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Can a chicken go pro?

edited December 2014 in Poker Chat
Great read, noticed you in a few tournaments when i have looked at whose been up top. Looking foward to keeping up to date with this, so have you quit your job? and what was the inspiration for the name lol? I play mainly HUsngs but in the future want to develop my mtt game, what would you reccomend? you said about tution and reading, what would you say was most important, any particular resources yout hink really stepped your game up did you use pay sites to improve your game, get specific coaching from players etc? hope you dont mind all the questions, good luck with it all.
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Comments

  • edited November 2013

    Hi All, 

     

    thought I would jump on the band wagon and do a diary of my own. My main goal from the diary is to set some targets and focus on them instead of floating through my poker life.

     

    Background:

    -I'm a 27 yr old **Edit** just realised I'm 28...lol ** IT professional, and I've been pretty much obsessed with poker for the last 3 yrs or so. It started off with the occasional home game,then I fluttered with online play for a bit, and did rubbish. I was rubbish, so i guess thats to be expected. I started to read the odd book or 2 but I was mostly an occasional, recreational player happy to donate my £50-£200 a month. Since then I started going to a pub poker league, and I caught the bug. I wanted to beat everyone else there so I read up alot more, joined poker tutorial sites and really started to work on my game. I also started to play online alot more. Mostly on another site to start with

     

    Close but No Cigar:

    around a yr and a half ago now, my game was coming along nicely, and I was playing pretty good poker. I had managed to build up a bankroll of around $500 from $50 or so mostly playing .10/.25 cash and the occasional MTT SNG during a week off work. I decided I was going to take a shot at the Sunday Million. my first ever, and certainly the biggest online tourney I had ever played. Lets just say I played the nuts, and ran like god, especially at the start of the tourney. (one of the first hands I played was 96s, vs 77 and 88... flop was 5,7,8!!). Anyway, I ended busting in 60th (out of 7000+) or something like that. gutting, but still a $2k score!

     

    Its fair to say I had no BRM concerns at that time... my average buy in was probably around $100 after that, and for a while it worked. the very next day I final tabled a $109 tourney for another $1k, + couple of days later I won $3k in a $55 tourney. I won nothing for a further week but then the next weekend I had my best and worst online day ever. I final tabled the big 162 and the hot 44 in the same night for a total haul of around $6k! ...thats the good bit :)

     ...the bad bit...my last hand in the big 162 was brutal. With either 5 or 6 left ( i cant remember which), as 2nd in chips, i flopped a FH with 66 on a 363 board. got it all in on the flop vs the chip leader, who turned over AA. needless to say they hit their A on the river. out. ....95% fav to be a massive chip leader with $20k up top. Why now?!! Gutting, but still a good night.

     

    I withdrew a bit of my winnings for some "treats" and left the rest in my account... Anyway, from this point on I obviously thought I was unstoppable and proceeded to lose my entire ~ $6k bankroll playing mostly $100- $215 tourneys.. I thought I was better than I was, and I used no BR management... not a recipe for success! Let me tell you too, the $215 tourneys over there are TOUGH. All tourneys are tougher in fact. and the fields are much bigger, so you can go looong streaks without a decent win, even if you are a top player. 

     

    New beginnings:

    I had started to play a bit on SKY after a friend convinced me the tournaments were good. for a while, I played a bit of both sites but nothing like the volume I was doing before. When playing one night on sky I noticed there was an SPT in Luton. £110 entry. I decided at the last minute to come along and buy in direct if I could. Luckily we were early cos I think I got seat 199 and there was a 200 player cap! I won said SPT for £5600. BOOM! my biggest win ever at the time and it was enough to reignite the poker fire in my belly.

     

    I started to grind online again tourneys again more heavily, but still wasnt having the success I was looking for. I decided my BRM was terrible, every time I built up a decent roll i'd get tempted by the bigger buy in tourneys and huuge prise pools and played too big. So I decided to change my main site to SKY, as the tourneys are smaller, the max buy in is generally £100 (and not that often). Less varience, less temptation and softer tournies.  In the mean time, I'd also binked another Live Tourney for £7k at DTD in February, so I deposited a chunk of that into SKY and started grinding there. this was in March/April this year. Anyway, a very nice website has kindly kept track of my results since April...

     

     

          profit

    number of games

    April

    4119.95

    188

    May

    -520.04

    77

    June

    1974.37

    114

    July

    151.02

    231

    August

    7370.78

    431

    September

    2353.69

    217

    October

    971.83

    184

    November

    36.54

    121

     

    I couldn't possibly remember all the good and bad that happened during this time, but my highlights are definately winning the PRIMO and final tabling 2 UKOPS main events 2 nights in a row (last UKOPS). the worst parts were the inevitable downswings. I've had 2 fairly major ones during my time on sky both lasting around 150 games and dropping 80-100buy ins. I know exactly how Lambert180 felt last month!

     

    November so far:

    Didnt get off to the best of starts with a £500/600 mini downswing. nothing in particular i can think of that stands out, but I just wasnt running well at the right times I guess. That has since changed in the last couple of days because I've won 4 tourneys and final tabled another 2. all unfortunately in the smaller tourneys - the main and big BH's (£55) havent been kind to me in November so far. The 4 I won were a £20BH and £10 400Gtd BH on Tuesday, then the £20 deepstack and the £11 turbo on Wednesday.

     

    GOALS

     

    • Volume: get priority membership/ play 500 tourneys a month.
     I plan to do this by:

     

           - playing every timed tourney between 7pm and 11:15pm

           - playing every tourney between 7pm and 10:30pm with a £10+ buy in

           - play some satelites (semi finals for £55+ buy in tourneys mostly)

           - Im not sure if this is even possible with the number of tourneys available.  I refuse to play the £5 BHs while the rake is 15%

     

    • Profit: Earn enough (on average) to pay myself £1500 a month - so £3k in profit by the new yr.
    • Learning: identify weaknesses in my game and remove them
    • Live: qualify for the UKPC
    • Leaderboard: improve on my current rank of 5th on sharkscope. beat stayorgo (currently 4th i believe. I know stayorgo, he is a friend of mine). 

     


    As well as meeting those goals for sky, I will be trying to build up a BR on another site by playing $3.50 6Max SNG's to start with. My goal by the new year is to be $500 in profit on that site. 

     ---BTW - this extra rake could be yours SKY if you reduce the rake on your £5 BHs to 10% :)


    I have a very limited BR on the other site - I will be starting with just $7 and a few points - I'm stubborn and don't want to deposit. again. So if the first couple of SNG's dont go well, I'll have to resort to points. Because of this, I will play 6max regular speed STT's to reduce variance a little and maximise my edge (if I have one).


    I'll try to update regularly, if I dont, its probably because its not going well!


  • edited November 2013

    ok... so my first nights play (was written last night)


    8543781SkyPoker11/07/2013 11:15 PM £20 + £27/28
    £15
    8543777SkyPoker11/07/2013 11:00 PM £10 + £131/115
    -£7.25
    8543651SkyPoker11/07/2013 10:30 PM £50 + £524/36
    -£55
    8543185SkyPoker11/07/2013 10:15 PM £20 + £248/59
    -£22
    8543617SkyPoker11/07/2013 10:00 PMNL Hold'em £10 + £124/51
    -£11
    8542637SkyPoker11/07/2013 09:30 PM £10 + £149/272
    -£11
    8543642SkyPoker11/07/2013 09:20 PM £5 + £0.516/101
    £6.65
    8540593SkyPoker11/07/2013 09:15 PM £48 + £49/47
    £188
    8542509SkyPoker11/07/2013 09:00 PM £50 + £525/90
    -£17.5
    8543584SkyPoker11/07/2013 08:40 PM £5 + £0.52/34
    £13
    8543457SkyPoker11/07/2013 08:30 PM £5 + £0.5587/637
    -£5.5
    8543553SkyPoker11/07/2013 08:20 PM £5 + £0.518/90
    £6.87
    8543718SkyPoker11/07/2013 08:15 PM £10 + £120/102
    -£11
    8533567SkyPoker11/07/2013 08:00 PM £30 + £3165/451
    -£33
    8542155SkyPoker11/07/2013 07:45 PM £10 + £115/69
    -£11
    8542945SkyPoker11/07/2013 07:30 PMNL Hold'em £20 + £225/38
    -£22
    8540594SkyPoker11/07/2013 07:15 PM £10.4 + £1.16/86
    £40.5
     Overall not the best of nights, but not disastrous either. I had someone round to watch me play (they wanted to see how I play for some reason), and I was a bit distracted so I missed some spots and probably made some plays when I shouldn't. also didn't run particularly well in key pots. on the + side, the timed tourneys seemed to go well - I cashed in every one i played! - and so did the satelites to the UKPC

    Although if you count entry to the £240 UKPC final I would be in profit for today, since that money isn't in my account, I wont be counting it.

    I got get my C4P from october paid into my account too today. I didnt play enough last month for a mixture of reasons, so I didnt even get to 5000 points. my C4P payment was £59.70



     

    • -Volume: 121 + 17 = 138
    • -Profit: £36.54 + 59.70 - 176.23 = -79.99
    • -Learning: Blind/Button play. I feel like i am using guesswork too much, in blind vs button battles... and since they are a big part of the game I decided to work on this area first...So i found a 5 x 1 hr video series that goes into the theory in great detail! I watched half of the first hour last night - after that my concentration was wavering and I found myself staring at the screen with no idea what the guy was talking about and having to rewind to the last bit I could remember. 
    • -Live: qualified for the £240 final UKCP sat. total spent so far: ~£65

     

     

     

    other site:

    in the 6max SNG's i managed to cash 1 of my first 2 luckily, a 2nd place, on my 3rd I got a 1st place, which gave me a bit of breathing room! I'd now have to go on a massive 5.5 buy in downswing to go broke. never gonna happen. lol.

     

    • games: 9
    • 1st's : 2
    • 2nd's: 3
    • Profit: 12.63
    • BR:  19.63
    • ROI for the night: 40%
    • ROI total: 40%

     

     

     

     

  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    Great read, noticed you in a few tournaments when i have looked at whose been up top. Looking foward to keeping up to date with this, so have you quit your job? and what was the inspiration for the name lol? I play mainly HUsngs but in the future want to develop my mtt game, what would you reccomend? you said about tution and reading, what would you say was most important, any particular resources yout hink really stepped your game up did you use pay sites to improve your game, get specific coaching from players etc? hope you dont mind all the questions, good luck with it all.
    Posted by benc


    Great read - Thanks! first time I have tried a blog type thing...so feedback is welcome!

     so have you quit your job?  - not yet. I'm moving an hour away from it though, so I would like to!

     inspiration for the name lol - silly really, as the source of many nicknames are... it started at the local pub where I was playing poker in the poker league... alot of times I would order a BBQ Chicken and Bacon Melt. When it got delivered to the table the barman would shout out "chicken Melt?!" and I would stick my hand up. so people started callin me it. lol.

    in the future want to develop my mtt game, what would you reccomend? - it really depends on what level you are at already.... books are generally good for basic info, then when you feel like you have already read everything in the book from other books you probably want to look into tutorial websites and/or coaching as well as using forums. If you are interested ( i didnt include it in my original post) I am considering starting coaching too, and I'm looking for some ginuea pigs :)  ...probably 1 lesson free then £20 per hour afterwards to begin with. PM if you are interested.

    any particular resources yout hink really stepped your game up did you use pay sites to improve your game
    books: raisers edge, little gold book
    website: cardrunners ($30 a month)
    app: insta poker (free, but with paid "lessons")
    talking poker with good (preferably better) players

    I havent had any formal coaching, but it is something I am looking into.




  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    Totally no doubts whatsoever you will make a killing at the game mate Played you a few times and your 100% def one of the best ive played on here so far GL
    Posted by Diminuendo
    BIG +1
    Chicknmelt is a sick player and clashed with him many a times and is defo in the top 5 mtt players on site IMO
    He will defiantly achieve these targets!
    Gl sir
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    Totally no doubts whatsoever you will make a killing at the game mate Played you a few times and your 100% def one of the best ive played on here so far GL
    Posted by Diminuendo
    +1. 

    Always seem to see your name on the tournament results thread, and watched you close it out at Luton last year.

    All the best. Just be nice to me when we share tables :)
  • edited November 2013
    Thanks for the reply, i have an ok knowledge of the game made money from husngs over a large sample but need to build a roll again before i can think about entering alot of mtts or getting coaching. I used to withdraw all my profit because i knew nout about brm etc , then when i learned a bit more i  built a decentish roll but then withdrew it all and spent it on holiday etc when i finished uni this summer and lost a bit of motivation for the game , but got it back now so got a long grind ahead to build again! lol Good luck will keep an eye out on the big mtts in next few weeks.
  • edited November 2013
    Looks like this is gonna be a great read, will be watching with interest. 

    I've noticed your name cropping up very regularly when posting the tournament results, I'd say you have a great chance of making your target profit if you can maintain the volume. Good luck
  • edited November 2013
    "can a chicken turn pro?"  
    I'm guessing yes, unless he keels over with a myoCARDial infarction first from all the chickenmelts!   ;-)  Great read..Will watch with interest!
  • edited November 2013
    I have no doubts whatsoever, when I beat u heads up in the open i considerd that to be 1 of my best moments in poker, in my eyes you r deffo in the top 3 maybe even the top 2 mtts players on the site, hope u do it mate glglg
  • edited November 2013
    that wernt meant as a rub downs there btw mate, I just think ur a top top player
  • edited November 2013
    no chickens cant play poker unless ya dr dolittle :)
  • edited November 2013
    Can the chicken turn pro?
    If the chicken is doing ok as a rec player, why cross the road. GL

    regards Alan
  • edited November 2013
    Be a great read.

    With regards to going 'pro'.  Don't do it.  Nothing against you or your ability.  Just everything gets a lot lot harder when you have to grind to pay the bills!

    Keeo doing what your doing and crushing it on the side and as you move up look to sat into some bigger stuff both live and online.  

    GL and I'll keep an eye on this thread with interest!
  • edited November 2013
    best of luck 
  • edited November 2013
    Not that you need it buy the sounds of some of the above posts but GL

    Are you sure you have to play all the evening timed tournies? They seem to be getting harder as it is

    I was wondering what tactics you would suggest for the 15 min ones?

    GL

    Paul
  • edited November 2013
    GL mate great read. Personally I would recommend the lifestyle you are currently living with two incomes. It is going to be pretty difficult to make up that extra income sacrificed by quitting your job playing most of your poker in Sky MTTs, given the amount you already win. I have no other source of income other than poker myself, but have no responsibilities (such as bills ect) and find it really controls my mood. I could not begin to imagine what it would be like knowing you have to make X amount of money before you can enjoy the fruits of your success. I would strongly suggest incorporating cash games into your grind however if you do chose to go full time as there's just more money in them in my opinion (unless your luckboxing big live events ;)). 
  • edited November 2013
    fri 8th Nov

    Terrible start tonight! within minutes I had busted from 3 or 4 tourneys- bluffing in the complete wrong spots and getting it in behind… like really badly too. If i saw someone else making the same moves I would happily label them a fish! particularly poor were the £22 deepstack and the big BH :(

    other than the brain freeze first hour or so then a couple more in the big BH I'm pretty happy with how I played in the rest, although possibly could have done with being a bit more aggressive when short at times.

    I finished the night about £80 down - which was actually pretty good considering the start.

    SNGs went well, playing 16 and winning $12

    saturday 9th nov

    Saturday didn't start great either on sky, and it looked like it was going to be a heavy loss. again I didn't play well in the Big BH, and couldn't get anything going in the main either.

    I also had some problems with the sky sw freezing, probably 10 times throughout my night. (the other site i was playing had no problems at all)… twice when I had QQ! once after I flopped top set and called cbet in the big £55 BH leaving myself 2x pot behind - solack - you got off light!
    on the plus side, I did somehow manage to win a 3 way all in outright with K high no kicker in the 1.5k speed bh! only to later stone bubble it running TT into QQ in a Blind v Blind confrontation. could have really done with that cash too - I ended £350 down for the night, and in hindsight, I think calling a shove with TT, even in BvB was a mistake due to ICM… lets take a look...

    ----------
    blinds 800/1600,  effective stacks 21800, on the bubble (5/6 paid)
    I min r from the SB to 3200 and the BB shoved for more chips than me… what is the correct move - fold or call? fold and leave myself 18.6k or call and be out or have 43.6k?

    I'll start off by calculating my ICM values fro the call, if I win and lose. I estimated the amount I would receive in bounties and added them to the prizes for each position.
    ICM if i win - £344
    ICM if I lose - £60 (bounties)

    next I need to guess the range villain is shoving with… since he had more chips than me it should be reasonably wide in an attempt to own the bubble. I don't remember the villain being too active though.. so lets say he is shoving with Axs, A6+, 44+, KQ+, KJs… which gives TT around 63% equity.

    so, 
    63% x £344 (ICM if I win) = 216.72
    37% x £60 (ICM if I lose) = 22.2

    A call therefor gives me £238.92 ICM value… lets look at the fold..

    100% x £234.6 (ICM value if I fold)

    so, according to ICM, if my push ranges for the villain are accurate, then the call was correct (+£4). Of course my shove ranges may be wrong, but it was a close one, and a bit of a brutal spot. should I have avoided it by open shoving??

    ------------------
    Although i only expect to profit roughly 1 day in 3, todays loss was bad one.

    I think I will cap try to stay between 6-9 tables tomorrow - I was playing up to 14 today at one point and i think it effected my decision making in the MTTs, SNGs seemed to be fine though

    the SNGs have been going very well in fact - I won 3 of my first 4 today! because they were so going well, I decided to take a few shots at MTTs and played in a $11 sunday million sat, the big 11, a 100 point free roll and a £3.30 MTT. no cashed to speak of except I only went and binked a$215 sunday million seat! I was good though and unregistered - with the plan of moving up to $7 SNG's for 10 buy ins. the problem with that was there was no volume!…it seams everyone wants to play turbos. I've tried turbo SNGs before, and i don't particularly like them. so instead, with a $250 BR i decided $75 would be available to take a shot at the $15 and $7 SNGs… I played 3 x $15 and 3x $7 SNGs and won 2 x $15 and 1 x $7  to finish with a BR of $317.08 :)

    hopefully I can stick with playing $7 and $15 SNGs from now on - I will drop back down to $3.5 SNGs if i get to $175 (50 BI)

    my $3.5 SNG stats were:
    Games: 48
    Profit: 57
    ROI: 34%


    I'm going to be starting my Sunday grind in a few hours… which me luck!

  • edited November 2013
    thanks for all the GL posts bt the way :)


  • edited November 2013
    Hi Chick,
    I shared a table with you for quite a while in the main on fri nite.  I noticed a few times you seemed to run out of time when it was your turn to act.  It might have been a deliberate ploy? Possibly playing too many tables? NOT a criticism BTW, just thought I'd mention it.

    Enjoying the read & gl.

  • edited November 2013
    have you gone pro or deciding whether to or not..? good luck either way -

    your ICM calcs are jus EV clacs are they not..? ICM would need to take into account your equity share in the whole prizepool against the stack sizes for each remaining player.. not just the two in the hand- if the probablity of you winning the hand is 60% but your equity in 1st or 2nd place is much higher then the call is not that great due to ICM- 

    and yea, id be shoving here pre anyway- you will take out a ton more hands that u are 50/50 (when villain jams KQ/JQ/ etc etc that he may not call if you jam yourself..

    anyway GLGLGL
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    have you gone pro or deciding whether to or not..? good luck either way - your ICM calcs are jus EV clacs are they not..? ICM would need to take into account your equity share in the whole prizepool against the stack sizes for each remaining player.. not just the two in the hand- if the probablity of you winning the hand is 60% but your equity in 1st or 2nd place is much higher then the call is not that great due to ICM-  and yea, id be shoving here pre anyway- you will take out a ton more hands that u are 50/50 (when villain jams KQ/JQ/ etc etc that he may not call if you jam yourself.. anyway GLGLGL
    Posted by LnarinOO
    Hi larin, 

    The calcs were ICM i think...i just didnt explain them very clearly... so the first 2 calulations for if I called were

    chance of winning x ICM value if I win = 216.72
    chance of losing x ICM value if i lose = £22.2

    The iCM values were calculated by entering peoples chip stacks and the estimated prizes (with bounties) on http://www.icmpoker.com/Calculator.aspx

    Yes, your right, an open shove owuld fold out lots of hands with decent equity vs me... but it also folds out all/ most the hands I dominate, for example 44-99 and A2-A9... Im not sure hwich is the most + ev yet, anyone want to try to work it out?? I might if I get time later.
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    Hi Chick, I shared a table with you for quite a while in the main on fri nite.  I noticed a few times you seemed to run out of time when it was your turn to act.  It might have been a deliberate ploy? Possibly playing too many tables?  NOT a criticism BTW, just thought I'd mention it. Enjoying the read & gl.
    Posted by Glenelg
    yes, your right, that was less to do with the number of tables and more to do witht he sw crashing to be honest. althought the number of tables didnt help. I can normally cope with 9-12 without sitting out much.

    a typical crash situation would be software slows down and my actions are delayed, sometimes not acting in time (so I might click call with 10 seconds remaining and the call wouldnt be actioned in time and I would sit out) after a bit of this, I would bet a connection error (the on where you can click reconnect). after a few attempts at reconnecting, the sw would either reconnect properly or hang completely. after a hang it was generally 2-3 minutes before the sw was restarted, all the tables had reappeared again, the tables had been put back in their places and I was sat back in! a painful experience when it happens 10 times a night or more!
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro? : yes, your right, that was less to do with the number of tables and more to do witht he sw crashing to be honest. 
    Posted by chicknMelt
    ok,  did wonder if it mite have been sw related. gl
  • edited November 2013
    oh so the £344 is you equity in 1st place??   yea im probs jus confused by the way its been written.. i obv dont know stack sizes or payout structure (which would be hard to work out ICM, given that you could only knock 1 player out HU but do not get any other bounties)

    with stack sizes im open jamming knowing they shouldnt be folding the lower pairs- a chunk of Ax where were 70/30 and obvs the usual flips - id want to fold out all the other flips so im a head of the range 
  • edited November 2013
    Sunday 10th Nov

    feel more focussed today - lets hope its reflected in the results - they have been pretty bad in November so far!

    started off pretty decent - won a flip or 2 which was nice. 

    8pm - time for the primo... erm, I massively tilted myself with my primo performance. it was pretty horrible… I'm not sure I even lasted the first level. - I was 4th out i think! how embarassing! :-l

    my first + of the night was qualifying for the £240 UKPC seat again, but this time the cash went into my account because I already had a seat :)  at the time of writing this I can't lose more than £100ish today…which takes the pressure off a bit. 

    by 9pm i was just paying 6 tables - it makes a huge difference! the amount of spots i was missing was just too much yesterday. for example, I 4bet light today because an agro player 3bet a loose opener and a loose passive caller when he was on the button… he was obv squeezing and I would have missed that last night.

    I came agonisingly close to a seat in the £1100 UKPC, finishing 13th when 9 got a seat. I was sitting pretty until when a turned set got beat by a rivered straight, then I fell into tommy D's trap, shoving my last 10bb into his QQ in the blinds. I'm pretty certain I shouldn't have shoved then, but he played it well setting the trap when he knew I was probably tilted and I walked right into it.

    I finished around £150 up tonight after a 2nd place in the £22 deepstack, winning the cash for a seat in the UKPC sat final, and a nice cash in the £22 timed. reasonably happy with tonight, but it could have been better - a lapse in concentration/tilt cost me a decent chance at the UKPC seat. cashes in "the big ones" - the main, big BH and speed BH - also are still avoiding me.

    mean while, on the other site I started off by playing some $15 and $7 SNGs, and won more than my fair share.  I can only remember being unhappy with my play once or twice, which is good, but I didn't play many because I was around my table limit from sky games a lot of the time after about 7. I did notice though that at the $15 SNGs probably at least half of the players on each table seem to be regs, and only 1, or 2 fish if your lucky… I seem to have been running well in them so far though, so lets hope it continues and its not just the good side of variance! I'm sure most of the regs have alot better SNG stragegies than I do... 

    thanks to the SNGs I finished about $30 up, bringing my BR to $346.55. Well on my way to the $500 goal, so instead of by the new year, I want to meet it by the end of the month.
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    oh so the £344 is you equity in 1st place??   yea im probs jus confused by the way its been written.. i obv dont know stack sizes or payout structure (which would be hard to work out ICM, given that you could only knock 1 player out HU but do not get any other bounties) with stack sizes im open jamming knowing they shouldnt be folding the lower pairs- a chunk of Ax where were 70/30 and obvs the usual flips - id want to fold out all the other flips so im a head of the range 
    Posted by LnarinOO
    £344 is my tournament equity according to ICM if I won the all in, 1st place was more than that. 

    yeah, I think especially because it was a bubble situation i should have open shoved. do you think its an open shove in normal play too?
  • edited November 2013
    yea im not that greatest tourney player but i open jam a certain range with your stack size - 10's fall int to this for me..

    your jus workin out your equity in the hand vs the villans range- (it is a call BTW)

    when your working out your ICM you need to know

    • our current stack size
    • everyone else stack size
    • amount of money in prizepool for 1st then 2nd then 3rd and so on  (more difficult as you dont know how many bounties you may get..

    then you can figure out how much your stack sizes means (in ICM terms), how much of the prizepool is yours against the given range- and whether the probabilty you will win vs the equity you have is enough to show profit.
    theres no point doing ICM vs one person to find out whether you should call or not beacuse it takes away the whole point of working out your chip value in the tourney- this is because on average you may be in a better position to win 3rd place money or 2nd place money etc - this is what ICM tells us...




  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    yea im not that greatest tourney player but i open jam a certain range with your stack size - 10's fall int to this for me.. your jus workin out your equity in the hand vs the villans range- (it is a call BTW) when your working out your ICM you need to know our current stack size everyone else stack size amount of money in prizepool for 1st then 2nd then 3rd and so on  (more difficult as you dont know how many bounties you may get.. then you can figure out how much your stack sizes means (in ICM terms), how much of the prizepool is yours against the given range- and whether the probabilty you will win vs the equity you have is enough to show profit. theres no point doing ICM vs one person to find out whether you should call or not beacuse it takes away the whole point of working out your chip value in the tourney- this is because on average you may be in a better position to win 3rd place money or 2nd place money etc - this is what ICM tells us...
    Posted by LnarinOO
    I think we are both saying the same thing - I just dont seem to be very good at telling you lol

    I did put everyones stacks into an ICM calculator as well as the prizes - it only gives an indication because as you say the prizes had to be guessed, and tbh I guessed the chip stacks too. think they were roughly right though.
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    I came agonisingly close to a seat in the £1100 UKPC, finishing 13th when 9 got a seat. I was sitting pretty until when a turned set got beat by a rivered straight, then I fell into tommy D's trap, shoving my last 10bb into his QQ in the blinds. I'm pretty certain I shouldn't have shoved then, but he played it well setting the trap when he knew I was probably tilted and I walked right into it.Posted by chicknMelt
    Very unlucky in the Sat Melt.  Yes you've already guessed it but I played my part in that (opening from 10bb B On B rather than just shoving) purely on the basis of that previous brutal hand for you.  Sorry to be ruthless but after I HHed the holdings from that hand I thought you wouldn't need much encouragement to shove the very next hand (because I know if I was in your seat I would be looking to do the same in that moment after that beat).

    Very good diary by the way and I'm sure you'll bink a seat for the UKPC very soon.
  • edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro?:
    In Response to Re: Can a chicken turn pro? : Very unlucky in the Sat Melt.  Yes you've already guessed it but I played my part in that (opening from 10bb B On B rather than just shoving) purely on the basis of that previous brutal hand for you.  Sorry to be ruthless but after I HHed the holdings from that hand I thought you wouldn't need much encouragement to shove the very next hand (because I know if I was in your seat I would be looking to do the same in that moment after that beat). Very good diary by the way and I'm sure you'll bink a seat for the UKPC very soon.
    Posted by TommyD
    I wouldn't expect anything else from you Tommy! If I had the brains and thought of it too I would have done exactly the same to you.

    Yeah i think even as I was clicking the all in button I was already thinkin "what am I doing?!" well played for taking the time to notice  - I thought you might have and gave you credit for it - can't imagine you opening/folding from 10bb ever really. which I suppose makes my shove even worse.

    at the time, after the beat with the set, I was pretty pleased with myself for managing to "just call" on the river thinking "I'm almost certainly ahead, but just incase i'm not I'll just call because the amount of chips I would have should be enough to see me through comfortably, and if I'm wrong I still have 10bb" to go from that level of thinking to a brainless shove the very next hand just goes to show there is still some work to do in the tilt department!

    I look forward to getting my own back sometime very soon :)
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