    Thanks for your good wishes on the move, it's this week.  I've been living out of boxes for a fortnight now, that's why I haven't changed my underwear.  Well it's one of the reasons.....
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    *For Fantasy Football people, some people are marking one of Mandzukic's goals as a Given OG.  I think they are wrong as the ball was heading into the net off of the post anyway but check your Fantasy Football listings for that ruling. Posted by TommyD
     
    Still lurking and enjoying the blogs Tommy, nice work. As for Euro2012, I've found this first round of games very entertaining, it's got the makings of the best international tournament in years, putting aside whatever England might do. I fancy we could actually have a good run, though to watch, maybe not as pleasing on the eye as most other teams, a bit like my beloved Stoke City! As for your Mandzukic / Given opinion, I have the opposite view, where I was thinking how could anyone consider giving a goal to Mandzukic for a an attempt that was not on target? Without the intervention of Given the ball was obviously destined to roll along the goal line, hit the other post and be cleared to safety by an Irish defender ;)
    Posted by TheDart
    Cheers for the comments Darty :)

    On the goal/own goal, I disagree it was hitting the other post and coming out.  My reaction when you had that side on camera shot was that the ball was angling in and if there was nothing to inhibit it, the ball would have hit the inside netting on the other side of the goal.  My only concession is that the ball would have hit the goal line on the way (2/3 over it IMO but still not in yet) and if there was an immense amount of side spin then it may have spun onto the post.  I just don't think the ball would have that much spin though in that spot.

    It'll be interesting to see that angle again, I was sure at the time but as always ready to be proved wrong.
  • edited June 2012
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary.:
    In Response to Re: Many Rivers To Cross. A Diary. : Cheers for the comments Darty :) On the goal/own goal, I disagree it was hitting the other post and coming out.  My reaction when you had that side on camera shot was that the ball was angling in and if there was nothing to inhibit it, the ball would have hit the inside netting on the other side of the goal.  My only concession is that the ball would have hit the goal line on the way (2/3 over it IMO but still not in yet) and if there was an immense amount of side spin then it may have spun onto the post.  I just don't think the ball would have that much spin though in that spot. It'll be interesting to see that angle again, I was sure at the time but as always ready to be proved wrong.
    Posted by TommyD
    As we agree to disagree, I guess it would be somewhat underhand to bring up that you felt the Portugal effort that hit the bar and came down on the line was initially in, so I won't mention that ;

    You haven't got Shay Given in your fantasy team by any chance?
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